Been layed up for a few day with a bum gut, I got to thinking. Anyone know how navigate with the stars and sun? I thought it'd be pretty cool to learn how to do this, but most everything I've googled has been pretty in-depth geek-speak that my hillbilly brain can't understand.

I know it isn't easy because if it was, we'd never have come up with a GPS. But civy GPS's can be spoofed, and compasses only tell direction.

Anyone got any ideas or other methods of determining specific Lat/Lon W/O maps or gps's? Anything you can recommend as a celestial navigation primer?

I would guess that a person wouldn't have the sextants or other equipment available all the time, but I still think it'd be cool to learn.

DLR

Here is a good place to start,

http://www.celestialnavigation.net/

But you may have already been there, but the knowledge still has uses today. Years ago the Coast Guard offered courses in celestial navigation. Friend of mine went through the course so that he could "hitch a ride" on sailboats he could not afford by offering his services as a back up to the GPS.

You might also look into orienteering,

http://www.4orienteering.com/

It might be possible to find a club in your area that can show you the way. HTH

I second Bowditch.

CelNav is can be difficult. I've had classes on it and know the theory, but putting that theory into practice is the hard part. The instructors don't tell you just how hard it is to aquire and maintain a sextant sighting on a pitching deck, when all the stars look nearly the same through the sight (you get tunnel vision and can lose the constellation).

Truely accurate Celestial Fixes require a perfect horizon, so anywhere other than the sea makes that difficult. Also, light pollution from cities, trees, and whathave you can all block the sky and make fixes that much harder. It's sad, but these days a lot of mariners just use GPS and have lost the art and science of CelNav because the electronic gizmos are faster, easier, and more accurate. I just hope an EMP or something won't render the world's maritime fleets useless.

If you are serious, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE. It requires a lot of gear that Night Hiker mentioned.

All that being said, I wouldn't get discouraged. CelNav is awesome and really cool to know. It would be great in a pinch, and the ladies like it when you can sit there and point out stars and constellations.

Matt

I'm third

Though, it is possible to use an improvised measurement tools in the field (the perfect horizon line sight is optional and could be improvised too), plus an accurate watch (must have), the measurements+calculations precision would be somewhat frustrating (like +- 200 miles). Still not bad in trans-pacific plane crash situation...

I always wondered how someone gets an accurate angle of sun and horizon on a pitching deck.

For really amazing celestial navigation, I have always been fascinated by how the ancient polynesians did it. No sextant, compass or timepiece, yet they traveled thousands of miles of open ocean in large canoes. It is really a good read to see how they did it.

My sailor skills are nil, by the way.

Jeff

I was out one night with this Elder of the indian tribe I was working with. He was sharing the names and stories of each constellation and star. There was one moving slowly over our horizon I didn't recognise. I asked about it.< SIGH> that, Chris, is a communication satelite. Start out simple. Our own folklore teaches us that if nothing else. Heres two that always work for me; 'Follow the drinking gourd' used by escaped slaves to move north using the Big Dipper, and 'Second star on the right, then straight on till morning.'

The following advice is coming from a redneck's perspective & isn't meant to be professional advice or taken too seriously. I'm not using the actual constellations names to keep it simple & would say start checking the night sky out now when you can be absolutely sure of where north.

The view of the night sky can be a challenge here in the sticks of the Ozarks. However, out where you're at this should be a piece of cake to get the general idea of where North is assuming you aren't clouded over.

One of the things that can instantly point me in the general direction of the North star is the moon. If the sun has just gone down or has only been down for a couple hours the side that is lit up white is west & if you draw a line thru the moon that line is pointing north & south.

On the moon itself (to my naked eye) there appears to be one finger pointing out of a hand which is pointing in the general direction of north. I first read that here
and have watched it over the last couple years & it is a ballpark truth - in other words it will get you started & then you have to find the north star using the following.

The Big Dipper. Asterik's are the stars. If you draw line thru the end of the cup it lines up with the North Star.

North Star ----->----->--*-
-----------------------------
--------*---*----------------
----*-----------*--------*---
-----------------------------
------------------*-----*----
-----------------------------


If the Big Dipper is below the horizon then there is another constellation that looks like a Giant "W" which is exactly opposite from the Bigger Dipper. This "W" is very funky so don't expect it to be perfect. The top of the "W" is pointing at the North Star as well - something similar to this. (Keep in mind I'm winging it from memory here :))

North Star ----->*----------
-----------------------------
-----------------------------
------*----------------------
----------------*---------*--
-----------------------------
------------*----------------
---------------------*-------


And last, but not least there is a partial Kite that moves across the night sky shapped something like this.

-----------North-------------
-----------------------------
-----------------------------
--------------*--------------
-----------------*-----------
--------------------*--------
-----------------------------
--------------*--------------
--------------*--------------
--------------*--------------

The stars at the top right angle of the kite are very bright & if they are in the sky then you can't miss them. This kite is also pointing north.

This is only meant as a quick & dirty description to get you started. Let me know if you have questions & if you go check it out what you find.

Excellent, succinct review of celestial nav.

Thanks.

Thanks, I was a little nervous about putting that out there, because there are some very smart, knowledgeable, technical & precise people on this board & what I described is a very basic view of how it looks to me standing out in my yard looking up.

And that's exactly how it is going to look to somebody in the bush. Which is the whole point.

Again, Thanks.