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#286735 - 10/13/17 02:12 AM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: M_a_x]
Mark_R Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 05/29/10
Posts: 841
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: M_a_x

FWIW: When refugees claiming to come from Syria arrived in Germany quite a few had full auto rifles and semi-auto handguns with them. Some of them even carried more than one.


I'm not trying to stir the pot or be offensive. But, I can't find any articles about that. Can you point me toward your source?
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#286739 - 10/13/17 10:12 AM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: Mark_R]
Herman30 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 205
Loc: Finland
Originally Posted By: Mark_R
I'm not trying to stir the pot or be offensive. But, I can't find any articles about that. Can you point me toward your source?

+1. Followed the news about the mass of people traveling on foot through Europe in 2015. Not one of the reporters made any statements about refugees carrying weapons.

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#286743 - 10/13/17 06:57 PM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: burth]
Bingley Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 1307
Were any of the Syrian refugees carrying muzzleloaders?

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#286746 - 10/14/17 06:21 AM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: Mark_R]
M_a_x Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 934
Loc: Germany
The sources are no longer available.
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#286748 - 10/14/17 06:57 AM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: Bingley]
M_a_x Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 934
Loc: Germany
I doubt it. When carrying guns on flight, they might be intended for defense or as barter item. Neither could be consired a particular strength of muzzle loaders.
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#286897 - 10/27/17 10:35 PM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: haertig]
MoBOB Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/07
Posts: 1213
Loc: here
If a BMW is all you own, then it is a survival car. Kinda like my little 2002 Hyundai Accent; not ideal but a survival car all the same.
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#286920 - 10/28/17 05:34 PM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: burth]
Bingley Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 1307
How much are those BMW muzzleloaders?

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#286921 - 10/28/17 05:46 PM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: Bingley]
M_a_x Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 934
Loc: Germany
I hate to disappoint you. BMW did not build muzzleloaders. However they built engines for the BF 109 which was a strap on carrier for breech loading full auto guns. It even came with its own fan. I had the luck to personally know some guys who successfully used it for survival in a SHTF scenario. Those did not wish they had a muzzleloader for that either.
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If it isnīt broken, it doesnīt have enough features yet.

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#286927 - 10/28/17 08:26 PM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: M_a_x]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 5993
Loc: southern Cal
Let's face it - MLs are obsolete. You might as well plan to hand load cartridges for your firearm. You will be particularly limited as to proppelants and primers, but you have the same constraints with muzzle loads (percussion caps or even more finicky flints).
Hand loading, especially straight wall cartridges like 38 Special or 45-70 is quite straightforward, and not all that difficult for something like a 30-06 (if fired in the same weapon).

In effect, you just do your loading beforehand....
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#286928 - 10/29/17 08:21 AM Re: why a muzzleloader or shotgun for survival? [Re: hikermor]
M_a_x Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 934
Loc: Germany
Yes, MLs are basically obsolete. In some European countries they are just easy to obtain and require no registration. They would not be my gun of first choice.
I hand load .44 Rem Mag, .45 Colt, 6.5x55 and 7x64 Brenecke (if I were American that would probably be a 30-06). I agree that the straight wall cases are easy to load and long lasting. Necksizing and annealing makes the 7x64 brass last longer and requires almost no trimming. However I might go for full sizing when I load for a group. That will allow for interchangeable ammo.
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