Thanks for all your input about backpacks. I've been looking at the "Alice" packs and need some more information. They seem to be good for the money. <br>I'll be using it on my camping trips, etc. And also, it could be used for a B-O-B.<br>Does anyone know anything about these packs. Are they good. I thought for the money (around $25) they would work for me.<br>Thanks for the help,<br>Joe

Hi PreacherMan,<br><br>You might want to check out this thread. The comments by Tom Ayers (aka AyersTG) regarding ALICE gear may be helpful for you in deciding whether you want to use this kind of gear and, if so, how you may want to modify it.

Joe,<br><br>If you're on a budget, $25 for an ALICE pack isn't bad. Scrutinize before you buy to make certain that it is in good shape. Special attention should be paid to straps, pads and seams. Find someone with military experience to check if you're unfamiliar with the system. I don't care for the ALICE system myself, but that may be because I have carried one many miles for Uncle Sam. <br><br>Make sure that you get a frame for it. The military issue frame isn't that great, but it will serve; just be sure to check the straps regularly, they have an annoying tendency to let go at inoportune times (often painfully). With light loads, a frame isn't really neccessary, but you'll have to pack carefully to avoid getting jabbed in the back by hard or pointy items. Tom Ayers mentioned something awhile back about modifying a Camp Trails "Freighter" frame to work with the ALICE pack with good results. If I thought I'd be carrying one much longer, I'd look hard at that. Good luck.<br><br><br>Take care,<br><br>Andy

I agree with Andy's post. Also, for lighter loads, you can make a "sheet frame" for an ALICE by carefully cutting to fit whatever comes to hand so that it fits very closely inside the pack - it goes on the side next to your back. A scrap of sleeping pad is good (and has other uses, such as a sit pad). If you have it, adding a scrap of tempered masonite (1/8" - if pegboard it's a little bit lighter) stiffens it even more. If you have neither, 3-4 layers of corrugated cardboard tightly duct-taped together work well and a few "free" tyvek envelopes from the USPS (Priority Mail or Express Mail) and a little more duct tape make the cardboard fairly water resisitant and it, too can be used as a sit pad. You can experiment with other ideas along those lines if you've followed me so far.<br><br>BTW, I feel it's well worth getting GOOD duct tape. The cheap stuff is fine for kids playing around with, but get the high-quality stuff for "the real world" - it's almost not the same tape, it's so much better.<br><br>Regards,<br><br>Tom

Thanks again for info. Tom, I was thinking maybe a large ALICE pack would be good just in keeping all my clothing and other belongings together during campouts. I would not be hiking that much, so it really doesn't matter about the frame. Would you suggest this or do you think a duffel bag would be better.<br>Thanks for all your help. I appreciate it very much,<br>Joe

For what it is worth: I have carried all of my rescue gear (approx. weight 75lbs) in a large surplus ALICE pack w/ frame for about 6 years. Prior to that I used a general backpacking pack. The ALICE pack has served me well; it has many pockets to organize my gear. Recently, I have retired the ALICE pack to my wife's van for my backup gear. I now use a pack from LA RESCUE designed for USAR applications. It was quite expensive, but built like a tank. Two things I do not like about the new pack is the hip belt, which uses a VELCRO and metal buckle to adjust and it does not have as many pockets as the ALICE pack. I may try to jury rig a new buckle for the hip belt. For the money, I think the ALICE pack is a good value and should last quite a while. Pete

Joe,<br><br>Shoot, use the ALICE. If you have a complete frame, go ahead and use it, too. While there is much better stuff out there for big loads, even an ALICE is fine for light-to-moderate loads. And if you're an ox with a strong back or just taking short treks, you can hump a fair amount of weight in it by non-military standards.<br><br>My objections to them are from a professional viewpoint - it was (is) lousy equipment (ergonomically speaking) to stick us with for all those years - enough years that many folks spent an entire career and never saw/used anything else. There are things that I like about ALICE gear. The frame and some of its appurtenances is what I despise about them.<br><br>Tom