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#191443 - 12/21/09 02:53 PM Winter Shovel
Outdoor_Quest Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/17/09
Posts: 305
Loc: Central Oregon
I'd appreciate recommendations for a shovel that could double for winter snow camping and Search and Recue. What qualities would you look for?

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#191448 - 12/21/09 03:08 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: Outdoor_Quest]
roberttheiii Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/13/09
Posts: 393
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Not specific to your request, but I assume you've seen this thread? Lots of shovel discussion: http://forums.equipped.org/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=190504#Post190504

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#191449 - 12/21/09 03:09 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: Outdoor_Quest]
RobertRogers Offline
Survivor
Member

Registered: 12/12/06
Posts: 198
Well, I typically use one of my snowshoes as a shovel when making shelters or digging out an area for fires in the snow. This means I do not need to lug the added weight and bulk of a purpose made shovel.
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#191456 - 12/21/09 03:57 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: RobertRogers]
Mark_F Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 714
Loc: Kentucky
I'm not qualified for the Search & Rescue recommendations, but as in the thread posted above by Robert, the CS shovel gets my recommendation (standard disclaimer, no affiliation with CS). It is compact and sturdy, the edges come factory sharpened and can be further sharpened to your liking. Because of the sharpened edges you can use it in a pinch as a hatchet or short machete (obviously not as good as an axe or machete but it will get the job done) and "cuts" into hardened soil with relative ease. I would think it would serve for your other purposes as well. Mine has served me well for the last 15 years give or take and has taken every bit of punishment I have dished out. Remember that it is a compact shovel so the shovel head is relatively small. If you need it for snow removal it will get the job done but it may take a while. Hope this helps.

Edit: +1 on nighthiker's recommendations for snow removal. If that is less of a concern and you need something sturdier, I still recommend the CS.


Edited by Mark_Frantom (12/21/09 04:00 PM)
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#191524 - 12/22/09 09:20 AM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: Outdoor_Quest]
MostlyHarmless Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/03/09
Posts: 982
Loc: Norway
Originally Posted By: Outdoor_Quest
I'd appreciate recommendations for a shovel that could double for winter snow camping and Search and Recue. What qualities would you look for?


Assuming you'd carry the thing in your pack, low weight and low volume while still being sturdy, strong and having big enough of a blade to be an asset. The big outdoors brand seems to have converged on a pretty standard size and function avalanche or snow shovels. Telescoping handle, removable handle (packs smaller), "D" or "T" or "L" handle of your choice. In short, something similar to the telescoping shovel posted by Nighthiker.

I think the size is more or less standardized across different brands because it is a good compromise for most rucksack-carry applications: Not as big as a proper snow shovel, but big enough - and the handle is long enough to be used effectively. (Shorten the handle to work in tight spots). Stick with a quality brand, and you can hardly go wrong!


I won't vouch for the snow claw: I haven't tested it. I can see the concept working for powdery snow (at least assuming you're able to toss the excavated snow down hill). Otherwise I'm not totally convinced - but that opinion ain't worth much (no "dirt time" behind it).

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#191538 - 12/22/09 01:52 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: NightHiker]
Mark_F Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 714
Loc: Kentucky
Originally Posted By: NightHiker
Folding pack shovels like the Cold Steel and the USGI e-tool are fine for smaller tasks or confined spaces like digging around a car tire, putting the finishing touches on a snow cave or digging out a small firebowl but if you want to clear out a tent sized patch of snow or dig out somebody from an avalanche or collapsed snow cave.


For me there's also a weight issue. I don't know about the Cold Steel but I've got a GI e-tool and for use in the snow it really doesn't provide enough capability for the weight.

There are some pieces of gear that I don't mind having an extra capability (like a small folding shovel that is designed to be used as a pick or a hatchet in a pinch) but for something that I may have to rely on to save a life a specific tool is preferable, and to move snow that means a snow shovel.


Totally agreed, Nighthiker. No doubt the Snow Claw or the Traverse would be extremely handy for snow removal. And the CS does add a little extra weight and it doesn't fold up like the GI shovel you refer to. On the other hand, with its sharpened edges and point it will power through any compacted material if that is a concern. I have not had any experience with the avalanche shovels mentioned elsewhere but they look like just a more compact regular snow shovel with a flat leading edge - translation, no point. I have also been reading that the avalanche material tends to get extremely compacted. Sorry to digress and not trying to hi-jack but I was wondering why the avalanche shovels don't have more of a pointed or at least rounded tip on them more useful for breaking up the compacted ice and snow. Am I missing something? Obviously I have had no personal experience with this but I have shoveled a fair amount of snow in my day. Always had to switch from a snow shovel to a pointed shovel for the tough stuff at the end of the driveway. Was just wondering.

Back to the thread, snow removal is not so much of an issue for our area hence the CS. I accept the slight weight disadvantage for the ability to dig up and remove the rock that would otherwise poke me in the side all night long. Could it be we are inadvertenlty pointing Outdoor Quest to the obvious conclusion: there is no one shovel that can do many tasks well but rather many shovels that will do certain tasks very well and others just so-so. Any one pack shovel will be a compromise between its intended purpose (what it does well) and whatever else you use it for (what it does so-so) and any one will have its advantages and disadvantages. To each his own. Sorry, Outdoor Quest, looks like you are gonna have to buy more than one shovel smile
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#191554 - 12/22/09 04:07 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: Mark_F]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
Some models of avalanche shovels do have at least a modified point to break up solidified debris. You are also likely to have ice axes at hand, as well.

People with a lot more snow experience than me recommend an avy shovel as essential gear in steep snow terrain - primarily to use for snow cave excavation and potential rescue, as well as digging down to water and other chores.
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#191564 - 12/22/09 05:18 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: hikermor]
Lono Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 10/19/06
Posts: 1013
Loc: Pacific NW, USA
Originally Posted By: hikermor
People with a lot more snow experience than me recommend an avy shovel as essential gear in steep snow terrain - primarily to use for snow cave excavation and potential rescue, as well as digging down to water and other chores.


An avy shovel, avy beacons, probe poles, and the weekend or more of training in how to use them, and how to evaluate snow conditions. Oh, also having the local avalanche / snow conditions hot line on speed dial, and calling it every time before you go out the door - here in the PNW, home of our famous Cascade Concrete (TM), there are alot of times when conditions demand that you just stay home or avoid the avalanche chute routes. Without the whole package, you're tempting fate.

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#191565 - 12/22/09 05:19 PM Re: Winter Shovel [Re: Lono]
Lono Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 10/19/06
Posts: 1013
Loc: Pacific NW, USA
...and that's an avalanche shovel and beacon and probe poles and training for each person in your party. Gets a little expensive, but at least if you buy quality this stuff doesn't wear out.

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