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#185364 - 10/15/09 03:11 AM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Russ]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
martinfocazio:
Quote:
It's a severe restriction


I have a hard time characterizing it as a "severe" or a "restriction".

It doesn't seem to keep anyone presently allowed to buy the ammunition from doing so.

For comparison try buying pseudoephedrine.

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#185371 - 10/15/09 05:22 AM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purchase [Re: JohnE]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
Originally Posted By: JohnE
Retailers already have to keep their records of gun purchases onhand and available for inspection, this will simply add a whole bunch of records to their files.

I'm thinking of some of the effects this will have on places like Bass Pro Shops, they have aisles of handgun ammunition in their stores, they're going to have to redesign their firearms department in order to put all of it behind a counter.

I'm also trying to figure out how long it will take for someone to challenge this legally, if someone hasn't already done so. I imagine the papers are already being delivered to a courthouse somewhere in the state.


CalGuns foundation is working on it!
www.calguns.net People should donate in CA and not CA then it spreads frown

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Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#185374 - 10/15/09 05:29 AM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Art_in_FL]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
Originally Posted By: Art_in_FL
martinfocazio:
Quote:
It's a severe restriction


I have a hard time characterizing it as a "severe" or a "restriction".

It doesn't seem to keep anyone presently allowed to buy the ammunition from doing so.

For comparison try buying pseudoephedrine.



Maybe you missed the part where you can no longer buy online.

For people like me that requires 2 hours or MORE out of my day in hopes of getting ammo at wal-mart.

It is a severe restriction for many of us, maybe not you.

Keep in mind that's hoping I have a common caliber wal-mart has or they have it in stock (which has not been common the last 13 months).

Also it requires only FFL to sell ammo that further restricts WHO I can buy it from.. Wal-Mart may not even sell it anymore.

This is a HUGE restriction.

_________________________
Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#185385 - 10/15/09 10:06 AM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Art_in_FL]
ironraven Offline
Cranky Geek
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 4642
Loc: Vermont
Pseudoephadrine means you go to the counter to buy it, ask for your name to put it in their book, and show them your license to prove you are over 18. Or if you are like me, they look at you and tell you how much you owe.

What california has done is make it easier to buy tobacco and alcohol than it is to buy ammunition.

This is going to require physical retailers to reorganize their physical layout, not just planograms, but actually making it so that you can not get to the ammunition.

This requires that the purchaser be finger printed by the staff. Ignoring the mess, it takes time. Your thinking "not that much time", but that is if the print works the first time. It takes practice to make a usable card, and often a couple of tries.
The information has to be stored as if a 4473.

Internet retailers have been told to sod off, they don't get to play.

As far as I can tell, there is no list of "handgun" calibers. This could be construed several ways. One is "ammunition commonly used in pistols", "ammunition that might be used in pistols even though there are a number of rifles that fire it", or "someone makes a pistol for it, this is pistol ammo". If that latter, becuase of the T/C Contender and Encore, that means everything up to the 30-06 class.

For people who don't have a drivers license, what other forms of ID will be accepted? Or are people who various medical reasons, or because a car is too much of a pain to maintain in the city, no longer worthy of buying pistol ammunition?

There seems to be no statement that this law will require only a DL number and thumb print. In fact, it seems kinda open ended. Given the creative interpretation of laws and powers seen by certain federal agencies, I have no doubt that california will in a few years require more than just this.


I have little doubt that chain retailers (Walmart, Dick's, Gander Mountain, et al) will decide this is too much of a hassle. If you can't ban something, just make it harder to sell and inconvenient to buy.

Content edit by moderator for technical foul in violation of Godwins Law


Edited by martinfocazio (10/15/09 03:56 PM)
Edit Reason: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
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When a man dare not speak without malice for fear of giving insult, that is when truth starts to die. Truth is the truest freedom.

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#185405 - 10/15/09 04:00 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: ironraven]
MartinFocazio Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 2155
Loc: Bucks County PA
Sounds like an opportunity to me.
Ammo Delivery. No, I'm serious.

You know how the "Snap-On" tools trucks drive around to garages and stuff?

What's to say - under this law - that you could not have a mobile ammo shop? You could do a circuit - stop in location X in the morning, location Y in the afternoon - it's all legal and all that - and you don't "Order" ammo - you call them and ask if they "Stock" ammo - and if they don't, they say, "By the time we're in your area again, we expect to stock that."

Might be a bit expensive - and then again, maybe not. I haven't read the laws on selling ammo in CA, does this sound daft?


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#185408 - 10/15/09 04:11 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: MartinFocazio]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
Oh Martin, I would expect such a venture to draw a heavy scrutiny from the constabulary. It would be a challenge to make the route when you are getting stopped every 10 minutes for a search and interrogation.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#185413 - 10/15/09 04:40 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: benjammin]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
You actually have to conduct FFL related business (and since this new law requires only FFL holders to sell ammo it falls within that) @ the address on your FFL not anyplace else.

Thus you could not be mobile.

_________________________
Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#185414 - 10/15/09 04:42 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Todd W]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
In CA they consider a handgun caliber anything that CAN be fired from a handgun. Obviously that's open to interpretation by each retailer. I know Wal-Mart "asks" when you buy .22LR if it's for a handgun or file... will they require more questions and checking or will ALL ammo that can be shot from a factory sold handgun be considered handgun ammo even if it is not normal (30-06,.223, etc) and 99% of time used in a rifle.

Who knows?!?!

_________________________
Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#185417 - 10/15/09 05:00 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Todd W]
JohnE Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 601
Loc: Southern Cal
I don't wanna go all constitutional here but there's no amendment to that document guaranteeing the right to own pseudoephidrine.

There are also alternative medications that a person can buy over the counter without providing any ID, not really the case with ammunition.

_________________________
JohnE

"and all the lousy little poets
comin round
tryin' to sound like Charlie Manson"

The Future/Leonard Cohen


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#185420 - 10/15/09 05:10 PM Re: AB 962 passed in CA limiting handgun ammo purc [Re: Todd W]
MartinFocazio Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 2155
Loc: Bucks County PA
Originally Posted By: Todd W
You actually have to conduct FFL related business (and since this new law requires only FFL holders to sell ammo it falls within that) @ the address on your FFL not anyplace else.

Thus you could not be mobile.



Oh well.

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