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#75292 - 10/23/06 03:36 PM Cellphones and text messaging
Anonymous
Unregistered


I've seen it mentioned here, at least a couple of times, that when you can't get a cell signal that text messaging might work. Could someone clarify this for me?

I know that in emergencies, such as in NOLA after Katrina, the cells were jammed with traffic. While voice calls couldn't be completed, text messages were going through because they require very little bandwidth as compared to a voice transmission.

It seems to me that if one cannot communicate with the nearest cell tower for whatever reason (distance, obstruction, it's just plain broke, whatever), your text message isn't going through either.

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#75293 - 10/23/06 04:35 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
To make a voice call, you need to have a usable signal continuously for the time it takes to dial, get the other person to answer, say what you have to say, and possibly get a reply.

To send a text message, even if you have no signal at the moment, you can type the message and have it waiting in the "outbox". Then you can wander around waving the phone in the air or whatever. If the phone sees a usable signal, even for a moment, it can send the message.

Likewise, since text messages are short and can be queued up to send in the gaps between voice calls, they should be helpful for getting through during times of very high traffic.

Now, *in general* a low-bandwidth text message can be sent with a much weaker signal and more interference than a high-bandwidth voice transmission. I don't know to what degree actual cell phones take advantage of this fact.

Finally, be aware that I personally don't have a lot of experience in using cell phones with poor signals as I live in an area where the coverage is virtually continuous.
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#75294 - 10/23/06 04:51 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Arney Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/15/05
Posts: 2485
Loc: California
Quote:
To send a text message, even if you have no signal at the moment, you can type the message and have it waiting in the "outbox"...If the phone sees a usable signal, even for a moment, it can send the message.


And let's not forget, the store-and-forward capability exists from the network to the recipient as well. If the recipient's phone is off or otherwise not reachable by the network, the system will try to deliver the text message the next time the recipient's phone connects to the network. It's not totally foolproof since different networks will expire a message after checking if the recipient is on the network a certain number of times or after holding onto the message for a certain length of time.

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#75295 - 10/23/06 05:06 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Anonymous
Unregistered


Ah... I can see where queuing would be real handy. I knew the text messages were squeeking by in unused intervals of time. Didn't stop to think it was because they were queued up in the phone itself, thanks.

Cellphone novice here. In ten years of lugging the things around I think I've made/gotten about 4 calls total (it's for emergencies only, but my landline use isn't all that frequent either).

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#75296 - 10/23/06 05:07 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Arney Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/15/05
Posts: 2485
Loc: California
Low-bandwidth is not the only advantage of text messages, although that's a huge one. As Thseng pointed out, store-and-forward let's a busy network queue up messages and they can squirt through when the network is available.

The other reason why text messages often sail through while voice calls have overloaded the nearest cell tower is because (at least with GSM) text messages are transmitted on a signalling channel, not the main voice channel. The singalling channel carries info like telling you that a voicemail has arrived, so it would never be jammed with voice traffic.

I have no idea if bandwidth-intensive uses like the newer video messages or ring tones are sent through the signalling channel, though. If they did, then thousands of people sending videos of their destroyed homes or whatever at the same time would easily block the ability to send text messages, too. I don't remember, but I don't think video messages were really around yet during 9/11. That would be the kind of situation where a lot of people could've been trying to send video messages at the same time in a small location. The London train/bus bombings was definitely in the age of video messages, but I never read anything about video messages clogging the system, though, although I read that voice calls were jammed. Maybe video messages are not really something to worry about during a disaster. Still, I'm sure they eat up your phone batteries to send and play back.

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#75297 - 10/23/06 05:27 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:

The other reason why text messages often sail through while voice calls have overloaded the nearest cell tower is because (at least with GSM) text messages are transmitted on a signalling channel, not the main voice channel. The singalling channel carries info like telling you that a voicemail has arrived, so it would never be jammed with voice traffic.


Another big plus for SMS that I wasn't aware of. Thanks.

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#75298 - 10/23/06 06:11 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
JohnN Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 10/10/01
Posts: 966
Loc: Seattle, WA

We should also remember that text messaging isn't a reliable protocol. Just because it indicates it was sent, doesn't mean it got there.

-john

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#75299 - 10/23/06 06:48 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Craig_phx Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 04/05/05
Posts: 715
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
I upgraded my wife's and my cell phones after I heard about SMS working and voice not getting through during Katrina. <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Thermo-regulate, hydrate and communicate.

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#75300 - 10/23/06 11:24 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
ki4buc Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/10/03
Posts: 710
Loc: Augusta, GA
I believe SMS does this no matter the carrier. The reason you can't make a call in a disaster is the voice channels are full. There may be as little as 1 channel on a tower, or up to 8. If you have to talk via voice. Please, pass your message quickly.

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#75301 - 10/24/06 12:51 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2997
I did after September 11, 2001. That was the only day so far we couldn't make a call, kept getting a fast busy. I called my wife from my office phone before I left to pick her up and told her to walk east on a specific street and I would circle around the building where she worked and drive alonside that sidewalk until I found her in the mess. It was espically bad for us because she worked in a tall building for a law firm which quietly called all their lawyers and told them to evacuate but didn't allow staff to leave until the lawyers were all safely out of the building.

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#75302 - 10/24/06 03:20 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Blast Offline
INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3760
Loc: TX
Quote:
quietly called all their lawyers and told them to evacuate but didn't allow staff to leave until the lawyers were all safely out of the building.

Ye flipping gods!!!
<img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />
-Blast
_________________________
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Medicine Man Plant Co.
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Radio Call Sign: KI5BOG
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#75303 - 10/24/06 04:18 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
KG2V Offline

Veteran

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1371
Loc: Queens, New York City
I would hope that the next day EVERY non lawyer in the place told the lawyers were to stick it - and never came back
_________________________
73 de KG2V
You are what you do when it counts - The Masso
Homepage: http://www.thegallos.com
Blog: http://kg2v.blogspot.com

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#75304 - 10/24/06 04:18 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2997
Yea, while her and all the rest of the 'staff' were asking to leave they kept being told they hadn't recieved authorization from the higher ups. My wife was their primary payroll person at the time so she said "I'm leaving" and no one wnated to argue with the person who sends the paychecks so she got out of there.
Telling that story to others in the years after I found that was a common thing, the most valueable people to the company were the ones who got to leave first then the "replaceable" people were let go.
Now when something happens at work, be it a drill or not, I break some of the rules and get out of there because I don't know if the security staff is acting in my best interest or in the best interest of someone high up in the company. They might yell at us to get to the right on the stairs or go down a designated stairwell but I don't listen anyore, its unfortunat that one can't trust the people who are supposed to be keeping me secure but its a real issue now after that incident at her work.

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#75305 - 10/24/06 07:18 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
JimJr Offline
Member

Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 133
Loc: Central Mississippi
I consider everyone that I work with (small state gov. agency) a "valuable human being", regardless of what they do (or don't do). And I am the person responsible for seeing that our employees are evacuated.

In cases where limited evacuation is the only alternative, I have adopted the philosophy espoused by Roger Moore's character in the movie "ffolkes" (aka "North Sea Hijack" and "Assault Force") - the youngest ones go first, the older ones have had their chance.

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#75306 - 10/24/06 08:15 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Leigh_Ratcliffe Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/06
Posts: 1355
Loc: United Kingdom.
I would love to see some [censored] try to tell me that I cannot leave the building because some shirt hasn't been evacuated yet.
Pregnant women and Kid's, yes. Some tie, No.
Anti-Lemming Rules of Engagement now in force.
_________________________
I don't do dumb & helpless.

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#75307 - 10/25/06 01:22 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
KG2V Offline

Veteran

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1371
Loc: Queens, New York City
BTW That said (re not waiting for the suits) - there is a darned good chance I'll be the LAST person off my floor. I'm one of the floor wardens, and I take my job seriously - VERY seriously. When the FD gets to my floor, they WILL find office doors marked with SAR markings - The FD chief who gives us our drills always laughs at coming to out floor - because we all know the answers, and the fire team on the floor actually takes their job seriously - to the point we make a POINT of showing up at the drills with our scanners running on FD freqs, and our go bags with us.. (yeah all 6 wardens/searchers have go bags - and all have first aid cards).

We had what turned out to me a false alarm about 6 months ago - we HAD the floor 1/2 evac'd, search started, by the time the fire center in the lobby answered the warden phone, and they told me that they had tripped a false alarm, and I should stop the evac. Had to go remove the chalk marks off some doors - but so what

You always get the folks who are "It's probably a false alarm" - I've found when a person walks in and looks at them and says "MOVE...NOW" - they move.. learn the "command voice" - it work. I'm also not afraid to reach across a desk and hang up a phone, or unplug a computer. If your moving - you at least get to save the work on your PC - I get to your desk, and your still on the PC - I'll unplug it
_________________________
73 de KG2V
You are what you do when it counts - The Masso
Homepage: http://www.thegallos.com
Blog: http://kg2v.blogspot.com

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#75308 - 10/25/06 05:27 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
JFBat Offline
Stranger

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 18
Loc: NYC
Jeez. She should have killed a lawyer on her way out of the building, just on principle . . .

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#75309 - 10/25/06 06:42 PM Re: Cellphones and text messaging
Leigh_Ratcliffe Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/06
Posts: 1355
Loc: United Kingdom.
My point is that the cleaner with twenty grandchildren is just as valuable as some shirt. Its the gross disloyalty shown by the company to it's ordinary staff that most of us have an "issue" with.
If I was the CEO/Managing Director of that company, the oik who decided "Lawyers first" would have been dismissed without references the next day.
p.s. My compliments on you and your teams professional attitude. Pity there ain't a few more like you. <img src="/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
I don't do dumb & helpless.

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