Equipped To Survive Equipped To Survive® Presents
The Survival Forum
Where do you want to go on ETS?

Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#87269 - 03/04/07 01:31 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: Seeker890]
billym Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 616
Loc: Oakland, California
The question you need to really ask is whether or not to close the wound at all. If you are willing to use iodine in a wound because it is dirty then you should not close the wound to begin with.

Hell my Dad used to dump hydorgen peroxide in my wounds; don't mean it is the right thing to do these days.

The best replacement is benzalkonium chloride.


Edited by billym (03/04/07 04:24 AM)

Top
#87272 - 03/04/07 01:40 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: billym]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
"...dump hydorgen peroxide in my wounds..."

I do that on myself from time to time, usually with a dirty abrasion. Looks really cool when it starts foaming and bubbling...
_________________________
OBG

Top
#87278 - 03/04/07 03:21 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: OldBaldGuy]
billym Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 616
Loc: Oakland, California
Yes I always kinda liked the bubbles. It looked like something was happening. smile

Top
#87281 - 03/04/07 04:27 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: billym]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
Yeah, it looks like it is eating your flesh like acid. So cool...
_________________________
OBG

Top
#87285 - 03/04/07 05:22 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: billym]
SARbound Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 503
Loc: Quebec City, Canada
Originally Posted By: billym


The best replacement is benzalkonium chloride.


+1 on this. Easily available in small tearable packets. Iodine causes damage to tissue, and so does alcohol. Alcohol is used to disinfect instruments, and iodine is used to disinfect uninjured skin.
_________________________
-----
"The only easy day was yesterday."

Top
#87295 - 03/04/07 07:42 AM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: SARbound]
Flotsam Offline
Newbie

Registered: 03/13/03
Posts: 35
Loc: Connecticut
Even BZK isn't really good for cleaning a wound. The best treatment is copious irrigation (after you've picked out all of the obvious debris) - potable water works fine. Some wilderness medical types advocate adding a little povidone-iodine to the water to make a "weak tea" colored solution. I've used the diluted betadine in the ED (before I was aware of some the studies against it), and the wounds turned out ok (they were all irrigated w/ plain sterile saline prior to closure, however).

Closing a wound in the woods w/ either sutures or glue, is generally a bad idea - the risk of infection is typically greater with a closed, contaminated wound, than just having an open wound.

The medical grade superglue (Dermabond)is n-octylcyanoacrylate, and for other than superficial, small, very clean-edged wounds under little tension, doesn't tend to work as great as you would think.

All of the little swabs/towelettes/etc... are meant to be used on relatively intact skin - fine for a small abrasion, but not for deeper wounds.

And although many of us (including myself) have used such things successfully in the past, this is, more often than not, an example of our body healing not because of something we've done, but in spite of it. The body is very resilient, and even the biggest wounds can heal with proper hygiene & time. I've sent patients home w/ wounds big enough to put your hand in, and they've healed just fine, however, prematurely closed wounds can and have led to systemic sepsis.

Top
#87313 - 03/04/07 04:41 PM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR BILLYM [Re: Flotsam]
billym Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 616
Loc: Oakland, California
Originally Posted By: Flotsam
Even BZK isn't really good for cleaning a wound. The best treatment is copious irrigation (after you've picked out all of the obvious debris) - potable water works fine. Some wilderness medical types advocate adding a little povidone-iodine to the water to make a "weak tea" colored solution. I've used the diluted betadine in the ED (before I was aware of some the studies against it), and the wounds turned out ok (they were all irrigated w/ plain sterile saline prior to closure, however).

Closing a wound in the woods w/ either sutures or glue, is generally a bad idea - the risk of infection is typically greater with a closed, contaminated wound, than just having an open wound.

The medical grade superglue (Dermabond)is n-octylcyanoacrylate, and for other than superficial, small, very clean-edged wounds under little tension, doesn't tend to work as great as you would think.

All of the little swabs/towelettes/etc... are meant to be used on relatively intact skin - fine for a small abrasion, but not for deeper wounds.

And although many of us (including myself) have used such things successfully in the past, this is, more often than not, an example of our body healing not because of something we've done, but in spite of it. The body is very resilient, and even the biggest wounds can heal with proper hygiene & time. I've sent patients home w/ wounds big enough to put your hand in, and they've healed just fine, however, prematurely closed wounds can and have led to systemic sepsis.



Thanks Flotsam for the expert advice.

Bill

Top
#87318 - 03/04/07 05:40 PM Re: GLUE THOSE BODY PARTS!!! ??? FOR FLOTSAM [Re: Flotsam]
CANOEDOGS Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 1853
Loc: MINNESOTA

FLOTSAM..
as all my first aid is directed too what might happen on
wilderness canoe trips and not survival situtions i never
thought i would need to really "close" a wound..just do
something that would keep me from bleeding untill the cut
healed up on it's own in a few hours..some body parts like
hands,fingers,feet..get lots of use and you can't just pull
over and camp while a minor cut clots up..if a bandaid keeps
soaking thru i would assume that it has "bled clean" and
could be glued closed..like i said i never had to use the
VetBond but i have wraped Transpore tape over minor cuts
untill they healed up enought for a band aid..
many years ago i went really overboard and took a kit
that you could do minor surgery with..staple kit..gloves..
several sizes of gauze pad..iodine scrubers---you get the idea.
one day i looked at all that stuff because it was quite a
pile to carry and it hit me--if i was injured so badly that
i needed that gear i was in BIG trouble and more than likly
unable to use it..my best bet was to patch myself up and
paddle to the nearest ranger station , fishermans fly-in
camp or signal for help....this is sort of running on..
the real question was..for larger wounds on limbs i have
seen advise that a pile of gauze pads wound up with an Ace
bandage will staunch bleeding without having to resort to
stiching,butterfly bandages..so on..and is faster and easy
to use..

Top
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2



Moderator:  Alan_Romania, Blast, cliff, Hikin_Jim 
November
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Who's Online
0 registered (), 486 Guests and 84 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Aaron_Guinn, israfaceVity, Explorer9, GallenR, Jeebo
5370 Registered Users
Newest Posts
Leather Work Gloves
by Jeanette_Isabelle
Today at 12:37 AM
Satellite texting via iPhone, 911 via Pixel
by Ren
11/05/24 03:30 PM
Emergency Toilets for Obese People
by adam2
11/04/24 06:59 PM
For your Halloween enjoyment
by brandtb
10/31/24 01:29 PM
Chronic Wasting Disease, How are people dealing?
by clearwater
10/30/24 05:41 PM
Things I Have Learned About Generators
by roberttheiii
10/29/24 07:32 PM
Gift ideas for a fire station?
by brandtb
10/27/24 12:35 AM
The price of gold
by dougwalkabout
10/20/24 11:51 PM
Newest Images
Tiny knife / wrench
Handmade knives
2"x2" Glass Signal Mirror, Retroreflective Mesh
Trade School Tool Kit
My Pocket Kit
Glossary
Test

WARNING & DISCLAIMER: SELECT AND USE OUTDOORS AND SURVIVAL EQUIPMENT, SUPPLIES AND TECHNIQUES AT YOUR OWN RISK. Information posted on this forum is not reviewed for accuracy and may not be reliable, use at your own risk. Please review the full WARNING & DISCLAIMER about information on this site.