Ok I one day while outside my dad said that I could not start a fire with a magnesium block and flint that I had acquired from a local outdoors store. Being known in my family as the “survivalists” I decided to accept the challenge, going through my bug-out military gear I pulled it out and went out side. I found a nice piece of flat bark to use as a staging post then gathered some moss dried leaves an small twigs. I scraped the magnesium off the block and got a good amount of it gathered in one spot a lot harder than I thought, I tried to spark it and failed. After about 20min of trial and error I finally got a light and started a fire. So where did I go wrong? I wanted to try and get it one shot any suggestions?

What brand of block are you using? Doans or Coghlan's? What are you using for a scrapper? Are you putting one end of the block on the surface or are you holding the block above the tinder while sparking?

From my experience with those things, plus what I have seen, read, and heard, you did about average, maybe a tad better. They will work, but are not the easiest way to make a fire. Add some wind to scatter those little chips and the job only gets harder...

I've always been able to light tinder with one eventually, but in any sort of wind, I collect the shavings in a container like a folded scrap of paper. Once I've got enough to make a pile about the size of 3-4 stacked nickels, it takes me 2-5 sparks to get the pile lit. I haven't tried the new-to-me advice of holding the scraper/knife still and scraping the bar across it instead of moving the scaper across the bar. But I can definately get tinder lit without too much trouble.

Then things usually go bad because I usually don't collect enough tinder and twigs to sustain it. I like the advice of collecting what you think you need, then doubling it. In my case I should probably triple it.

Watching video of guys like Les Stroud and Ron Hood, one thing I haven't done is blow a lot of extra oxygen into my tinder pile to get it really going. I usually start puffing at it when it's too late.

And for sure don't do what I saw some Marines do in a video taken at their Mtn Warfare Trng center in CA once. They worked and worked to get a fire going, had a nice big one, then it just sank into the snow and went out...

Gently blow, it doesn't take a lot of blowing, just a little air movement. Once the magnesium gets burning get your fuel on it. I like to have lots of fuel ready because I only want to use the magnesium once.

You did one thing right. You tried this in a controlled situation. 20 minutes is a lifetime, correction, potential loss of a lifetime in a real situation. I don't know how many smug people I've met with a mag block covered in white oxidation who believe they have firemaking covered. what are your alternate methods? Have you tried them too?

I too have found it difficult to use the magnesium bar and flint. The only way I have been able to make it work is to use a leaf or somthing to hold the many flakes I need and then place my tinder on top of the flakes once I can get them started. I now prefer the Light My Fire fire steel to the magnesium and flint. It is more reliable. I can make fire in much less time.

John

my alt methods are of course good old water proof matches an I also have a water/wind proof lighter in the easy access pouches. I have an ALICE gear military set with all this equipment on it, I have started them with both the matches and the lighter, it took about three matches to get it started and the lighter only one try to get a fire started. I havent used my fire starting cubes yet but will try that out soon. BTW thanks for all the responces to my question.

Lots of good diagnostic questions so far, so I'm going toss in a few more:

Were you whittling or scraping the magnesium? Don't carve it off, all you'll do is ruin the edge on your knife, scrap it with the back of a piece of hacksaw blade or something (or a file works pretty spiffy here). The other thing is, whan you scraped the ferro rod, stainless steel works but not so well. Carbon steel, or the spine of that piece of hacksaw blade I just mentioned. Even a lower chromium stainless like what Victorinox and Leatherman use in there saw blades is going to work better than any of the "brighter" stainless steels. Carbon good/chrome bad.

I know the book says the size of a nickle- try going for a quarter sized pile, and it absolutely has to be contained. It should be on the tinder, but not in it, that pile is the amount that is a solid layer.

For blowing, air is good, but think of it as VERY long puff. Or the exhale during a long kiss (best way I can describe it folks, sorry).

TofuSoleSurvivor,
Try a little 000 steel wool, dry, all by itself with no magnesium. Of course, have your dry tinder and kindling at the ready. See if your Dad will bet against you on this one.

Take your steel wool (extra-fine "000" or "0000" is best), and pull off several wispy strands. Don;t just take a big bunch, but pull off a good little amount. Bunch it together, but leave it somewhat wispy for airflow. Using your striker, get some good sparks onto the steel wool, then gently blow (loooong gentle breaths) as your hands gently push your tinder down onto the wool. The wool might develop a flame, but more often than not, it will burn in hot embers.... more than enough to light your tinder. Now, if you find the wool doesn't burn hot or long enough to light the tinder, maybe you made it too wispy. Next practice attempt, use more wispy strands and rebunch them a little tighter together. This works even if the wool is damp (as if it got wet and you shook it off and blew on it to try and dry it), but save the wet attempts for later. I've praticed enough to where I'm confident I can do this inside of 2 minutes even on a blustery day, and you can too after a few practice attempts. And believe me, I'm no mountain man! Maybe you can try it a time or two, know you can do it, then show your dad.

Matches and lighters are great, I use them too. But judging by your first post, you're trying to go the hard way, which is good, because we don;t always have the other methods. So maybe give some thought to the steel wool method.

Good luck

+1 for no magnesium. A large ferro rod and treated cotton tinder is the way to go! <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I'm not a big fan of the magnesium fire starters. When you're cold or wet or its dark is no time scrape a whole lot of magnesium bits or keep a little pile of magnesium together in the wind. I'd rather take a ferrocerium rod and carry alcohol swabs, fine steel wool or waxed/vaselined cotton balls. They light easier, and are easier to prepare. The magnesium bars work, but they're one of my least favorite tinders. Nifty sounding ideas, but one hellva pain to use.

Let's face it, people.

Magnesium fire-starters are crap...

I use Coghlan's Emergency Tinder and a Fire-Steel

I am not a fan of magnesium either. I use a Swedish FireSteel, and plain old dryer lint.
I pack the dryer lint into a Water proof match canister. It's amazing how much that stuff compresses.

I've tried it under controlled conditions (RV camping with my parents, sister's family and her nieces) and was astonished at how difficult it was to keep the magnesium together and to get the sparks onto it.

I now consider the magnesium bar as a handle, not tinder.

I altered my kits to have a firesteel and good tinder.

This is the sort of thing the forum is so good for. Many ideas seem wonderful but they must be tested to prove them.

Unimogbert

Here's what works for me:

Don't bother trying to make a pile of magnesium shavings. Even if you do manage to keep it together, it burns so fast that by the time you drop the scraper and pick up your first piece of tinder, its too late.

Instead, use a bundle of finely shredded tinder material such as cedar bark. Make a small hole in it with your thumb and scrape some magnesium into this spot. You don't need too much.

Now rest the end of the firestarter near the hole and strike a spark. The spark lights the magnesium which lights the tinder. A few puffs and off you go.

I dunno what the fuss is with magnesium firestarter vs. firesteel - the magnesium is just extra tinder. If you don't like it, use it as a handle as Unimobert says.

I pried the ferro rod out of mine, trimmed 1/4" or so off the end, and stuck it inside the handle of my Becker Brute. It was the perfect size.

I have a magnesium bar plus flint firestarter and I don't really like it either. I do keep one in my first aid kit as a last ditch fire strarter.

To me, a Swedish fire steel with tinder is superior. I like the spark-lite tabs, cotton and vaseline, wet fire tinder, esbit fuel tabs, and fatwood better than the magnesium. I also carry a "tinder bag" basically a large zip lock that found tinder, like dry bark, goes into.

It's amazing how quickly you can get a fire started if you prepare first. On our last camping trip, everything was pretty wet and one of the dads there didn't think I would be able to get a fre started. A tinder bundle of crumpled up bark with a vaseline cotton ball in the middle with a couple of pieces of fatwood to dry out the kindling and our campfire was born in minutes. I had a huge pile of kindling standing by and three piles of firewood. Despite they heavy damp, we had our fire from mid-afternoon until everyone finally went to bed around midnight.

I don't know why people have so many problems using the mag bars. I've lit dozens of fires with them and never had much of a problem.

First off, I do use a piece of old hacksaw blade (the cheaper the better, the bimetal blades don't work as well as HS steel) with the teeth ground off. I scrape the shavings into a dried leaf or a wad of fine textured dried grass. You can even take bigger dead grass and rub it over a stick, or just beat it with a stick or rock. It'll break down the fibers so you can get a wad of wispy, hair like grass fibers. I don't scrape off a lot of magnesium, just enough to get a dusting maybe an inch square. Don't even really care if it's in a pile or not, just so it's caught up in the grass.

The best way to scrape the striker is to have the bar braced to the ground or on a rock at about a 45 degree angle with the wad of tinder under the corner that's lifted. When you strike the flint, put the hacksaw scaper firmly on the flint rod and scrape down firmly like you were trying to gouge it out. I've seen people doing a fast freehand scrape and they will only get a light shower of sparks. If you bear down firmly, more like you did to scrape the magnesium shavings, you'll get a heavy shower of hot sparks. If your tinder is really dry, you don't even need the magnesium.

The other method is to brace your hand holding the hacksaw scraper on the ground and pull the magnesium bar up. That works fine too, but I think the real trick is to do it firmly, and not the wild hitting striking at the flint thing. A little puff on the wad of grass and you'll have it flaming, ready to add to the tender.

A much easier way to use magnesium is to buy it in shreds form from a chemical supplier. Over here in the UK it was about $10 for 250g ( about 8 or 9 ounces). Seal amounts in a plastic drinking straw as you do cotton wool balls. When you need it, tear the end off and pour out the contents, add a suitable preprepared tinder pile and you have fire. I've used it this way several times and it's a lot easier than scraping it off a bar and the heat generated has always started a fire. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Forget magnesium bars.

Let me tell you the fire you need to think about: It's 7:00 PM, dark, November, steady rain, 35 deg. F, 20 mph sustained wind, you're freezing cold - if you can start THAT FIRE all the others are easy! There won't be a dry ball of grass anywhere - unless you brought it with you - and it won't be dry for long! So, here's my system:
- vaseline soaked lint or cotton balls (I'd want some at least size of golf ball)
- good sized ferro rod (you pick but go for a substantial one
- hacksaw scraper
- split down wood to get to dry center (crouching under poncho!) - look for birch, cedar, fat pine (or whatever in your region) - use the bark, too - sticks size of a pencil or smaller
- don't stop splitting until you have a pile "as big as your hat" (Horace Kephart)
- take three of the sticks and make a pile of shavings
- stick in vaseline ball
- strike fire and jump back!

If you need motivation read Jack London's "To Build A Fire"

Just my two cents!