#71142 - 08/22/06 03:11 AM
DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3760
Loc: TX
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So far, so good. I made two electrodes from the lead of a #2 pencil and attached them to the leads of a 9-volt battery clip, then covered them but for 1/4 inch with shrink tubing. I drilled a hole in the bakelite cap of a 2mL bottle and stuck the bare portion of the electrodes through it into the bottle. The electrodes were held in place and the hole sealed with 5-minute epoxy. MIOX states that a 60g NaCl per liter of water solution works best for making the mixed oxidants. This translates into about 2oz salt in 500 mL of water. The EPA states that municiple tap water should contain between 0.1 and 0.2 ppm (parts per million) of free chlorine to be considered safe. I picked up a "3-way test kit" (designed for measuring free chlorine in pools) for $5 from Walmart. It's capable of measuring from 0.5 to 5 ppm of free chlorine. ).5 is a bit high, but oh well. So, the test: I placed 1mL of the 60g/L NaCl (salt) solution in the 2mL bottle and ran current through it for 2.5 minutes. This 1mL solution was then added to 5mL of deionized water which was already in the test kit. The resulting solution was 2-4ppm, 10-20 times too concentrated. Cool, I'm making free chlorine! What this all means: The system works albeit at a slow rate. This is partially due to not using a fully-charged battery (the 9-volt was only putting out 6 volts) and not using a large enough sample of the salt water solution. My next step will be to rebuild the device using a 5 mL bottle, longer electrodes and a new battery. Then I'll have to test it on some pond water to see what happens. I'd also like to get some free-chlorine test strips rather than use the 3-way test kit, but Walmart was out of those. Anyone with a pool want to donate 6 test strips to help support this research? <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Massacre's idea of incorporating a multimeter into this setup is good, but somewhat beyond the scope of this project. I'm just trying to make the simplest system possible because, well, I'm lazy. -Blast
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#71143 - 08/22/06 04:16 AM
Re: DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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Old Hand
Registered: 12/07/05
Posts: 781
Loc: Central Illinois
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Hey Blast, cool results! I just swapped out all of my fire alarm batteries and they seem to be in good shape (they are backup on an AC driven system). So I have plenty of experimental stock now; but I can't find a no.2 pencil to save my life. Anyway, I really like your idea of making a more permanent setup with the reaction "cup" drillilled for the nodes and fixing them with epoxy! Hacking done right. :-)
Oh, and the multimeter idea would be useful getting some information about the reaction while at home, but I didn't mean to keep it with the kit permanently. Any idea how big the reaction chamber is on the MIOX pen? I'm curious due to the fact that the same chamber/concentration can produce 1-4L of MIOX treatment from the same volume, so time is definitely a factor along with available salt. As I said earlier, I also wonder if they are altering the current. Also, you treated 5ml (total of 6ml) and got 2-4ppm - remember that on non-pure water you'll consume that chlorine... the test is for residual concentration.
Thanks for sharing your results.
_________________________
Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards.
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#71145 - 08/22/06 04:29 PM
Re: DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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Old Hand
Registered: 12/07/05
Posts: 781
Loc: Central Illinois
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Awesome. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Yeah, I knew that the volume of water really didn't change, but the length of time does (and that length is also based on salt concentration/conductivity). I didn't know it was 2.75ml. That gives a nice target for a home-brew setup. I might have to stop and get a pool test kit tonight. Oh, and some pencils in the back-to-school aisle. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
The best part is that anyone could make a field expedient unit from a toy! Maybe we can get Les Stroud to try it on his show.
_________________________
Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards.
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#71146 - 08/23/06 02:11 AM
Re: DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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Cranky Geek
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 4642
Loc: Vermont
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So, when we get the conentration right, does anyone know where we can order some cryptosporidium spores, so the effectiveness can be tested?
_________________________
-IronRaven
When a man dare not speak without malice for fear of giving insult, that is when truth starts to die. Truth is the truest freedom.
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#71147 - 08/23/06 02:34 AM
Re: DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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Old Hand
Registered: 12/07/05
Posts: 781
Loc: Central Illinois
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All things being equal, if you get the concentrations right and have an actual MIOX pen for comparison I think that's unnecessary. The process is the same, so the mixed oxidants will be the same. The only potential difference here would be the carbon electrodes vs. the platinum covered titanium. I suppose that any given water supply has plenty of dissolved minerals that could give a few unwanted byproducts. But the sheer amount of carbon could potentially give off carbon tetrachloride, which is no good for the system. One way to eliminate any risk and get the same results would be to use gold or platinum coated nodes (many home entertainment cables are so coated).
I wouldn't really want to be testing with that stuff outside of a lab's controlled conditions and to get real results, it wouldn't be cheap. I'd rather take advantage of the research already done and simply copy the system on the cheap. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards.
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#71148 - 08/23/06 02:49 AM
Re: DIY MIOX: Preliminary results
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Cranky Geek
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 4642
Loc: Vermont
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Oh, but that's not as much fun. I know, crypto is heavy- we could always use giardia. All we need is a volunteer with sick time left this year....
*looks around at the group* It's in the name of survival science. You'll even get a treat. *holds out a mainstay bar*
_________________________
-IronRaven
When a man dare not speak without malice for fear of giving insult, that is when truth starts to die. Truth is the truest freedom.
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#71150 - 08/24/06 10:07 PM
Re: DIY MIOX: More results
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Old Hand
Registered: 12/07/05
Posts: 781
Loc: Central Illinois
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One thing is for sure... they'll be disinfected! <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I can't imagine it would harm them unless it's really thin plated gold. Solid gold or quality plating should work great without harm to your newfound electrodes. I think they make epoxy that's chem resistant, but I bet the shrink tubing is the culprit.
_________________________
Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards.
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#71151 - 09/07/06 11:44 PM
Re: DIY MIOX
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Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 18
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I just happen to have some platinum wire (Type B thermocouple) and I soldered it to a 9V battey cap like above. For a container, I used a mini travel size Scoop mouthwash container. I only have a HD 9V (not alkline) but I ran it for 30 minutes, and it bubbled on the positive lead the whole time. The resulting solution had more than 10 ppm chlorine (max reading on pool test strip)
To test the effectiveness, I added the solution to a glass of ice tea. I read a review of the MIOX somewhere, where it said it made ice tea clear, and removed the tea taste.
My tea ended up tasting slightly bleachy, and salty, and still very much like tea.
I'll get a fresh battery or use a power supply and try again.
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