I'm new to the board so please take it easy!

I live a few miles away from a small city in Missouri. I live on what alot of people would call a "mini farm", fifteen acres and a house and barn. Although I'm "in the county" it is not exactly as isolated as I would prefer if the SHTF. It's major problem is it is barely off a major highway. Sure its a great place to hole up, but if something big happens, I want to be a bit more remote.

So, a few years ago I bought 1 1/8 acre about 18 miles as the crow flies from my home (about thirty minutes drive). It is in a lot more remote area and is on a county maintained gravel road with one way in and one way out (by car that is). Best of all it is on a river full of small mouth bass, sun perch, and catfish. It has an old mobile home on it with electric and septic. Its nothing to look at but if times are bad it would sure look like a castle. The other homes/cabins on the road are mostly owned by people from two to three hours away who use them as weekend getaways. The best part is my hidey hole doubles as my weekend getaway for floating in the river, fishing, BBQing, and drinking beer. I believe that it will be a great place to be when the SHTF as there is a reliable water source, food source and shelter.

So, who else here has a hidey hole? Lets hear about it!

The gun club I belong to has a pond full of trout and bass, a stream that runs through the property, 80 acres of wild game, a full HAM radio station, and trap and skeet fields big enough to land a helicopter. Oh, we have some defensive capabilities as well. I can walk to it from my house if need be.

My brother bought a fishing cabin like this down by you last year. But It has other trailers on lots nearby, and isn't quite as isolated as yours sounds. Only problem I have with it.... snakes!

But the whole procedure gave me some thoughts last year about building a cabin along the lines of your plan there. Fishing/Hunting shack with TEOTWAWKI or at least TSHTF capabilities.

I'm really curious what you stocked up on. I was thinking of the following (security is obviously an issue):
1) Solar Charge/windmill/Battery configuration which could power emergency devices such as HAM, lighting, water filtration & pump, etc.
2) Emergency Water - large cistern?
3) woodburning stove and chopped wood
4) Backup kerosene heat with decent supply
5) Small Gasoline tank kept topped off
6) Foodstuffs
7) weapons and ammo

Other standard survival goods and procedures (fire ready to light!)...

Anyone have ideas on securing some equipment that can be left behind? My grandfather used to have a diesel tank above ground but I know a buried one with hidden hand pump would be better.

If you aren't checking the supplies that often, how do you keep your gear safe? A couple of adult BOBs can run some cash if someone decides to trash your place and steal you safety line.
I'd like to hear from some folks here with real-world experience keeping such a place from roving delinquent marauders. <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

On the two mile road where my cabin is located, there are a total of ten cabins. Every spring my wife and I laugh when the fools who stock their cabins with tools, atv's boats, and other saleable goods come down to find their possessions gone. My rules of thumb with maintaing my getaway are as follows,

1. Don't lock your cabin. When the vandals have to struggle to break in your cabin they invariably trash it.

2. Don't make anything obvious. If it is valuable, hide it. Your typical burglar/vandal will steal anything not glued down, but they won't look too hard for anything. One year a thief stole my $50 Snapper Comet riding mower even though it had no battery, no gas, and had three flat tires. Add to that he had to push it 100 feet and load it onto a truck. He was too lazy however to open the broom cabinet next to the fridge and steal my Bass Pro/Garcia, ultralight fishing rod and box of tackle.

3. Owning a cabin isn't a beauty pageant. My cabin is a 1958 mobile home that all the paint was falling off of. I painted it with red barn paint as I had some left over from painting my barn. I mow my lot occasionally, meaning three times a year. The thieves inevitably gravitate to the nicer looking cabins.

If you follow these simple rules, 9 time out of 10 your cabin will be left alone.

There are a billion places to hide stuff in your average home/ cabin. Take for instance cupboards. Ever wonder what is between the bottom of the lowest cupboard and the floor? Well I'll tell ya, nothing. Specifically about a five inch space of nothing. If a guy were to take a skil saw, cut out the bottom of the cupboards and fit them back in with concealed hinges, it is amazing what can be hidden. Not that I would know of course.

PVC, silica gel, and cosmoline make great undergound gun storage cabinets.

My backup heat to the woodstove is my 500 gallon propane tank.

Electricity doesn't really thrill me but I have a 1000 watt Honda generator which I keep at my house. If I don't have to go overland when the SHTF I'll take it with me.

My emergency water is the river. When you have a river so clear that you can watch the fish strike as you fish, some bleach or iodine is typically sufficient. I also have a hand pump on my well.

On the foodstuff issue, I'll say this. Over the last few years, when I go down I'll occasionally plant tomatos, and other vegetables. Not necessarily to tend in a garden, but so they are established. It would amaze you what certain unattended vegetables such as tomatos, squash, cucumber, and zucchini can do unattended. They will also come back year after year. The rest of my foodstuffs are still in the river, in the woods, or in the cabin.

Just a few ideas, YMMV.

Oh yeah, once you get used to snakes, they're no big deal. I typically ignore them and they ignore me.

excellent advice - all....

I'll try to forget the snakes, but cotton mouth? Ummm... I'm just not a fan.

Concealment was my primary idea, and I like the principle of keeping it open... although that also invites someone to simply USE your cabin (locks keep honest people honest).

I'm thinking of locking it, but leaving nothing that looks valuable in plain site and even out of site, it will be concealed so it's passed over. The under cabinet idea is just what I was looking for. I know several folks also use under-floor hatches and hidden cubbies.

Thanks for the advice. Oh, and rivers/creeks here are RARELY that clear due to runoff, and with the industry we have (and lack of any real protection from polluters) I'll stick with a well and hand pump and cistern, thanks. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Anyone else have clever hiding ideas for a cabin/trailer/mobile home? Maybe ideas for building in hiding holes during construction or after (like the cabinet kick board)?

A guy I used to know down in AZ once said "If you leave the door unlocked, how much do you think the jerks would expect to find?" He also used the kickspace trick in built-in cabinets, but he made drawers to fit the space, but with no pull knob. He drilled holes in the side of the cabinet (toward the back) that would just accept a largish nail; to open the drawer, he would have to remove the nail that prevented the drawer from being pulled out. He also had a false floor in the bedroom closet.

But there were things that he never left there, esp weapons. He said if they once find a weapon, they will keep checking. He said if anyone looked in the cabin, it appeared empty, except for things like a broom and dustpan, some stored water, etc.

A Mormon had a lot of storage in his garage. He had built in a false wall in front of an outside wall that had no window or door. Unless you actually measured the inside & compared it to the outside, you never knew it was there. It was a foot deep and held a ton of stuff.

I think one of the main things is not to have a hidey hole that's too far away. If you're caught with just half a tank of gas, it would be nice if it were enough.

Sue

There is typically a couple inches of space between the top drawer and countertop that would work well for hidden storage. One could even put a thin piece of wood cover up there to conceal further - maybe even get away with a gun and ammo. But I think your point on leaving a weapon is a good one.

False bottoms, backs, tops, floors would all make good hiding places. Maybe a PVC pipe made to look like a sewage stack, but stocked full of goodies. Behind photos and inside ductwork is usually okay too.

One other thing, if you leave the door open, I think it would be a good idea to have an automatic door closer so the critters don't come in after the burglers and poop on your parade.

Any other ideas?

Perhaps the way to go is a medium duty or cheapo padlock. That will keep the honest folk honest, but will not upset the crooks too much. Also, the only hiding place that is really worth anything is the one you think up yourself and keep secret. There are books about ways to conceal your stuff, but criminals read those too.

Depending on the conditions, I've always favored going to ground. It must be the spelunker in me, but nothing conceals like good ole earth. I've seen synthetic designs that, unoccupied, would be nigh impossible to detect from the surrounding terrain, and occupied would likely only be noticable by the comings and going of the occupants, or by heat signature if someone were using thermal imaging.

I always wanted to build a subteranean dwelling, either beneath an existing structure (as an escape/evade device), or as a retreat in a shtf situation. I think it is a really practical idea, and much more secure than the typical surface structure, all things considered. If I could borrow or cheaply rent a backhoe, I reckon I could build a fairly nice hooch with some big culvert and some accessories.

I read somewhere that a guy had a backhoe dig a hole big enough to bury a smallish delivery truck. The hole was dug with an access ramp and a flat floor. Then he drove the truck into the hole, removed the engine, tank, etc, and had the backhoe fill over it, leaving just the door exposed. He did something with the door that camoflaged it, but I guess you could go through a hole in the roof, too.

I think he mentioned the shape of the truck box was more suitable for installing shelves than the culvert that he had originally considered. And someone gave him the truck for just a few bucks to get it off their property. AND it was self-mobile -- as long as needed to be.

Sue

I've seen somewhere on the net about people using shipping containers. They are built to be stacked, but the tops can't take much weight. Once the "ceiling" is reinforced, they are pretty big. I can't remember the website, but there is a site with "house plans" for these things.

Yes! These apparently have a big following in Alaska. Folks have stacked cargo containers and turned them into homes. Cheap(er) living.

A little time spent on Google uncovered a somewhat more upscale version:

http://www.architectureandhygiene.com/quikHouse/quikHouse_main.html

I saw a show on the history channel about the old west. The trappers would cache a lot of their supplies and furs. The basic idea was to dig a hole fill it with stuff you wanted later and then cover it (but don't forget where it was). They would come out of the mountains open the cache, take what they needed, possibly store some furs, and then relocate it.

Regarding a hidey hole. I was a big Hogan's Heroes fan, so I've always dreamed of an underground hidey hole under my house. The general idea would be an entryway via the basement that was adequately concealed. My idea would be not to evacuate, but rather "appear" to vacate my home and actually be living underneath it. I also like the challenge of attempting to build it without letting the neighbors know what is going on. Unless there is a cave-in, and they find my corpse. I could become a monologue joke on Letterman.

After spending 9 months living in a shipping container in Baghdad, I am not interested in doing that again.

I can't blame you. I'd have to throw some siding on it, cut for lots of windows, put in sheetrock, well geez... by the time it's all said and done, that money could be spent towards a real home. Or maybe an Airstream trailer. <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

A friend of mine had a friend some years ago that decided to build a basement under his existing house in southern CA. Tim went down to see what had been accomplished, which was a lot: the hole took up almost the same footprint as the house.

Then Tim started sweating. "Uh, Ernie, where's the support for the house?"

"Support?"

Countrymouse, have you ever seen the 60s movie The Great Escape? Try it, you'll like it. (This from a woman who has only seen 2 good war movies in her life...)

Sue

I've seen it - a great movie.

My backyard is the same size footprint as my house. I've thought about going in the basement and just digging straight back and at a slightly downward angle.

Digging a pit in the backyard would be quicker and more efficient, but I wouldn't want to draw all the extra attention. Plus, I don't know if city building inspectors would approve of a hidey-hole on my property.

Did you see "Blast from the Past"? <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I don't have one, but was thinking about your post today as I was getting a tour of a local sewage pump station (don't ask!). It is a small (maybe 8 x 10 foot) concrete building with a very secure metal door, but no windows. It has a big sign identifying it as a sewage pump station. Once inside, it went down three stories, and was huge inside.

So, that might be more than you are interested in, but what about a septic tank? Have one (or another one) installed, but don't attach it to the plumbing. I doubt that anyone would want to go inside the clearly labeled septic tank maintenance hatch, and you could store lots of stuff underground, in a cool, temperature controlled, dark environment.

Strap on a biohazard sign and put on there that containment suits are needed to enter (authorized personnel only - 60 min. max exposure time - hazard suit required) and you'll keep everyone out I bet. And fire fighters would still go in if necessary. Not sure how legal that is.... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Foot thick steel reinforced concrete walls, roof and floor, no windows and solid steel door with frame embedded in the concrete with multiple industrial locks will help (Ving or Medeco high security....)

Probably make you put in a second exit, etc (if they didn't shoot the whole idea down as being in violation of some ordinance )

The Biohazard sign is cool, but, there are plenty of laws regarding cleanup, transport and disposal of biohazardous waste. If for some reason the authorities did come to your property, you could possibly be financially responsible for any additional equipment they bring. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I also was told that once a properly packaged container has been labeled "HAZARDOUS WASTE", the only way to open it is by court order. Doesn't matter if you packed it, once its sealed, it cannot be opened, only disposed of (usually in a medical waste incinerator).

Maybe add some signs that say "PHOTOGRAPHY PROHIBITED BEYOND THIS POINT. DEADLY FORCE AUTHORIZED". I really have no idea on the legalities of this, but deadly force is authorized under certain life threating circumstances in every state. Maybe they'll assume that you'll shoot them on sight! <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I've seen other signs that put up the statue for tresspassing, and when worded the right way, makes it look "scary" and "serious". A little yellow "no tresspassing" sign isn't as intimidating as seeing something like "TRESSPASSING ON THIS INSTALLATION IS PROHIBITED UNDER F.S. 810.09(1)(a). DETAINMENT AND/OR DEADLY FORCE AUTHORIZED UNDER F.S. 810.09(2)(c) and F.S. 776.012. MONITORING AND RECORDING DEVICES IN USE". The 776.012 is the vanilla deadly force to protect yourself in Florida. Nothing special. If you're not there, then it doesn't apply! <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I still think the quarantine sign is best!

Sue

I had an instructor that used to do a lot of field work and monitoring for OSHA matters. This usually meant leaving very expensive equipment behind to check air quality, toxicity, etc.

His solution was to put "Danger! High Voltage!" signs on everything. Apparently that cured the vandalism and prying eyes.

My impression is discretion is the better part of valor, or in this case keeping what you want hidden hidden. Don't advertise. If possible, conceal it (like the Mountain men did).

Perhaps the best cache is a hermetically sealed container setting at the bottom of the middle of a cesspool. Yeah, retrieval might be a bit rough, but no one's even gonna think of looking there.