For a set of survival fishing kit instructions (for land, not sea use, IOW streams and ponds, etc. either by hand or using an improvised pole) I am working on, I have to decide what fishing knots to show. The parameters are 1. Simple and easy to tie (idiot proof), 2. Easy to show in an illustration a novice can follow (idiot proof), 3. Enough to get the job done using very basic tackle, nothing more. With regards the latter, they need to be able to 1. attach a hook or lure to the line, 2. attach a swivel, etc, in the tackle, 3. splice two lines together, 4. tie a loop in the end of a line

For starters, I have selected the Polomar, Improved Cinch, Surgeon, and Surgeon's Loop:



Comments and suggestions on any or all of this are welcome.

TIA,

How about the double fisherman.

Pete

Doug, All those knots are the best you can use for the intended application. The problem is that they can be hard to tie for those that have never tied mono before. I cannot comment on woven/twisted as I have never tried. The simplest knots are the simple overhand or the surgeon loop. Through the shank eye and around the hook. Works for swivels and sinkers. It can join two lines in the same manner (i.e., thread loop through the eye/loop of the other piece and then take the tail through the eye). Worked for years for snapper and other small s/w bay fish.

You might want to add a line to the effect that 5-20 pre-tied hooks are a very worthwhile addition to a small fishing kit. Gives them something to be going on with. Also, a small sewing needle makes monofilament line much easier to tie. Tell them to generious with the amount of line they carry. Are you planning to bring out a supplimental fishing kit for longer survival scenario's?

The double fisherman's is a great knot for tying two pieces of rope together, and often used by climbers. I seem to recall when we tried to use it previously, we had difficulty with novices tying it. Ended up using the regular 9single) fisherman's knot. Not quite as secure, but easy to tie. Will have to play with some illustrations and give it another shot. I know it works great on braided line, not sure how well for monofiliment.

This is for an already made up kit.

Thanks. Will play with those.

Good. What's in it and what advice are you giving about the best place's to drop a hook? For a non-fishing City Slicker who's now got to keep body and soul together.

I'm all thumbs when it comes to knots so I use the Palomar for just about everything. It's especially easy to use when your hands are wet and cold.

The components are still taking shape, nothing fancy at all, very basic. It is designd to be part of a larger kit, so there's nothing in it but fishing gear.

The instructions will become part of an upcoming publication.

Oops, sorry forgot to mention : For tying two lines together, overhand knot, half hitch the ends. Great favorite in the climbing community. Not elegant but very effective.

Since fishing requires being passively active (or actively passive) I’d like to know how to make a gillnet with, say, dental floss. This would allow time for tender gathering or other active survival chores.

Pat

Doug

I've never liked the improved cinch (don't know why it's the knot featured on just about every pack of fishhooks sold). It's a damn difficult knot to tie with monofiliment in the best of circumstances.

Palomar is good.

I actually find a snell (sp?) pretty easy to tie. Don't know if it's a real snell or just looks like a snell, but it's very similar to the improved cinch except instead of wrapping around the floppy mono, you wrap around the shank of the hook. Pass 4 or 5 inches through the eye. Make a loop and pass 1 inch through eye again, same direction. Pinch free end against shank with index finger and thumb, grab loop with other hand and wrap 5 or 6 wraps around shank and end of line. Carefully pull free end while holding wraps snug and everything tightens up around the shank like a hangmans noose. I'd once found a very clear illustration of this on net. I'll look and see if I can find it again.

Ratcliffs discription is a good easy way to join two lines. Don't know how good for dissimilar lines though.

Actually, I've come to the conclusion that the point of fishing in a typical short term survival circumstance isn't to catch fish, it's to entertain yourself and keep you out of trouble. If you do happen to catch something, great, but it's a luxury. YMMV...

So, that sort of flies in the face of your goal, unless the making of the gill net is the choice for keeping yourself busy. <g> BTW, they take a good deal of time and effort if you've never done one before, so not something you would do to allow time for some more critical survival chore.

For gill net making instructions, just check out the fishing section of many military survival manuals, for example:

http://www.equipped.org/fm21-76.htm
http://www.equipped.org/fm3-0570.htm

A good project for long winter nights if you've got nothing better to do with your time, perhaps, but from a practical perspective, if you really want a gill net as part of your survival kit, they are not very expensive, weigh little and vacuum pack down very small. I've carried one for many years in my personal aircraft kit, though it'll be left out on my next repack as unnecessary.

What about a "field test" of sorts? Next time you give a talk to a group of people, or are at a gun show, have the instructions available with some mono and ask people to tie the knots following the instructions. It would be a good way to see how idiot proof the knots are with the intended mediium for tying. Take some notes on the results to help you with your decision. Of course asking for novices would provide more conclusive results.

.02

I just go to local malls and ask people to try stuff. Seems to work. At presentations, which are infrequent in any case, there's never enough time to cover what I want to cover, let alone do something like that. <~>

Doug,

One of the easiest knots to tie that retains almost 100% of running line strength is the uni knot.

The knot can be used to tie hooks, swivels, even lines together.

The uni knot can be used to tie any weight of line from 6lb up to 100lb leader materail.

It would simplify your instruction sheet.

Just my 2 cents.

I've used the Uni for braided line and high tech aramid, never tired it for Mono. will check it out.

I absolutely second that!

I've used the Uni-knot with mono, braided line, all kinds of terminal tackle. I also join my backing mono to the superbraided lines such as Fireline or Spiderwire.

I still have a tendency to use the Palomar with braided because they say it's the only knot that won't slip, but the newer Fireline has superior knot strength and I would feel fine going with the Uni-knot.

Uni-knot! <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I'm not sure I completley agree with Doug, but dont' try to make a gill net out of dental floss. That's waxed, it will stick together. You might be better off with a soda bottle fish trap.

I was thinking Glide which is the Gore-Tex material and un-waxed.

Pat

Doug,

I was thinking more along the lines of a field-expedient net. Perhaps one that is woven between a couple of notched sticks or twigs.

Pat

When fishing with my four boys the "Improved Cinch" is the easiest for us to tie. The others look simple but are hard to tie due to the stiffness of the line. We put the line in the eye of the hook, pinch the two strands and rotate the hook about six times. Then we put the end of the line though the eye end loop, the big loop and snug it up. The knot does not come undone. The hook often gets snagged and we break the line.

The picture should show a big loop at the hook eye to put the end of the line through. The picture makes it look hard.

We are novices and only fish from the shore, just like your survivors.

Here is a better picture


You might edit and just use picture number 3.

Agreed. The uni-knot also allows for either a tight connection, or a loop, depending on terminal tackle and action required. On any one of my rigs, you'll find a uni holding the line to the reel, attaching the backing line (usually cheap mono) to the main line, and attaching the terminal tackle. A great fishing knot.

Misanthrope