I would first like to thank all of the fellow military members, past and present, on this Veteran's Day....

I will be going back into the military later this week, and although there are no plans for me to go back to the sandbox, I have been thinking about adapting a kit just for military purposes. I would like to include things that are already issued or are military specific, i.e., OD green, tan items instead of bright orange etc. I would really appreciate ideas from others that have made such kits as well as ideas that others that have not been in the military have tried or heard about. Thanks.

To adapt a kit just for military purposes sounds more like what you would have on a deployment, but perhaps trying to build something smaller. Is this a kit which you can carry around on Post?

I am a Vietnam-era veteran and was on a Mobility Team twice during my eight years of service. So I always leaned toward gear in surplus stores.

Before I became educated about titanium gear, improved BOB contents and lightweight Arc'teryx backpacks, I used mostly surplus gear, such as a BOB and general hiking setup; put together in a large Alice pack with metal packframe. I packed a stainless mess kit, steel canteen cup and standard GI canteens, Nesbit stove, FAK, FSK, food and surplus BDUs. After a couple of years of backpacking this stuff, I realized that the weight of this sturdy, durable and dependable gear did little for my middle aged back. If I were in my twenties, it wouldn't be so bad. So I upgraded everything from outdoor and alpine shops.

My general backpacking items are similar to what you will see on many posts regarding BOB contents, so I won't be redundant and create another list.

I am looking for kit to take to the field. For garrison use, I plan on carrying my normal EDC. With the new uniforms, I might be able to fit even more. I already have the canteen cup which, although a bit heavy, is a great small pot. (Does anyone know where you can get one of the old stoves?) I also have my poncho, poncho liner, and casualty blanket, but I am looking for any new stuff that might have come out in the last 2-3 years.

kitup.com might be worth a look?

CBTENGR:

My personal philosophy, and the one I live and work by is this: your LBE is your survival kit. Mission may dicate that you have to drop your rucksack for a while, but your rifle and LBE should always be on you - it should never leave your body whether sleeping, eating, or taking care of bodily functions.

Although your unit SOP may vary, your personal SOP should dictate that you always carry a minimum of 1. weapon and ammunition, 2. water, 3. a knife, 4. a map and compass, 5. a firestarting tool, and 5. blowout/first aid kit.

For greenside (woods/desert) patrolling, I use a chest rig equipped with the following, in no particular order:
8x - M4 magazines
2x - Nalgene bottles w/ stainless steel cup (far superior to military issue canteens, but be mindful of color)
1x - IR strobe
1x - Air Panel
1x - Silva Ranger Compass
1x - Blowout/F.A. Kit
1x - Map Kit, including map, map pens, protractor, and red-lense flashlight
1x - Gerber Multi-tool
1x - Surefire G2
1x - Small Altoids Tin-style survival kit containing
a. small Bic lighter
b. Magnesium fire starter
c. 10' 550 cord
d. Small Gerber Knife (can't remember model)
e. small fishing kit
f. snare-wire (from military trip-wire kit)
g. button compass
h. other items I can't remember off the top of my head...but you get the idea
1x - "Rite-in-the-Rain" tablet and pencil

In addition I have my standard pocket items including:
1x - Emerson CQC-7BW
1x - ID card
1x - Chapstick (absolute necessity for me in arid desert environments)
1x - Luminox watch with Suunto M6 watchband compass


If you get caught with your ruck off, or have to drop it in order to get out of Dodge, you will have what you need to fight and stay alive for a while. Military survival differs from civilian survival on a few specific points, like keeping fires concealed, being EXTREMELY selective about who you signal, etc. I don't know your background or level of training, but with adequate equipment, some knowledge, and a cargo pocket full of common sense you should be okay.

If you are a small unit leader, implement this philosophy among your men. Make sure they are never without the minimum. Train like you fight. In the heat of battle you will NOT rise to the occasion - you will default to your level of training.

I'll try to get a pic or two on here this afternoon. Hope this helps.

Hi CBTENGR

You would probably be best making up your own Personal Survival Kit from commercially available sources. If your looking for lightweight insulation clothing and sleeping bags in OD then Snugpak code green military products are available from http://www.snugpak.com/30_codegreen/index.htm

You might also want to have a look at the Jetboil system as your MRE heating system.



www.jetboil.com


Personal Survival Kit

PSK Container.

1 BCB mini-mess tin (Aluminium Roll Closure Lid) 300ml volume.

Tools Kit.

1 Fallkniven U2 Folder.
1 Hacksaw Blade cut to fit Box.
2 Cutting Razor Blades.
1 BCB - MoD finger wire saw.

Fire lighting Section.

1 Small Candle (UHO Citronella cut to size).
1 Firesteel Rod with Striker (Cadet Model with Plastic holder removed).
1 Ultimate Survival Wet Fire Tinder.
5 Cotton/Wax Balls Tinder.
8 NATO Lifeboat Matches in Waxed Cardboard.
1 Striker pad (for NATO matches).

Water Purifying Kit.

2 Alcosak Resealable 400ml Polythene Bags.
10 Lifeventure Water Puritabs. or Katadyn MP1 Puritabs
10 Lifeventure Water Aftertaste tablets.

Signalling Kit.

1 Ultimate Survival Polycarbonate Signal Mirror.
1 Fenix LOP-SE AAA powered Torch (with SOS function) with Spare AAA lithium Cell.
1 Exped Solar LED.
1 Liveventure Mountain Whistle.

Cooking Kit.

1 Esbit Wing Titanium folding Stove.
3 Esbit Hexamine Fuel Tablets.
2 Small Stock Drink Sachets.

Medical Kit.

1 Miniture Lip Salve.
4 Ibuprofen Tablets.
2 Aspirin Tablets.
4 Antihistamine Tablets.
2 Waterproof Plasters.
2 Compeed Gel Foot Plaster.
1 Small vial of Potassium Permanganate.

Navigation Kit.

1 Miniature Luminous Silva SERE compass.
1 Space Pen Refill Fine Black with 30cm of Duct Tape Wrapped.
1 Navigation Aid card.
4 Sheets of A6 Waterproof Paper.

Fishing and Snare Kit.

2 Metres of 20 gauge Stainless Steel Wire.
4 Small fish hooks.
2 Medium hooks
2 Snap Swivels.
6 Split Lead Weights.
15 Metres Monofilament Fishing Line. 5Kg Breaking Strain.

Miscellaneous.

1 A4 sheet of Aluminium Foil Folded.
1 Set of Survival Instructions. (DRs is a good starting point but lacks navigational instructions for self extraction)
3 Assorted Needles and 5 metres of wrapped high strength cotton.

I cruise by this site everyday to see if there is anything new.

There are things that I have added to my edc that were posted on kit-up.com. There is not alot of items there but they are invaluable.

I think it is probably worth doing an extensive scenario plan. Obviously you'll need field kit for regular use, you may also want to pack a small amount of survival kit on person as a backup. Whether you want that to focus on tactical/e&e scenarios or on regular survival is up to you.
FWIW in an e&e scenario, a compass (run in the right direction), water carrier/purification (stay hydrated so you can keep running) and shelter (space blanket or similar in OD so you can rest and stay dry when you stop running) are the only things some colleagues of mine in the services feel they need. Most of the other stuff is seen as ballast if you are genuinely under pressure.

I'm having trouble finding the site.

http://kitup.military.com/

I found it in December of 2006. As I said before I look at it at least 5 days a week. It's worth going back to the first month and reviewing the posts for each month.

As I recall I linked to kitup from another article about the silly string being used for trip wire detection.

First off, I just want to thank you for rejoining. It’s always good to have someone back. Thank you.

I’m backing up Justin C on the LBE thing. The LBE is your survival kit. I know you were looking for a kit for stateside (training) use, but if you’re in the military, chances are you will be in either Iraq or Afghanistan soon. I am currently stationed in Iraq, so let me tell you what works for me. We use the MOLLE type vest over here that you will get from your RFI issue. It’s pretty good, although I do miss the old LBE. Military survival in a combat zone is slightly different than civilian survival, and thus your kit should be a little different. I know I might catch some flack for this, but I don’t always share the same views on my kit as others. My kit mainly focuses on my first two priorities based on what I think will kill me first.

The first is ammo. The enemy will kill you faster than anything else out here. Your LBE will have that already in the form of 30 round magazines of 5.56mm. That’s taken care of. The second is signaling. This makes up about 90% of my kit. You need to get back to coalition forces QUICK! That and water are about equal out here, but I’ll get to that in a moment. I carry a VS17 panel, 2 chemlights (green and IR) with some 550 cord attached to it so I can swing it around at night for more visibility (aka. buzz saw), signal mirror, whistle, surefire light, strobe light (works visible light and IR), and last but not least a pen flare kit with ten flares. I know that sounds like a lot, but all of these items are small or roll up small and fit in a spec ops pouch I have. It’s approx 6in by 8in, but I haven’t measured it.

After that it’s all about water. For water I have a MIOX water purifier and some PUR tablets. I carry canteens (2) with the good old metal canteen cup (old school like that) in addition to a camel back. I also have a handkerchief around each canteen cup for straining water.

This is all you need to survive, in my opinion. Not thrive, not live off the land for a month, but survive to fight the enemy and rejoin coalition forces. I also have some good fire supplies (water proof matches, lighter, spark rod, cotton, trioxine tabs), but I would use these more as signal devices than anything else. The enemy is going to hone in on your fire pretty fast, so I probably wouldn’t start on unless it was a signal. There are other things that I didn’t mention (like a compass and knife, pressure dressing) that you will have also, but you have some good intell on that from the other posts. My advice is to focus on what you think you will need based on how long you think it will take for friendlies to find you vs. space and weight requirements. I’ll try to get some pictures up of this in a later tread.

PS. Also something very important. I keep some write in the rain index cards with the Code of Conduct to remind me of the possibility of capture (that’s motivation!), exerpts from the ranger creed and various quotes. To me, the will to survive is more important than anything else. I don’t know where else to put this, but I also carry some pointee tallkees (pictures you can point at with phrases written in Arabic on them) and a knock off Blood Chit (I am an American. You will be rewarded if you aid me etc, etc. translated in several languages). It’s a knock off because they are controlled items only issued to soldiers with high risk of being cut off. I think being outside the wire every day is high risk enough, but that’s just me…

Good luck and thanks again for showing up!

"We sleep safely at night because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would harm us." George Orwell

I am with Justin and Regulator on this,
ammo, more ammo and some more ammo.
8 mags on your vest, LBE or rig and a bandolier of 150 as a backup in a day sack.
A couple of grenades if you can get your hands on them.

Be prepared to drop everything and run, or get hit in a vehicle and get out in seconds. A grab bag of water, ammo and first aid is a winner.

As an engineer get yourself a small minestrike extraction kit, nothing special half a dozen nails, a bit of minetape and a prodder.

You might consider getting an MRE heater and hot beverage bag out of the trash next time you have a field training exercise. If you can't light a fire for whatever reason, you can use them to make a hot drink and as a body heater to fight hypothermia (and fear, much better to sit down and drink hot chocolate if you're lost then wander around in circles). Since you're already carrying water, they'll add almost no bulk or weight to your kit (important since you're already carrying a ton of ammo, body armor and water).

Also a neck gaiter and a pair of silk or polypro glove and sock liners. Again they're small and light, but they'll really make the difference in how cold you are.

Nothing new, but stuff that might not jump right out at you.

You're absolutely right about the socks...most important thing in the field. I would be a little worried about using the heater for a body warmer, they get hot enough to cause burns.

Would you happen to have these on some sort of document that you could send me? This sounds great and would help a lot. Thanks

Yeah, the heater can be dangerous, but if I was shivering , I'd probably wrap it in something (like my dirty socks maybe) and do it anyway. At the very least, you can use it as a hand warmer.

Another easily availible thing I thought of is MRE peanut butter packets. They've got a lot of calories in fat and protein,so you won't have a big crash after the energy runs out. A couple of packs of peanut butter will do you more good in the short term then fishing and snaring supplies. You can also get Hooah bars, but then you'd have to pay for those.

Yeah I have several packets of the peanut butter...I'm looking at one now and it lists 290 calories. That's about the same as regular energy bars, but half the size.

CBTENGR:

PM sent regarding pointie-talkies.

kwikpoint.com

After reading this forum, I decided to dig out an LBE I had and add a PSK to the pouches. I would probably only use it in a bug out situation or during some other local disaster. It seemed like a good idea.

As a civilian, I believe wearing an LBE without a good reason will probably be seen as suspicious activity by others and be reported to the police, but the PSK is there if needed. I do live in a community with a heightened sense of security. I also keep an PSK nearby all the time.

I don't think I would have ever bought an LBE, but this one came with two ammo pouches, two canteen covers, two canteens and canteen cups and web belt; all in great condition: all for $5.00.

All those goodies for five bucks!! Great find!!

I use my LBE anytime/everytime I use my ALICE pack for camping/backpacking. I use the LBE for dayhiking and hunting.

If you don't have it (EDC) with you when you need it, it does you no good and my PSK and other equipment are kept in my harness and it's attached accoutrements.

I can do an unexpected overnight with my LBE and be fairly comfortable.

This seems to be a constant theme on this forum. Why would this be suspicious? If you get reported to the police, who cares? You're not doing anything wrong at all.

On the other side of the coin, let's say you get reported to the police several times, and they check you out several times, and everything is fine. After a while, the person reporting you will be the "nutcase", and they won't even respond to another false alarm.

I still have my LBE and Alice pack from 25 years ago, and they're still in great shape, and they work well.

Hmmm...

*dusts off an old story*

When I'm assembling a kit that is going to be worn, I build it and take it for a walk. Two or three miles will tell you if there is anything massively wrong with it.

When I first starting working with chest harnesses for my ditch kit, I had a bunch of pouches on it. If it had been loaded with carbine mags, 34 would have fit nicely on there. Walking down the road, I get passed by a cop. Who stops. And asks questions. Now, this is in a rural area, in the day time, on a nice day, so it just turned into a minor pain in the butt. It also went to college like that for a while, and every one who was in the Guard who came in my room stopped and looked at it for a long second, even if they were someone who was more likely to be in my room than theirs.

Move that kit to the city. Everyone is keyed up becuase it is time to get out of dodge. Cop sees it, they aren't as likely to politely ask questions. If the Guard gets called in, you have people who are more aware of what military-type LBE looks like, and who are out of their element. They see a combat harness, what do you think their first reaction is going to be? My money is on they will consider you a threat. Particularly the more urbanized you get. Ooops.

By contrast, I've worn my current ditch kit with a few large pouches on it while hiking some fairly well built up trails. Some people have commented on my fishing vest, but they seem to like the idea of having water and compass and map and the like up front. And these aren't Vermonters- the parking lot at the trail head was full of "flatlander" plates. By contrast, no one would get near my friend who uses a modified LBV-88, nor would they make eye contact with him. These are people from one of those "more urbanized areas" I was talking about.

Packs, chest rigs that can look like fishing gear, ok. Wearing cammies, chest rigs that look like chest rigs, drop legs, those are something that can get classed as threat display too easily. Camouflage is blending in with your environment, and a pistol belt and H-harness doesn't that do that if there are people around. Personally, I don't like it, but that is the reality. Sticking out isn't wise, particularly when people (particularly those with badges and guns) are keyed up. I'd much rather wear a kilt in the summer, and a sword and pistol on my belt year round, but it isn't viable in this society. *shrugs*

I hate to quote Mao, or even paraphrase him, but it is better to be as one fish among many.

Iron raven is spot on.

Doesn't matter if we think it is fine, if you are not up to anything - other peoples perceptions (including LEO) are what matters.

Yes, we can try to change their view, but that won't happen quickly, and is a PITA you can live without in a crisis

Although it's really a shame, Iron Raven is correct. I love my military kit as much as the next guy, moreso perhaps. It's perfectly set up to my preferences, and all those ammo pouches will hold a lot of neat gear. But it doesn't get worn outside the military. Aside from the potential for undesired identification as an insurgent or terrorist during a disaster scenario, military stuff also tends to draw a lot of everyday unwanted attention (crazy looks, curious looks, questions, etc.). I try, in most everything I do, to remain inconspicious. Wearing "urban camoflage" helps keep me off the skyline.

Excellent point...when compiling kits we often think of how long we can survive, but we also need to think where we can take that kit in order to survive. I don't know how many of you have been on a college campus lately, but a lot of the kids are wearing camo pants while carrying chairman mao messenger bags. For my BOB I have worn looking camo pants, a sweater and a baseball cap. All of my gear is in a bookbag. I could pass as any other college kid, or grad student, since undergrad was a while ago. This helps since I have 3 colleges in walking distance. I have a map of my area with circles drawn on it to indicate how far and how long on can go on foot using different parts of my kit.

It is an excellent point. My current BOB, SAR 'Ready Pack', and backpacking pack are one in the same. A 60L hiking pack (which I leave space in for the unexpected, 'wife gear' or group search and rescue equipment)...though I tweak the contents and layout for each task a bit.

In some posts I've made recently I've been trying to find tactical gear in yellow for SAR...but putting in perspective what Iron Raven points out, this is bad for the same reasons. If you have to bug out you want to blend in and bright yellow gear head to toe is just as bad as camo. If you're trying to get out of Dodge and every 2 blocks you get stopped and asked if you're an EMT or disaster relief...or mugged for medical supplies, you're no better off.

My pack might be a bit big but where I live downtown you see people walking around with heavy packs all the time...travelers staying in hostels, the homeless, etc. However right now my pack has a Gerber LMF II and a Gerber Brush Thinner Machete strapped to the outside...there's no way I would leave it like that to walk around in the urban jungle.

I wasn't thinking of the Mao bags, I was thinking of a passage in the "Little Red Book" in which he speaks of a guerrilla having to be able to become just another fish in the teaming schools of the populace. I hate to credit that pervert with a good point, but for surviving around people, the same lesson can apply.

The other ways of looking at it is just as old "don't stick out- it attracts snipers". "The nail that sticks out gets pounded first." " The squeeky wheel gets greased." Etc.

Sorry for the leave of absence, been on mission. The pointy talkie web address is actually exactly what we use.

On another note, I see the discussion heading to the civilian side of the house. I have some thoughts on this. First, the reason that we wear everything on us at all times is because we need our implements of destruction/survival on us at all times when we are actually on mission. In this case, that means leaving the vehicle or rucksack behind to actually fight, or escape and evade. As a civilian, I would think this would mean leaving your vehicle or camp sight to get help. No if this is some kind of end times thing of violent situation then it doesn’t matter, but I would think that all of your needs would be met by a rucksack or backpack. It will always be on you and I can’t really think of too many reasons you would have to cut away and move out quickly without it (i.e. Ambush, attack, or indirect fire).

What I am trying to say is that for training and practical purposed, I don’t really think it is worth it to wear a tactical vest or LBE vs. the hassle it is going to create with local law enforcement. Is it the way it should be? No, but people can talk big about not caring, but you do care. Why get the hassle to prove the point. Anytime law enforcement is involved, you run the risk of a misunderstanding that could lead to you either getting arrested or shot. Quick Story: A few years ago, I was training for Bataan Death March in South Texas (very pro military and use to camouflage and tactical clothing). Well, I know better now, but I was wearing full BDU (with rank, US Army, and Unit Patch sown in) and a issue rucksack with no weapon. The police showed up at about mile 7 saying that someone had called in a report of a terrorist on the road. I showed him my military ID, explained what I was doing, and he made sure I was walking on the proper side of the road and then he left with a smile. The whole think probably took about 4 minuets, but it was still uncomfortable as hell. The moral of the story is that it just isn’t worth risking your life or possible jail (in my opinion) for something that could be accomplished on the track or rode on post, or by wearing civilian clothing that matches your military clothing (pants, long sleeve shirt). The important thing is the boots anyway.

This is just my opinion of course. I'm new to posting, and I don't want to rock the boat or start something negative, but I would advise against training in your gear around civilians.

I think you have some good points there, Regulator6.

One reason for LBE, beit a soldier's or a civilian's is to have it on your person at all times, as you said.

But the other reason, which is probably so second-nature you don't even think about it, is to make your gear instantly accessible.

All a soldier's "implements of destruction/survival" could also be carried in a rucksack, but imagine, every time you empty a magazine, having to drop your pack and dig around in the bottom for a loaded mag?

That's why I'm still searching for the holy grail of civi LBE.

On another note, I find it depressing that a soldier in full uniform would be called in as "suspicious" and questioned for more than 5 seconds by a cop.

Although looking like a shabby civilian isn't any guarantee either! My parent's house where I grew up is a few miles from where the Appalachian Trail crosses a dead-end road. Naturally I tended to end my multi-day hikes at that point, and simply walk home down the road. We must have looked pretty ragged once because the local cop stopped us and asked the usual "Where are you going? Where are you from? What are you doing?" questions to see if we were up to something. The hitchhiker/vagrant look isn't as invisible as people think.

I didn't have my LBE with me, but I had Nikon binoculars with me and they were laying on the dash of my car. I had a backpack in the backseat from an earlier short hike.

I was parked downtown, where I have been going to for over 27 years. Some young store clerks called the police because they thought I was casing the stores. Of course the Police did their job and checked me out, but it was ANNOYING!!

I'm glad I didn't have an LBE in the car; of course if I had, the Police would have only found FAKs in the ammo pouches. The look of an LBE in my area would only raise eyebrows. (I cut the grenade holders off. Grenades are too noisy anyway )

But still, I plan on taking the LBE with me in the car anyway. I'm just one of those "survivalist nuts" who people run to when they need help.

Wasn't $5.00 a great buy for all that gear??!!!

Sometimes if I am in an urban area wearing a combat patrol pack and wearing an M65 jacket,,,I often wear my Air Force cap with the American Flag pin and SAC Pin on the front. At least it lets people know that I'm All-American. (One day I wanted to put a sign on the back of the pack that says, "I'm NOT homeless, I'm employed...and I don't want your d....n money".)

I generally use Arc'teryx backpacks, but occasionally the patrol pack makes its appearance.

I recommend to your attention the 5.11 concealed carry vest. For discreet carry of vital EDC kit it's rather hard to beat. I've added a a double magazine pouch which takes a multi-tool and a folding knife and the torch pouch which is perfect for a AA Maglite or a Surefire. The handcuff pouch takes a headtorch perfectly (Tikka Plus).

5.11 is too famous. Every cop and mall ninja in North America knows what it is.

True. But I really want one of their "assault parka's." Just not enough to pop $200 for one. Yet...

Oh, me to. The vests look too suspicious, I see someone wearing a safari vest at 110 degrees it screams "gun" no matter what. But the parkas look "right", they blend in.

And I really meant "Aggressor Parka." Senior moment I guess. What did I have for breakfast anyway???

I am brand new to this forum, but couldn't resist jumping into this topic. It is great to see that my friends down south have the same views on these things as I do way up here. As food for thought, may I suggest something along the line of a good hunting vest to fill the role of civi LBE. Most have as much as or more actual capacity and function than military vests, and are not made by the lowest bidder as most military equipment is. When people see realtree hardwoods green as opposed to military camo they tend automatically to assume you are a hunter or hiker as opposed to being up to no good. I have worn army LBE hunting only to have people look at me like I was insane. When wearing a hunting vest which was almost identical to my military gear (except in hunter camo) no one gave me a second glance. Except for places to store ballistic plates and grenade pouches, a lot of the current hunting vests are stitch for stitch every bit as rugged and reliable as most army LBE, and draw less attention. A nice example is the Primos Randy Anderson Signature Series Predator Hunting Vest. www.BassPro.com

Welcome Canadian_Soldier, look forward to your input on the forum.

And THANKS,

Mike

Had a feeling that is the one you meant.

Thanks for the welcome Mike.
I’ve been to northern Ontario in the brush, Cold, wet and miserable plenty of times. As the climate can be as bad there as it is here I know you will have some great knowledge to share.

Glenn

Funny thing about the vests....when I was working with the Air Force, the OSI guys loved wearing the vests. They didn't blend in at all on a military installation, so I figure good luck in the civilian world.

Canadian_Soldier,

Welcome to the board fellow canuck!

Kris

Thank you kindly Kris,
There are a lot more friendly people here than I had imagined. great forum.

Yes it is...

And not just a fellow Canadian...a fellow Albertan! Welcome!

Bloody hell! Its a small world after all. I was born and raised in rural Newfoundland but have been posted here in Alberta for the past 8 years almost. Like it or not I guess I am an Albertan now!
How do you like the snow in Alberta so far this year? I am planning another hunting trip soon, time permitting, and if I don't freeze to death I may have a good survival story or two for this forum.(planning on trying some improvised shelter training) Lol

I bought a Jeep this year so I haven't even noticed the snow.

When I think back to how I remember it as a boy growing up, this is nothing but a dusting of snow. When it's knee deep, I'll take notice

It sure is awesome to meets such great folks! I guess I should attempt to stay on topic a little though. Another two "CIVI" type vests which would probably fit most needs are the Hycreek game vest and the Columbia smokin' clays shooting vest. Both are used by friends for survival vests and I am told they are top notch quality and very affordable. They also blend in quite well without people pegging you for a Para military nut case I am told. I agree fully with other members on this topic in that it is best to avoid using military gear around civilians. Funny that I can give half my life to the service of my country and no one usually could care less, but if I walk to my truck with a hunting rifle and my issued LBE I would be reported as a terrorist and stopped by the police before I could make it out of my driveway. These same people who would report me would most likely be the very first people to knock on my door and ask for help should disaster strike. Funny world in which we live.

The strangest animals on the planet are those who get around primaily on 2 legs.

Yes, I fully understand what you mean and how you feel!!!!

Where abouts in nfld? My wife was in Carbonear (sp?) for a few years.

Kris

A small Place called Felix cove, off The Port AU Port penn

And some of the stranger ones are here.

And a fellow armoured engineer to boot if your avatar does you justice, welcome aboard.

Former Armoured engineer as it were, I have since remustered to a new job in the army. My heart remains behind the steering bow of a 50 tonne, 830 horsepower AVLB or AEV though.

Same here, I've flown a desk for a few years now. I hate it with a passion and long for oil under my skin and power at my fingers. Still, a life expectancy of 12 seconds was always a bummer.

And throwing a track in the middle of nowhere with no one but you and your crew commander to put it back on. Or even better, Blowing a powerpack. I guess I don't miss that aspect much.

Well....there was talk of LBV. I found a civi vest in dark blue with 6 pockets on one side and 7 on the other: Thrift Store for $2.00. I will try it out.