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#136868 - 06/20/08 04:59 AM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: red]
Emp Offline
Stranger

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 4
Originally Posted By: red
Another story I read indicated they had a map and were following a river or stream on the map. If I'm hiking in Denali, I'll have a map, compass, Gps, and PLB! Serious country up there!


+1 on that! I spent 18 days in Denali one spring and we got over a mile off course due to a short but powerful snowstorm blowing up and we could get occasional glimpses of the road!

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#136870 - 06/20/08 05:12 AM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Emp]
Chris Kavanaugh Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 3824
I'm afraid I must delete this entire thread and ban all posters immediately.

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#136871 - 06/20/08 05:31 AM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Chris Kavanaugh]
Chris Kavanaugh Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 3824
O.K. I thought I might get some flurry of PMs. Additional accounts stated the girls had peanut butter sandwiches and granola bars. Now, we all know this is NOT on the list of approved ETS survival foods; MRE's, Mainstay,My Fruitcake, Beef jerky or Frenchy's wine. And peanut butter should have brought trophy sized brown bears in a savage charge no OUTDOOR LIFE magazine cover could duplicate.And they had no survival firearm! I bet they probably had those girly, pink scaled SAKs on them though with the mascara applicators.Oh well, some Los Angeleez writer is probably working on a teevee script right now with Britney Spears and Paris Hilton who drive off Bart's successor by playing back a cellphone message from Madonna with today's kabbala message.

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#136872 - 06/20/08 05:36 AM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Chris Kavanaugh]
climberslacker Offline
Youth of the Nation
Addict

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 603
Im sure you mean that they had this MAK (Miss army knife) with them!
_________________________
http://jacesadventures.blogspot.com/
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impossible is just the beginning

though i seek perfection, i wear my scars with pride

Have you seen the arrow?


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#136891 - 06/20/08 12:06 PM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: climberslacker]
bsmith Offline
day hiker
Addict

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 589
Loc: ventura county, ca

all things considered, i think they may have had this one.

_________________________
“Everyone should have a horse. It is a great way to store meat without refrigeration. Just don’t ever get on one.”
- ponder's dad

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#136892 - 06/20/08 12:08 PM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Russ]
bsmith Offline
day hiker
Addict

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 589
Loc: ventura county, ca

Originally Posted By: Russ
If I got lost I'd be inclined to go to high ground first if only to maybe get my bearings.


yes, that was thought to be the better option - to stay on the ridge lines - better lines of sight, better chance to read the coming weather, better chance of seeing and being seen by potential airborne rescuers.

_________________________
“Everyone should have a horse. It is a great way to store meat without refrigeration. Just don’t ever get on one.”
- ponder's dad

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#136906 - 06/20/08 01:55 PM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: bsmith]
Still_Alive Offline
Finally, I am a
Member

Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 119
Loc: Utah
"Denali [/b] Princess[b] Wilderness Lodge"?? The Princess Lodge, in Alaska? Is that for real? What clientèle are they catering to? Shouldn't they be required to take a Hiking Safety 101 course from Cinderella or Snow White before they can leave the lodge?
_________________________
“Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival.”
W. Edwards Deming

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#136920 - 06/20/08 04:05 PM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Still_Alive]
JohnN Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 10/10/01
Posts: 966
Loc: Seattle, WA

Since we've mostly been reacting to the news reporting which tends not to give much information and also color the account, I thought I'd try to find some more details.

WHERE:

Quote:
Rangers estimate the women logged at least 20 miles before they were picked up by a helicopter crew outside the northeastern side of the 9,400-square-mile park, Fister said.


Quote:
The backpackers left Thursday from the Savage Creek checkpoint just 15 miles from the park entrance,


Quote:
They were spotted by other hikers a mile off the road before they vanished.


MAPS

PREPARATIONS:

Quote:
The women said they each packed only bare essentials, such as two [peanut butter] sandwiches and granola bars, thinking that would be enough for their short trek. They brought a compass and a map but still lost their bearing, mistaking one river for another. They tried to follow the river, but that proved impossible many times, Flantz said.


Quote:
At night they slept in a tent.


So they did have a map and compass, some food, and a tent.

Quote:
drank river water or melted snow


We can probably imply from this they either had a stove or ability to make fire.

Quote:
The backpackers had a permit to camp in the Mount Healy wilderness unit and their intended destination required a crossing of the Savage River.


If they filled out a permit, it is implied they declared where they were going and at least some general aspect of their timeline.

TERRAIN:

Quote:
"There were steep hills, so we had to get away from them and there was this high brush we had to push through,"


Quote:
Searchers scoured a 100-square mile search area that includes dense alder and willow, some black spruce forest, but also miles of open tundra.


WHAT THEY DID:

Quote:
The days wore on and they rationed their food, but ran out of water and drank river water or melted snow. Hiking exhausted them, but they trudged on when the weather was good, hoping their destination was over the next bend. At night they slept in a tent.


Quote:
The only wildlife they saw, however, was a porcupine.


Well, that was one meal missed.

Quote:
they had no food when found.


Quote:
they regularly clicked on their cell phone until they finally found reception that led to their rescue.


Quote:
After the second cellphone call, they powered down the phone to save battery strength and text-messaged instead.


Quote:
The last couple of days it rained, so they mostly stayed in the tent, conserving their waning energy.


Sounds like due to the food situation they were running out of steam.

Quote:
They found no indication that the women had left the park but were puzzled that no clothing or gear had been found, or that the women had not somehow signaled the three helicopters or park airplane that flew overhead.


Not sure what 'puzzled that no clothing or gear had been found' was supposed to mean (they assumed they were eaten by bears?).

Quote:
At one point, they saw an airplane to the south, Fister said.


Be interesting to know if they had attempted to signal and if so, how.

SUMMARY:

Pros:

- They appeared to be prepared enough in terms of clothing and shelter. They spent six days out there with rain and were still in good shape.
- They did declare where they were going and when (at least to some extent).
- They did have a map and compass.
- They maintained a positive outlook.

Cons:

- They didn't prepare for unexpected issues.
- They underestimated the terrain and/or overestimated their capabilities.
- They got lost and appeared to be unable to get unlost.
- They appeared to be at the end of their rope when they ran out of food.
- They were not successful in signaling the search craft.
- As they wound down, it isn't clear that they did anything to help themselves get found.

QUESTIONS:

- I'm getting a hint that they had a strategy regarding getting unlost. It would be helpful to understand this better to see if it was viable.
- Were there lost food gathering opportunities (other than the porcupines)?

LINKS:

(sorry, I think I missed a few)

yahoo news seattle times

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#136960 - 06/20/08 11:06 PM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Still_Alive]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2458
Loc: Somewhere in Florida
Originally Posted By: Still_Alive
The Princess Lodge, in Alaska? Is that for real? What clientèle are they catering to? Shouldn't they be required to take a Hiking Safety 101 course from Cinderella or Snow White before they can leave the lodge?

Snow White would be a better choice. She had to actually survive in the woods.

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
“Trust me, this is not gonna end well!” — Pleakley, Lilo & Stitch

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#136983 - 06/21/08 02:16 AM Re: Alaska: 2 lost hikers rescued [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
nurit Offline
Member

Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 191
Loc: NYC
Good point!

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