Looking for imput on the A2 as an all aroundlight for EDC.

As I said about a similar post on EDC Forums, I wanted to ask this question here, too, since I figured folks here would be slightly more realistic about real world EDC needs.

"I thought about candlepower forums, but was afraid that by the time I was done, I'd spend half that national debt and end up with a rechargable light saber... Sure it's sharp, but U can't see the black dog on the front porch with it..."

Any comments or suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

The A2 is a very nice and versatile light. I'm a big fan of variable output lights. The A2 has a beam nearly as good as a SF E2e on high, and the utility of a long lasting, lower output flood.

I enjoyed mine until my mom borrowed mine and somehow neglected to return it! :-)

-john

The A2 is an incredible light, and well worth the money. It is one of my three EDCs that I rotate depending on the activities of the day. The others are G2 for rough work, and E1L for the office. If I could have only one light, it would be the A2.

I think the Surefire L2 is the best all around flashlight, especially for EDC use, I plan on getting one once I'm slightly less poor(i.e. making more than minimum wage). It uses a regulated LED and has variable output, either 15 or 100 lumens, with runtimes of 18 hours and 1 hour respectively. Long battery life for survival use and very very bright mode for signalling or tactical use. Seems lke the most useful combination to me.

Hi Corpsman, good timing on your post because after a lot of analysis & shopping around I recently got an A2.

Short version: I believe it is the finest handheld light currently available, as long as you're willing to pay the admittedly high price. Until I got the A2 I EDC'd an E2e for about 5 years plus I carry a G2 on EMS duty, so I do have something to compare with the A2 regarding bright, pocketable flashlights.

Why I love the A2:

1. Digital regulation of the incandescent beam gives you maximum constant brightness from the batteries. Many people don't realize that an unregulated light beam is great for the first 5-10 minutes of use then turns yellow and dim.

2. Two stages of illumination in the same tool yields a level of convenience and utility that is hard to appreciate until you use it. The LEDs (mine are white) are great for the close range stuff but when you need real firepower BAM! you've got the regulated incandescent right there in the same tool. You have to remember that the typical use of this light is on "low beam" with occasional bursts in "high beam" mode, even in SAR functions. Therefore the 60 minute run time for high beam yields a lot more functionality in the field than just 60 minutes.

3. The A2 is perfect for EDC in a pants pocket. It is slightly larger than the E2e but I have no problem carrying the A2 in my left front pocket, using the clip. This frees up precious space on the bat belt. The A2 is also set up for (and ships with) lanyard use for ultimate retention.

4. Even after the batteries can no longer support the regulated incandescent beam, you still get hours of useful light from the LEDs.

5. The build quality of the A2 is extremely good.

6. The A2 is waterproof, including the tailcap switch.

7. The tailcap can be rotated to "lockout" position for secure storage in your bag or backpack, no worries about it turning on accidentally. The switch can then be rotated to allow LEDs only (momentary), then LEDs + incandescent (momentary), then LEDs + incandescent (constant on). It is a well thought out and well executed, usable design.

8. The A2's incandescent beam brightness is very conservatively rated by SureFire at 50 lumens but independent testing by acknowledged experts at CandlePower Forums yields a brightness of 75-80 lumens.

9. My testing shows that the A2's beam is more focused and has more concentrated throw than an E2e on fresh batteries, while still providing plenty of sidespill for area illumination. This means that the A2 has more oomph for signalling and "searchlight" functions... and the regulation keeps it that way long after other hi-intensity lights go yellow and dim. This is important because if you have an unregulated light for emergency use, you become reticent to use it day-to-day because you must have fresh batteries to get the good brightness out of it in an emergency. Not so with the A2.

10. The A2's lithium batteries also work in my rescue laser flare that is so highly regarded by Doug Ritter. The rescue laser flare plus the A2 yields a formidable pair of tools for nighttime signaling.

11. If you have the training to utilize a high intensity light for tactical/self-defense applications, the A2 provides all the features you need for those applications.

12. The A2 provides all this utility in a small and lightweight package. At 5-1/2" long and 4oz of weight, the function to weight ratio is very high. I say this as an avid ultralight hiker who judges all my gear in light of its weight and bulk.

13. The A2 has circuitry that "soft starts" the incandescent beam. This slightly slows down the inrush of current to the filament, significantly decreasing the risk of blowing the bulb. While LEDs have the advantage in emitter longevity, the A2 design vastly improves on incandescent reliability.

14. Finally, I believe the A2 to be an exemplary tool for preparedness & survival minded folk because it is useful and practical on an everyday basis, yet it offers very significant nighttime signaling & search capabilities in emergencies. Of the other tools we carry only a knife has similar utility in both mundane and extreme situations.

See this link for an extremely detailed and well-informed explanation of the technical reasons why the A2 is truly a unique light.

SureFire's MSRP of $195 is admittedly very high. They have also instituted a policy with their dealers of enforcing that MSRP. However if you contact me directly I can offer you some help with that issue. I'm not selling anything, I just know good places to shop.

By the way, did I mention that the A2's incandescent beam is regulated...? <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Drawback for the A2 is it's fairly easy to burn out the main bulb. Also, not very good runtime on primary level. I have the L2 and think it's a better choice. The L1 isn't a bad choice either, low will give you long long runtime without blowing your night vision.

Seriously, look around candlepower forums (in the LED forum particularly) and hold on to your wallet. I think there are better choices out there (and I do have several Surefires). I have an HDS U60 that is my favorite. Has 3 main light levels: low low (for night adjusted eyes), primary, and burn your eyes out burst. It uses one CR-123 lithium battery (same batteries Surefire uses) and will run unbelievably long between changes. It is also much smaller than most of the Surefires and is built like a freaking tank. HDS has merged with Novatek and will have a new line of lights out in a month or so. (they have their own column under "manufactures" at candlepower.)

LEDs definitely rule, much more effecient than incandesant. Hold off for a month or two if possible, several manufactures are releasing new models (including Surefire) that use the new Cree LED emitters. More light and longer runtime out of the same battery.

Glock - A-Roo

It was that post in CPF that really made my interst in the A2 return full blown.

Nice review BTW.

I have REALLY looked closely at the Gladius, L2 and U2, but really believe that that the incans are much better performers in the outdoors.

Additionally, I have red/green colorblindness, and the incan, at least in my case, sure seems to makes things show up much more clearly in relief.

Very true. While I love the latest LED lights as much as anyone, currently there simply is no LED on the market that can provide the throw and color rendition of an incan for the same weight/bulk. The A2's incan beam is whiter and has much more throw than any LED of the same package size. I feel this "punching power" is worth having over the LED designs.

Have a look at these beam shots. I think they really tell the tale:

A2 at 66 feet:


L2 at 66 feet:


I was confused by the statement above that the A2 has compared to the HDS U60. The A2 is conservatively rated for what has been measured at 75-80 lumens for 50 to 60 minutes, while the HDS website says that the HDS U60 puts out 60 lumens for 20 minutes. However I am impressed at how you can program the HDS in so many ways. That would be very useful.

Ah, if color recognition is an important factor for you, then an incandescent light like the A2 sounds like a good choice. Although LED's can emit "white" light, they are all deficient in parts of the color spectrum compared to incandescents.

Definitely, the L2 is flood and not a thrower.

When I said the runtime is not real good on primary I probably should have said high beam. The LEDs get used most often, so that would probably be the primary.

My HDS (U60XR) gets better than 45 minutes on high (it was the first thing I tested when I got it) and that's with one battery, then it stepped down to next level and ran for 2 1/2 hours, stepped down again and ran till next morning.

I've got a couple of G2s, a 6P, and a couple of weapon mounted lights. At most, I'll get an hour with one of those and that's using up two batteries. I've also blown out 3 of those incandescant bulbs (p60), 2 of them I dropped while the light was on and poof, another one poofed for no reason I could tell. That's reason enough for me to not have them as my only light.

As for the color rendition, I really can't tell much difference. I actually think the incandescants make things look more yellow than they really are. Also, for some strange reason, it seems like animals eyes reflect back brighter with the LEDs.

Surefire really came down heavy on some dealers that were selling under MSRP a year or so ago. That really pissed me off at the time, it put a guy I'd bought from for several years out of the Surefire business. I'm all for competition, it makes everybody stronger in the end, and it's always good for the customer. Having said that, I can't wait to see what they come out with in the new Crees. I hear that the E1L and L1 will be using them. I'll have to get one of them!

When EDCing, how to you carry it? Clipped to the waist of your pants?

It seems kind of big for an EDC, at least to me. Since I carry in my front pocket, I'm limited to a much smaller light - an ARC AAA Premium.

KenK: "When EDCing, how to you carry it? Clipped to the waist of your pants? "

Coat pocket, belt pouch. I'm planning on the A2 for throw and close up in general, but am planning on a Fenix LOPSE AAA for my keychain. This gives me two options with some pretty good overlap.

I was also thinking about a Huntlight FT02 - it uses 1 123 or 2 AA, just for fun...

Right now, I EDC a very old CMG Infinity (original) and a AA Mag with the Niteize, so I have nowhere to go put up... <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Still not bad choices even now, if you're talking about getting stuck someplace very dark. Considering most people don't carry any light sources (unless you count cell phone and MP3 player screens), that's still ahead of the game. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Here is a comparison of my HDS U85 vs on of my SF E2e lights. The color of the photos is a bit off -- the E2e looks somewhat yellow in real life (compared to the U85) where my U85 looks stark white.

The U85 can hold it's own in throw and hotspot with the E2e and has a bit more spill. The beam pattern of the U60 is the same, although not quite as bright.

That said, the very _white_ beam does look different outdoors than the warm beams we have become used to. In the end, I'm not sure if the incandescents are really "better", but more what we are used to. That said, I can certainly see how some would prefer the incandescent.

Interestingly, HDS used to offer what they called guaranteed tint, or "GT". These had beams a bit more on the warm side which might be more acceptable to those who prefer a warmer tone.

In regards to the HDS U60 vs A2 runtimes, this is probably a bit of a case of apples to oranges. The HDS will continue to step down as the batteries run down. Usually you change the batteries because you want to, rather than you have to.

In addition, having the four different levels easily accessible, you tend to only use as much light as you need.

These issues tend to cause the effective runtime of the HDS lights to be very impressive. It's pretty hard to envision totally running out of light with an HDS.

Also the standard HDS battery configuration is 1x123A vs the 2x123A for both the A2 and SF L2. There is a optional 2x123A battery pack for the HDS which increases runtime 3-4x instead of the 2x you might expect. This further induces the impression of seemingly endless runtime.

Personally, I carry my U85 with a prototype 18650 lithium ion rechargeable battery pack (the HDS was designed for lithium ion as well and operates at full capacity in this configuration) using a 2600mah battery. In addition, I carry the 2x123a battery pack with 2x123a cells as backup power.

The gotcha is that HDS merged with a company called NovaTac and are now re-gearing their operations. The HDS lights are not currently in production and are difficult to obtain. This is why I didn't suggest them previously.

It sounds like they will announce their new lights at SHOT in February and a new U85 is likely to be the new backbone of their product line. However, no rumors to when you might be able to get one.

All in all, the U85 with the extended battery packs pretty much ended my quest for the perfect EDC light.

-john

Great post, John. I am very excited to see the new flashlight developments in 2007.

Ahh, John? You forgot your light sabre on the rail there.

I use a John Willis sheath for my A2 and my G2.

I had an A2 in "pilot vison" which was yellow/green. I bought it becasue it was a good deal and wanted to compare it to L2... In my opinion A2 is a waste of money. As a hybrid light it is a good idea but specs are really not that impressive especially on the LED mode (power). Get the L2... Same run time on more powerful setting (better "reach") and more light on lower setting. No chances of light burning out and it is cheaper. Had them both and A2 went to Ebay.