> I never called them fools or stupid.

I never said you did. I said you should not act as though they were. I did not put words into your mouth.


> It's not a weaponized flashlight.

The root message was talking about weaponized flashlights, torches which are "more resembling a medieval mace". If you have something different in mind, that's fine.

I think, with all due respect, that the British perspective on legal aspects of self defense is of limited value, as the practise of self defense in the UK is prohibited. I am not aware of any circumstances where the need to self defend overrides the "duty to retreat".

But to return to the fascinating topic at hand, given that "hammer blows" are likely to be defended against by arms and hands, what are the typical methods used with flashlight defense? It would seem that the "poking" you would typically do with something like a cane, wouldn't be as effective because of the stubby nature of the flashlight.

I like the idea of throwing, with the lanyard, but don't think I could trust my aim in a self defense scenario (pulse rate, adrenaline etc.).

There are many techniques I can think off off the top of my head:

• Spear: where you take two hands on a longish flashlight and ram one end (preferably the narrower one) into the attacker.
• Club: Use as a bat, mace, baton or similar swinging weapon where significant acceleration at the end of the flashlight impacts.
• Fist "enhancer": much like a roll of coins, steel bar, or other heavy weighted object, a smaller flashlight is held in the grasped fist and the knuckles are used as the attack surface.
• Hammer: Meant differently than "club" above. Hold flashlight in hand. Use the butt end as the strike surface with a swinging motion. Useful for smaller flashlights or tight spaces. Can be used vertically or semi-horizontally (striking inward from the side).
• Push: Grasp long light on either end, use the middle to push/block attack. Can also be used to strike either with center or with "enhanced" fist as above. Also excellent for locks/takedowns
• Thrown: Best if it's heavy and metal. Last ditch as a distraction for removal of your body from the area (RUN!).
• Blind: Temporarily blind by flashing attacker directly in their eyes.

There are probably a few more. Solar Plexus, head, neck, throat, and chest are all fairly lethal points of attack. Knee caps, groins, arms, fingers, may not be lethal, but can certainly save your bacon. In a fight, for me it would depend on how threatened I felt. If my attacker came up on me in the dark, he's getting whatever I can give. If it's some idiot trying to start a fight, maybe he gets away with a broken bone or two. But if it's a real life or death situation, I'm attacking any target of convenience.

The British perspective... phew, that's a whole other thread and I don't think it belongs in this forum... and Chris might just start locking it down as I'm pretty sure it's going to raise some anger over very polarizing issues. Note the use of the z. Yes, I'm from the U.S. I didn't spell it polarising. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Nice looking lights... I am a surefire fan, but the light you mention for fire/ems interests me... details?

Dude please, PLEASE, don't come on here and lecture Americans about weapons, police & self defense. You are wasting our time.

Not really replying to the original post, but rather the tone of some of my countrymen:

I don't believe that Dave (Brangdon) is saying that the UK situation is better or worse than USA situation. What I read is his explanation of how he understands UK police and courts view this sort of thing and likely responses in accordance with their laws and judicial system. Some of us arguing with Dave that the UK situation is "________" (fill in the blank) seems silly to me. A fellow UK citizen has "standing" to argue those sorts of things with Dave (in the Campfire forum?). Not us.

My 2 cents.

Regards to everyone,

Tom

Having lived in the UK while stationed there in the military with the weapons most feared by the Europeans, The nuclear weapon (Ground Launched Cruise Misslile), has given me a unique understanding of the British mentality on self defense. The British people are Not adverse to self defense. On the contrary, with their history of defending themselves, let's see Saxons, Romans, Nazis, IRA etc. has shown they are not afraid of a fight, like their support of the US in Afgahanistan and Iraq.

The thing is, the government which is largely a social government, is adverse to weapons. If you took out a home invader with a cast iron skillet nobody would give it a second thought. Use something that resembles a weapon (mace/gun) it's a whole different story. it's the general belief that removing weapons removes violence that drive the laws in the UK.

We in the US are so fortunate the we have the right and privalige to use weapons in defending ourselves and our families. Even if that weapon is a flashlight.

All my love and thanks for the support of our British bretheren
Luke

Desertrat1,
Excellent point! <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Doesnt Surefire produce a range that actually stuns people the light is so bright? I think it is has the # 3000 in its name... Romania?

Re: self defense with a skillet in the UK, here's a newspaper article that covers this topic, that you may find interesting:
british newspaper article

I stand by my apolitical assertion that the British perspective on self defense is of little practical value, as it embodies severe restrictions that do not exist in the US.

Back to the thread - has anyone done any testing of striking surfaces with these types of heavy flashlights to see if they actually hold up? I have a couple of large maglights on either side of the bed, and though they feel solid, I wonder if they would simply break (i.e. physically deteriorate, or stop producing light) if used defensively. I've also know the lens to come unscrewed after some time of activity carrying one of these. FYI, I had a smaller maglight in my pocket on a roller coaster ride once, it almost completely disassembled during the ride!

On a related note, are there known LED plugins for the larger size of maglight? I've only seen a $5 kit for the smaller.