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#77645 - 12/08/06 01:59 AM Re: Survival Food
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2851
Loc: La-USA
I just reviewed my BOB tonight, Let's see if my old, senile, paranoid memory will work.
I found that I carry the following (it's a very small, highly mobile bag): I have a Baja jacket, a U.S. Army poncho, 40 oz/water, 12vdc cell phone recharger, reading glasses, ink pen, 2 pieces/welder's soapstone, small & smaller multi-purpose knives, a mini flashlight/laser, messkit (with triox tablets, spoon, brillo pads, matches), chopsticks, sling w/clips, sterno stove w/2 small cans of sterno, whistle, extremely small FAK, survival kit in a can (marginal quality), bic lighter, compass, electrical tape, signal mirror, jeweler's screwdriver, leather lace, 8 oz/buffalo jerky, 23 pieces of hershey dark chocolate, 3-1gal & 1-1qt ziplock bags, 8 Slim Jims.
I use a U.S. Army duffle bag w/ruck sack type shoulder straps that I keep certain items and food in that is ready to go if I have to jump ship & walk home. That's another list but there are MRE's & other food items as well as gear in it.
Onboard ship, I always carry a Buck 110, Leatherman, mini-mag flashlight, lighter, smokes. I plan to take my Nav Kit w/me with a bic lighter, AA batteries, 110vac cell phone charger, ink pens, pencils, nav kit, log book, licenses, binoculars w/camara, AAA batteries, magic marker, mini flashlight, road maps, ziplock bags, & other things that I don't recall while I am too lazy to get it & inventory it here. Oh well!!
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QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#77646 - 12/08/06 11:19 AM Re: Survival Food
redflare Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/25/05
Posts: 647
Loc: SF Bay Area, CA
Well, survival rations, such as once by Datrex or other brands like Mayday and Survivor Industries, and army MREs are two different animals.
Basically emergency rations are composed of compressed, cooked wheat flour with oil.
Datrex brand, has coconut flakes, so it tastes like a coconut cake. IMHO it tastes pretty good for something designed to be eaten up to 5 years from manufacturing. Additionally, Datrex bars are subdivided into 200 calories chunks, and are sealed individually inside the 2400 or 3600 calorie overwrap. Pretty usefull if you are trying to ration your survival food, while at the same time keeping it from drying out too much.

Datrex Ingredients: Wheat flour, vegetable shortening, cane sugar, water, coconut,and salt.
Weight: 1.5lb (701g)/pack
Nutritional information:
Serving size: 1 bar, approximately 1.4 oz (42 g)
Servings per package: 18
Calories: 200
Carbohydrates: 27 g
Protein: 3 g
Total fat: 9 g
Sat fat: 2g
Mono–unsat: 6 g
Poly–unsat: 1 g
Sodium: 0.18%

Mayday bars to me tasted less moist then the Datrex once. Don't know if this is because of the extra soy powder they add to them, or the other ingredients, like vitamins etc. In a survival situation, vitamins are propably the least of your concerns. The bars tasted like a dry cinnamon cake. It felt like I needed more water to wash them down then the Datrex kind.

Mayday Ingredients: Enriched flour, vegetable shortening, sugar, corn syrup, soy flour, corn starch, potassium sorbate, vitamins (Vitamin A, iron, Vitamin E, riboflavin, Vitamin B6, Vitamin B12, pantothenic acid, copper, vitamin C, vitamin D, thiamine, niacin, folate, biotin, iodine, zinc), apple cinnamon flavoring.
Weight: 0.56lb (252g)/pack
Nutritional information:
Serving size: 1 bar, 1.5 oz (42.5 grams)
Servings per package: 6
Calories: 200
Carbohydrates: 27.5 g
Protein: 3.5 g
Total fat: 8.5 g
Sat fat: 1 g
Sodium: 1%

I haven't tasted the Survivor Industries (Mainstay) bars yet.


Edited by redflare (12/08/06 11:22 AM)

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#77647 - 12/08/06 01:45 PM Re: Survival Food
oldsoldier Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/25/06
Posts: 742
Loc: MA
I've gone a month at a time on MRE's in the Army before, and, apart from an apparent lack of variety, on a table (or even a chair) to sit at, they arent THAT bad. The newer ones have a quite large variety, and are FAR more palatable than the older ones in the dark green bags. We used to pack ramne noodles to make a sort of stew out of the dried beef or pork patties. Also, I learned a valuable lesson; ALWAYS use the heater packets for the main course; it makes it that much tastier. I was one who never bothered with that until a couple of years before I got out. What a difference in taste!
Nothing tastes better than that first meal, indoors, out of the elements, sitting at a clean table, after a month of eating MRE's out in the field.
One last mention of palatability; anyone here ever try the old cold winter rations that were army issue, in the 90's? Ugh...choking those down were an experinece in & of itself.
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#77648 - 12/08/06 07:18 PM Re: Survival Food
picard120 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 07/10/05
Posts: 763
How much calories does a MRE dinner bag have?

you mentioned that you mixed it with ramen noodles to make it palatible. I found ramen noodles lacking sufficient calories for the body to be active outdoors.

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#77649 - 12/09/06 05:20 AM Re: Survival Food
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
In the box that is ALWAYS in the back of our vehicle, in addition to the single burner propane stove (I gave my XGK to my step-son) with two new cylinders and a backpacking sized cook kit, are a bunch of "energy" bars,a bunch of MRE entrees (they are pretty good unless you have to eat them for months on end), and a lot of canned foods that can be eaten hot or cold. As in Spam ('nuff said about that), baked beans, chili, stew, etc. My wife and I figure that with the amount we have, we could eat pretty well for at least three days, and a lot longer by stretching it. Also instant coffee, tea bags, sugar packets (altho we do not usually put that stuff in our coffee/tea), and cocoa. Sitting right next to that box is the box with the emergency repair goodies, and the "Runt" 2.5 gallon version of the USGI plastic water container. Scattered throughout the vehicle are a bunck of Kirkland water bottles, and our two day packs have full hydration bladders...
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#77650 - 12/09/06 01:00 PM Re: Survival Food
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
I believe the main entree varies from around 650 up to 1100 calories. As big as I am, they always satisfied my appetite well enough.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#77651 - 12/09/06 03:47 PM Re: Survival Food
AROTC Offline
Addict

Registered: 05/06/04
Posts: 604
Loc: Manhattan
I think we decided the whole package was ~1300 calories, depending on the meal. I personally like MREs for the job they were designed to do. The 2005-2006 production of MREs include things like: White chocolate/rasberry cookie, cheese nips, smoke house almonds,and chocolate peanut butter spread. They got rid of Country Captain Chicken in 2005 and introduced a new omelet. In 2006 they're getting rid of the beefsteak with mushroom gravy and the chicken tetrazzini. I think MRE's are great for what they are. In a short survival situation, or the first couple of high paced days of a longer survival situation, I would choose MREs as a food source. The package is self contained besides drinking water and water to activate the heater. Unlike other food options, three MREs are not three meals. Three MREs contain three entrees, three desserts, three sides/snacks and more. In ROTC, completing 6 two hour missions a day, plus setting up and tearing down a camp, three MREs was more then enough food each day. I threw away almost as much food each time I got new MREs as I ate so I wouldn't have to carry the weight, and I for one didn't lose any weight. That said, yes they do constipate you, yes they are a hellva lot better hot, and yes I did enjoy that first hot meal afterwards.


Edited by AROTC (12/09/06 04:35 PM)
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A gentleman should always be able to break his fast in the manner of a gentleman where so ever he may find himself.--Good Omens

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#77652 - 12/09/06 04:28 PM Re: Survival Food
AROTC Offline
Addict

Registered: 05/06/04
Posts: 604
Loc: Manhattan
Okay, so I've been reading peoples posts and thinking about this subject for my own needs for a while now. So here's a list I came up with.

MREs: Military field rations, designed for an active soldier. Pros: Well balanced, high calories, designed for activity, easy to prepare, decent meals, long shelf life. Cons: heavy, expensive, not great for long periods.

Dehydrated food: There are two types of this, both made by the same company. The first is backpacking food. Pouches contain an entree or dessert or breakfast item. Pros: Lightweight, relatively easy to prepare, long shelf life, tasty. Cons: expensive, need boiling water to prepare, each pouch is just a meal, no goodies, sides are extra. The second type is emergency storage food. These are stored in #10 cans, are stable for 25 years but are otherwise similar to backpacking food. Pros: extremely long life, less expensive then MREs or Backpacking food, probably as tasty as backpacking food, meals (eg spagetti) or staples (eg diced beef). Cons: um, needs external water and heating, have to buy goodies, sides, snacks seperately, unless you want to power through a can of scrambled eggs (17 2/3 cup servings to a can) before you can eat spagetti you open a lot of food you may not need for a short disaster and it has to be eaten in 2-3 weeks.

Canned goods from the store: Buy a couple extra everytime you shop. Pros: eat what you normally eat, easy to stockpile, pretty cheap, decent shelf life. Cons: can be heavy, have to be careful to get the nutrients and calories you need since things like canned vegetables have little of either, have to plan menus they aren't self contained.

Datrex/Mainstay: Life boat rations. Pros: Long shelf life, compact. Cons: basically starvation rations, fine if you're sitting tight and waiting for rescue, no where near enough food for an active survivor.

Pemmican: No experience. Eager to try the idea out. Pros?: Tasty, good shelf life, high in calories. Cons?: shelf life compared to canned or retort pouch food, possibly nutrient balance, possibly menu fatigue

Food choices depend on what you're doing and how. Bugging out on foot, dehydrated backpack food is probably best. Bugging in for the long haul, store bought food or canned dehydrated emergency food. Lost on the trail, maybe an MRE in your ruck or a bag of pemmican.

These are my conclusions, your needs or opinions may vary. Let me know what I've forgotten or overlooked.
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A gentleman should always be able to break his fast in the manner of a gentleman where so ever he may find himself.--Good Omens

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#77653 - 12/09/06 05:47 PM Re: Survival Food (Jerky..longer post)
Excomantia Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 98
Loc: Moved to my new home and now h...
Excerpt about makeing jerky from the book I mentioned:
Quote:
...(Jerky) may not be quite as tasty as fresh meat, but it has much food value and actually is very good. It has the advantage of being light in weight and of keeping indefinitely, so long as it is kept perfectly dry...
...Jerky can be made out of almost any piece of meat. The piece can be small, only a pound or so, or large, up to several pounds in size. Of corse it must be removed from the bone and kept in chunk form. A very sharp butcher knife is required. A hunting knife is too thick-edged and usually too short for the job...
...First, cut straight through the center of the piece, stopping within a quarter of an inch of going clear through. Then the process is practically like unrolling the meat, first one side of the chunk and then the other (Drawing reference here). Hold the meat on the palm of the hand and work the knife carfully along through the meat, parallel to the surface of the palm. Be careful you do not cut yourself, and don't be discouraged if at first it seems very slow.... ...one little chunk opens up into a long, thin slice, many inches in length. We have seen pieces fire and six feet long! You will end up by discovering that you have only about one pound of jerky for every five pounds of fresh meat you start with. But, you still have the real meat and all of its food value. All you have lost is water.
Skewers, usually of plum or cherry wood, are made to keep the long strips spread while drying. These are pointed at both ends and merely caught on each side of the strip. The strips are then hung in the hot sun on poles of the drying racks, which are made in various forms, high enough so that the dogs cannot reach them. Bruce Yellowtail made a big fuss when his grandmother hung some of her jerky on his radio aerial!
You need not worry about flies. The meat is cut so thin, not much over a quarter of an inch in thickness, that flies cannot "blow" it. And the cleaner the camp is kept, the fewer flies there will be. Very few flies will even alight on the meat. Even if they do, sunlight is a good disinfectant, and most people prefer the jerky cooked, further eliminating any danger of contamination.
While drying the meat, make sure that no two surfaces touch. In the hot sun, jerky will dry hard in a couple of days. It should be removed at night, piled up on a clean canvas and covered, so it will not absorb moisture from the atmosphere... ...When it is properly cured, it is nearly as hard as iron, about the consistency of sole leather, but we can assure you that it does not taste like it.
...It can be cared for...by keeping it in cloth sacks which are in the air and dry all the time. For an extended period of time it can be kept in a big tin can, like a lard can. If the meat gets damp, or is unprotected in a dark place, it may be attacked by weevils.
Jerky is sometimes eaten "as is," but is best when cooked. One method of cooking is to break it up into little pieces, barely cover them with water, and simmer until soft. The jerky will never regain the original plumpness and texture of the meat, but it will become quite tender, depending upon what cut of meat it was made from in the first place. Salt the stew to taste, and, if you like, thicken the broth with a little flower for a rich gravy.
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Excomantia

Words Mean Something.

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#77654 - 12/09/06 06:09 PM Re: Survival Food (Pemmican...longer post)
Excomantia Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 98
Loc: Moved to my new home and now h...
Excerpt from the book I mentioned about pemmican..
Quote:
To make pemmican, first roast jerky over coals until the grease begins to show and it takes on a ritch brown color like seared fresh meat. This in itself is a good way to prepare jerky for eating. It is rather crunchy but very tasty. To continue with the pemmican, pound the roasted jerky fine. This is done on a clean canvas or oil-cloth, using a smooth, flat stone for an anvil and the back of an axe for the pounder. Formerly a stone hammer, set in rawhide, was used.
Now dry fresh chokecherries just enough to take out the excess moisture, then pound in the same way, enough to reduce the pits to as fine a pulp as possible. Mix some of this cherry pulp with the pounded jerky, pour melted suet (the hard fatty tissue about the loins and kidneys of beef, sheep, etc., used in cooking or processed to yield tallow) over the whole mass, mix it thoroughly, and then pat into egg-shaped balls. These balls can be preserved in oiled silk or in a plastic bag. In the old days, the pemmican, instead of being made into balls, was stored in cases made of bladders or of rawhide, with melted suet poured over it, and sealed completely...
...Service berries, or June berries, sometimes called squawberries, can be used in the same way. Sometimes nowadays the pemmican is made without any fruit, a little sugar being added instead. But it is not so rich or tasty as the old kind...
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Words Mean Something.

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