Don't get me wrong , I like guns , enjoy shooting at the range and feel it is a necassary tool for " survival " . Sometimes here and many times on other forums , people say you need a different tool " firearm " for different jobs . A military type " battle" rifle for attacks by multiple bad guys . A bolt action in 308 or 30-06 for long range . A 22 for small game . A shotgun for home defence and hunting . And of course a semi auto handgun or 2 or 3 o r 4 . Let's say things were so bad that you needed that battle rifle to fend of attacks by multiple "bad guys" . How long do you think you could survive these shootouts ? What if things got to the point that you needed to hunt to survive . How long do you think it would take before all game was wiped out in your area . all I'm saying is that maybe we shouldn't give some "newbies" the wrong idea . If you can afford many firearms and enjoy having them thats great . But for survival / self defence I think a pump 12ga. shotgun [I like the Remington 870 12 ga.] and a good quality handgun [ my choice is the RugerGP100 revolver] is all you really need. IMO you'd be better off spending money on food , water and other items than on multiple firearms and thousands of rounds of ammo.

For SHTF/TEOTWAWKI bug out survival, I tend to agree with you, less is more. The possible caveat to that though is ammo for the 12 ga is going to be a lot of weight to move around with. My last chance kit is a lever action and a revolver, both in .44mag, with both stopping loads, and shot shells. Not much you can't cover with that combination of ammo.

For bug in, especially with friends and family, more is better.

Malpaso - What do you use the 44 mag shotshells for ? I think they make shotshells for my 357 mag too but I've never seen any at my gun shop .. I would think that the effective range would be extremely short . Also , wouldn't repeated use of the shotshells screw up the rifeling ?

I agree that the 12 ga ammo weight would be an issue . I also like the idea of common ammo for handgun and rifle . But , I think that there are more shotguns out there than any other firearm , including 22 , and ammo would be easier to aquire.

I've never *used* the shotshells, the plan is to use them for snakes, squirrels, etc. As I understand it, the pattern after a few feet is not reliable, so birds are probably not a dependable target. The handgun shotshells are definitely not a replacement for a shotgun, the tradeoff is weight.

I got CCI shotshells at a gun show recently. The guy had multiple calibers for sale.

You are right and you are wrong. It is just like knives, do you need a 10" Rambo or a practical 4" Mora? Individual perceptions, experience and tastes dictate choices.
Myself in a bunch of bad guys senario, I would like a Browning .50 cal MG, guess I will never have one, so I need to avoid crowds of bad guys. None of my single action revolvers will be very effective, except for the first 5 "subjects".

I have never used them in a rifle, but I have been "attacked" by a lot of rattlesnakes, and forced to defend myself with a 4" .357 loaded with CCI shotshells. Usually at a range of four-five feet, sometimes they would almost take the snake's head off, other times I would see dimples appear, then disappear, on the top of the head, and old mister snake continued his attack. My follow-up round of Remington 125 gr HP never failed to do the trick. So do not rely too much on shot shells, at least in .38/.357. I can't say about .44's, I sold my Model 29 (sniff sniff) before I ever got a chance to try them...

22LR shotshells will work for birds at 15-20' from a rifle. Granddad used to use them to keep the birds from eating everything off the cherry tree.

I would say four as a minumum battery, assuming you are sticking close to home.

- A .22LR rifle for all the obvious reasons, OR very accurate (target grade, not compition) .22 revolver or autoloader ("race dragon"), OR pumped/lever charged .22 caliber air rifle (sneaky quiet, to, but not quite as much range).
- A 12ga shotgun, either pump or double (or a very unpicky auto), as it will be the most verstile thing you'll ever own.
- An auto-loading or pump action rifle in .243, .308 or .30-06 with a detachable box magazine (get some larger ones), or less preferably a .30-30 lever action.
- A good revolver, either .357 or .44 Mag, for defense, OR an autoloader in 9mm or .45ACP (.40S&W isn't that wide spread yet, still).

And if we want to talk TEOTWAKI, add in something .223 (preferably using mil-spec mags) and a flintlock (do you have to ask?).

Now, if I'm running for the hills, then the .308 and the race dragon. The .22 will kill anything under 50 pounds pretty consistantly with a good load and straight shooting, and the .308 covers everything up from the 50 pound range.

Don't laugh, but I have a slingshot in my bug out bag. Almost unlimited ammo that I don't have to carry on me and being fairly accurate, can feed me and my family with small game. Even taken fish swimming on the surface with a slingshot. If I have to, I can make a bamboo bow for bigger stuff. Like I tell my wife, sticks and string and rocks and I am good to go.

Wrist Rocket to the rescue!

Sue

I like the 7.62 X 39 over the 223. I run mine out of an old russian AK and a min.30.
I have been looking at a 454 but the price of the ammo is pushing me away, and I just can not think of a good reason to have a hand cannon. So I will probaly just stick with the 9mm.

Different guns have different uses. You don't use the same hammer for all uses. You wouldn't use a sledgehammer to drive a tack, & a tack hammer won't drive large stakes into the ground. Some guns put out a large volumn of fire, some are single shot tack drivers.

Of course, slingshots are illegal in MA, like most everything except government overspending.

Interesting read on snake shot:

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot30.htm

And, for those who have not visited his web site before, there is LOTS of good reading there.

So, how exactly does one get good at using a slingshot? Don't say "Practice, practice, practice" because I think that there is something that I am missing. Slingshots do not exactly have sights, and I have never been able to get anywhere near my targets.

Is there a web site somewhere explaining proper slingshot usage?

Handyman,

People who own guns rarely worry about how few they "need." What really concerns us is how many we can accumulate without severely pissing off the wife.

Malpaso --- slingshots are ilegal in MA. ????????? Are you sure . I've never heard that before . I was thinking about ordering one from Cabela's

http://law.onecle.com/massachusetts/269/12.html

I picked up a sling shot back in March and after about 3 weeks of shooting it for about 30 minutes a few days a week I got to were I could hit a cigarette pack at about 40 feet.

Then I seen one that had sights on it at a local gun shop so I got it, and I don’t see how people use the sights, I could not hit a pie plate at 10 feet with it..

Like all things if you don’t practice you wont become good at it, not many people can just pick up a hand gun or rifle and shoot like a pro. The same with a slingshot or a Bow, it just takes patients and practice, practice, practice.

Consistancy of ammo is a big thing. I've used marbles and various sizes of ball bearings, but I like #1 buckshot the best. Buy it in the big bag, shoot into something like a large shipping box filled with something like rags or wadded newspaper so can recover your shot, and practice.

It takes, IMHO, a lot more practice than any other ranged weapon other than thrown knives (which are worthless but for sport) and true slings (to make a good slinger, start by training his great-great-grandfather, and make them a family of shepards).

Aloha Harrkev,

I do not know of a website, but I am sure google will turn up at least a few.

As for learning...it would be the same as everything else. First, try to learn what you can. That way you have information.

Then pick one up and play with it. Don't just take a bunch of shots and put it down. Try to really get a feel for it. Try different things and see how it works. See what aiming technique works for you. Try different ammunition. (I even did a pouch full of bb's. For me, not real accurate but see the spread. Shooting it into water gives me an idea of what the spread looks like.) See what doesn't work. Now you have experience.

When you can integrate the information and the experience to get your solution, then you have knowledge.

Don't ignore the failures. We probably learn more when we study what didn't work than what worked. And we learn the most when we are in the "consciously competent" phase of doing something.

I did see a mean looking slingshot with built in laser sights. It looked powerful and accurate, but I kind of like my low tech, simple version. Less chance of equipment failure and easier to replicate in the field, if need be.

Roger that! <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />