Does anybody have any experience with Kifaru equipment?

I am looking for a new alround/daypack/bob and they have some interesting packs. I know they are quite expensive<img src="/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> but it seems that there are almost no negetive reviews about their kit out there.

Especially the Maurader looks nice, offering a lot of opportunity for customization. <img src="/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Regards,

Bob.

I am waiting on an order to arrive from them. They have a wonderfull reputation and I've never seen or heard anything negative. There is a garge sale area on theyr'e Forum , you might save some money there.

Dave

Look here: http://lightfighter.net/groupee/forums

It seems it is preffered equipment for everyone on that forum especially medics. I only heard good things about the brand. Heard it is also very addictive <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Never went with it myself.

Some of their packs remind me a lot of my camelbak motherlode, only costing twice as much. I think they are a little on the overpriced side of things.

Superb gear & excellent customer service, but pricing is in the stratosphere... or higher. Search specifically in the 3rd Line forum at LightFighter for lots of info & pics.

I have been looking at their stuff...I have only heard good things from those that acutally have it. The naysayers have only read about their stuff and condemn it as too expensive.

Expensive is an understatement. But that is the price you pay for quality and "Made in USA".

The cost of living is higher in Colorado than Vietnam.

Hi all,
Long time Lurker, just out from behind the wall panel!

A little background is in order. I'm in the Army still and spent my first 6 years as a Sapper (light combat engineer) and now I do smarter work in bomb disposal <img src="/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> So over the last 18 years, I have put a lot of weight into a lot of different rucks and humped a lot of miles. My feet still hurt.

I carried a Kifaru MMR and Marauder in Afghanistan last year. Those rucks got ditched out of helo's and trucks into some of the roughest terrain I have ever seen, and they came out swinging.
I believe you need to ask yourself a serious question. What good is a warranty from Blackhawk or Kelty after TSHTF? Or in some god-forsaken backwater hole 200k's from the nearest civilization (that is probably hostile anyway)?
If you want to save a couple of bucks now and hurt a lot later, be my guest. But as for me, I'm glad that I waited another two paydays and bought these. They are truly the most comfortable rucks I've ever worn and I believe now, cannot be damaged with anything but explosives or mommy spit (this is the only known substance known to man to remove anything from anywhere, and can dissolve titanium and plutonium).
It may cost you a little more now, but it's worth it. Unless you intend on packing your camping gear into it and letting it sit in a closet for the next decade. If so, then by all means, buy a cheaper ruck, you probably wont ever need it....you hope!
If you do decide to go with them, spend the extra money and get the extra features like the fitted waist belt and shoulder straps, the extra grommets, and expansion hoods, if they come in handy once, they are worth it.

Your choice dude,
Mike

Now that's a product review. Thanks for stepping forward, and thanks for being in harm's way.

Welcome aboard! Always good to have an explosives man around. You never know when you need one, but when you do, you REALLY need one!

Well, I suppose that's the final nail in the coffin. Kifaru just got a line in the budget. It's going to have to be a small line for now, since I can't seem to break or fill my BFM, but it's a line nonetheless. Thanks for the feedback and welcome aboard.

Unless you do a lot of jumping out of helicopters or like to drag your ruck behind a humvee over the Iraqi wastelands, most of us could probably make do with other, less expensive rucks, that have proven themselves capable of taking a fair amount of abuse themselves. Kifaru is by no means the end all, be all of rucks, though they are among the best, and it sure helps that they are made in the USA. Having drug my camelbak through the grit, grime and grease of the middle east, I am none too anxious to pitch it in the can and go get a kifaru of my own.

I guess if you can afford it and you think you're gonna be getting into regular fights with grizzlies and cougars or you blow things up for a living and you might need something to hide behind, Kifaru may be the sort of gear you are looking for. Personally, I can't think of anything I would want to live through that is going to fail my motherlode. I suppose that the camelbak being the only ruck they sold at every PX in country I stopped in at doesn't carry much weight either. Then again, this is the same store chain they sold nickel bags of Ramen at for 50 cents a pkg.

I will say this: For half the cost or less of an equivalent kifaru, you are getting maybe 10% less ruggedness out of the camelbak.

Gear selection always involves compromise, and this applies to Kifaru as well as any other gear. There is no doubt that their gear is excellent and more durable than most. This comes at a monetary and weight cost. There is no crime or moral outrage in that fact.

It is incorrect, however, to say that anything less is just a Kleenex tissue waiting to fall apart. A lot of high mountains, vast deserts, and deep jungles were explored without the help of Kifaru products.

I've gotta agree with Ben on this one. I've looked at Kifaru, and I've known people with. And it is major kick-hoop, take-names stuff. It's very similiar in quality to the London Bridge gear I've looked at.

And I can't see any edge over the likes of High Speed Gear or Emdom. I minor edge over Eagle (who, IIRC, makes the military line of carriers for Camelback), Tactical Tailor and SpecOps Brand, but a very minor one. Or even Blackhawk (had one of thier carriers disentegrate on me once) or LLBean (never failed).

I don't need my gear to survive things that will vaporise me, I really don't. I've got better ways to spend my money.

One thing I've begun to notice around here is that some people have no qualms about spending top dollars on certain items (Surefire and Atwood come to mind), but will scrimp on the container that they carry it all in.

Benjamin, you are right, most of us don't need that much, even in a survival ruck (please dont give any more money to AAFES-the Army and Airforce Extortion Service, they suck!).

Camelback BFM's (got one of those too for short jobs) and the rest of that line, the custom Tactical Tailor series, London Bridge, and Blackwater also make a fine heavy duty tactical ruck. But we all have to admit, that there is a lot of junk out there too, (Blackhawk...oops, did I say that) Just strap on an ALICE for awhile and see how your back is not supposed to feel! (I will now accept much flame from the ALICE lovers among us <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />no offense)
I admit that the Kifaru line has me a bit rabid, but please dont feel as if I'm putting down any of the other good gear out there. I just want this gentleman to purchase a good system, I mean good for him, I dont care what company it comes from, one that will hold together when the chips are down, and not leave him looking like a cripple, you must admit, it doesn't feel good.

And just for the record, I didn't intentionally drag my ruck behind a truck, it just sorta worked out that way! LOL <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I do however stand my ground, and I quote, "When was the last time you regretted buying the very best?"

Yup, and I don't mean to sound so critical about how you or anyone else would prioritize their spending for the gear they want. If I were in more of a tuck and roll career, as I once was, then likely I'd be looking to acquire the most rugged equipment I could get my hands on, especially if my life is counting on it. For the more sedentary and cautious role I play nowadays, the most extreme abuse I am likely to put on my gear is a far cry from it's expected limits, not that I'm a slouch, but I'm not as active or reckless as I used to be.

I guess it's the frugal scotsman in me that follows that bell curve of value vs. cost, that law of diminishing returns that says I need only pay for just a skosh more than I intend to use, just so I can reap the full value of the dollars I spend. The only time I complain about spending the money to have the very best is when it requires me to do without something else I think I need because there's just not enough to go around, and there's always something else I need, so for me a certain level of compromise is justified I suppose. The very best, it turns out, is going to end up somewhere below the highest quality, or the biggest, or the most reliable, or the most convenient. It will end up wherever my economics balance with my need, after some careful scrutiny, so that while not posessing perhaps the finest example of a given type, I will also not be stuck with something that won't meet my expectations.

This, I believe, is the essence of the ETS society. We find what works, we evaluate it thoroughly, and we decide if it is worth whatever costs we must pay. Otherwise, I suppose we'd all be driving those new $90k International diesel 5 ton pickup trucks back and forth to work everyday or some such. <img src="/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I too hold those ALICE packs in low regard.

For your information and education, mommy spit is the common term for the chemical name: Unobtainium. The major problem is finding a container to hold it.
And, please, no bad mouthing the Alice pack. It's a perfectly fine pack, unless you have to carry it.

Hmm, I thought a hanky or a wash rag was a decent enough temporary storage device/applicator for the mommyspit.

Then again, I know a couple cowgirls that dip copenhagen like a wrangler. I reckon theirs is industrial strength mommyspit, as the reaction of their boys to the application is as expected. The good news is their men dip too, so swapping spit for them ain't the revulsion we'd take it for.

The ALICE PACK is good.

The ALICE FRAME and STRAPS sucks. I remember, a long time ago, Ramline of all companies made a really good synthetic frame for the ALICE. Called the Ramflex or something like that. Supposedly very, very good.

If I really felt the need, I'd try HSGI's Ali-Pad with the ALICE frame. That is supposed to be the cat's behind when used with the pain in the behind packframe.

www.tacticaltailor.com Tactical Tailor does modifications/improvements on ALICE rucks. Replacing the shoulder straps and waist belt wouldn't be too hard to do.

Dave

Oh, I know TT. And if I had a better frame and the money, my ALICE would have already gone to them or HSGI to be totally "pimped".

Hi, I'm new here but a regular over at the Kifaru website so you can guess that my answer will be a very positive one as far as Kifaru quality goes. I have two Kifaru packs and they are truly excellent pieces of gear. There are many packs that will also do a good job for you at a lower price point (something to do with being made outside the U.S.A. that allows that) however for hunting and military use, Kifarus offer some features that other packs don't. They are also bombproof but designed to work. Their maker tests all the gear himself. He has the "difficult" task of taking Kifaru gear out on extended hikes in the high country to make sure it passes his standards. Great stuff sold by great people and a worthwhile investment. Again, you can certainly get good gear for less that may suit you just fine but if prefer something American made and of the highest quality, Kifaru is tough to beat.

Nice ad. Here's the catch- I can get gear that will take more abuse than I can for less money. That is made in the USA, by the way.

Nylon makers are getting to be as bad as knife makers. Or teenagers' sneakers. Or women's fashion. Listening to Gear Snobs is like listening to rich society "ladies" harpying on eachother's backs about what they are wearing.

Zulu or Vulture II. This will be an interesting decision. And don't anyone say "get both". <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hey Raven, does that mean I'm a gear snob dude?
Does that mean that when I walk around with my ruck on, I have to stick out my pinkie finger? LOL!
<img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
I agree that it get's a bit silly, but when all I'm paying for are the upgrades to the pack, and the rest gets paid for by "ALL OF US" (read also the tax payers). I would say it's an investment in national security. We were given a pot of money to work from, and when we asked for these systems the boss said he would meet us halfway. We worked it out and the government get's a lot of good mileage out of this gear, when I retire, it goes with me. It's already paid for itself with a lot of rough ground.
Would I buy this out of my own pocket? Heck No! What do you think they pay G.I.'s these days?
I had a hard enough time convincing my wife to give me a four month advance on my allowance to get this far! <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Have a nice quiet day everyone.
Keep your feet and powder dry, and your heads down.

Mike

Ads are paid for. In this case, I had to pay for my gear. It's worth it for me. I do a lot of backpack hunting and haven't found another pack that will work as well for more or less money. My first Kifaru packed out a whole deer carcass (sans skin, head, legs and innards) along with my gear. I just haven't run into many internal frame packs that would have done that.YMMV

I've been enjoying a lot of these survival type forums and there seem to be some that love their Moras and all they will do for such little money and there are others who will settle for nothing less than a $300 knife. I don't think either philosophy is wrong, but the analogy to packs is valid. Glad you like what you have. I'm real happy with mine as well and I've yet to hear of someone who made the investment and regretted it. I don't consider myself a gear snob but do prefer to get good stuff when I can and when it makes sense (no custom knives for me). I don't look down on people who have different gear and have to wonder why one would have an issue with what someone else chooses to use, expensive, cheap or in between.

I'm always amused by people who like to bash gear they've never used. There are lots of good choices out there. Try them out and make up your own mind, but I'm pretty sure buying good gear that works for you doesn't make you a gear snob. Now back to lurking and learning.

No, it means that seem to have a blindspot.

I trust SpecOps Brand- thier gear will outlast me, and it's affordable. But I think thier Super Sheath sucks. I love HSGI, but I have some reservations about the sniper butt pack's design. The Emdom Wideload, SUV and Utili-shingle all rock, but thier mag pouches are cut too low for my taste.

When you shop by name brand, you loose. No one, no organization, will get it right every time. And what I see a lot of the people I call "gear snobs" doing is putting total faith in one brand. That, and they spit on other people's gear when it isn't the "holy brand"- screw that.

And you don't have to walk around with your pinky sticking out. But if it is in arm reach, and you are drinking, pinky should be out. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

"Again, you can certainly get good gear for less that may suit you just fine but if prefer something American made and of the highest quality, Kifaru is tough to beat. "

I read that, and I hear you saying that other gear is either (a) no(t as) good, or (b) not made in America. Both of which are blatently false. Paraclete, HSGI (my personal fave for Gucci-gear), Emdom, SOE, TAG, Eagle, SpecOps, they all make equally worthy gear, and last I looked, in America. Even Blackhawk is moving thier prod back to the US, becuase they want to get the contracts and the GSA has thier rules, which means that thier QC is going to go up. The only one I know of that is priced like Kifaru is is LBT, and they just aren't worth it.

I think you can make your point without denigrating others with a different point of view by name calling. We don't need to abuse others to make a point. You're entitled to your opinion and are welcome to express your opinion here in a civil manner, but you can do that without attacking others. Keep it civil and make your point without name calling!

I said tough to beat, not the only game in town. Remember the original question was about Kifaru. I did not say that other gear is not good ("you can certainly get good gear for less") or that there is no other American made gear. My statement still stands but I disagree with your interpretation of it.

For my uses those other brands don't have the same features, although they may be perfectly suitable for you. I'm glad you love your stuff but no need to take offense because someone else prefers something different that happens to be expensive.

I will second you on the cult of blind brand followers. I mix and match my gear since this is the only way I can get stuff to fit me perfectly (and affordably). I never followed one brand loyally since even thou they got few things perfect they will fail somewhere. I mean I have few favorite brands that I will check out first but I will keep shopping until I find what I need. I will not buy a product that is missing few things just because I'm brand loyal. I believe that there are other alternatives and choosing your own brand is what makes you an intelligent customer. Also if you are looking down upon me because my pack is not what the latest tactical fashion dictates I think than you might be too much about gear and not enough about the task in hand. Now pricing is a totally different part of the story here. I personally can't afford many of the gear I would like. I trade a lot, looking for used items trying to complete the best items for as much as I can afford. Few years ago I got into 'made in the usa" argument about TAD fleece hoodie. I wanted justification on why a fleece hoodie costs $200 why even the Arcteryx jackets were $150. I got ganged up upon with statements like "made in the US", American fabrics and American design... Yeah its great but my American job didn’t want to pay for American made product. Everyone was screaming high American note but nobody mentioned how warm and functional it was. I ended buying it on sale and it is really great item. My points in the pre SuperBowl rambling are as follows:

1) Don’t be a blind brand follower
2) Don’t knock the brand you haven’t tried
3) Don’t use “made in the usa” as a main gear feature
4) Understand that some people can’t afford the most expensive gear
5) Agree that there are other brands out there that even if not suitable for you are perfectly good for others
6) Don’t knock the users of different brands. That’s like making fun about someones girlfriend.
7) Skill above gear.

7) Skill above gear

Very, very nice -- I've never heard that one before.

That applies to several of my aviation students. Sometimes their zest for gadgets overshadows the need for skill.

Sorry, CCH.

Sorry, Doug.

No experience with Kifaru YET!!

I too spent a lot of time with this decision. Did a lot of reading and asked a TON of questions.

No, I am not in the "Sandbox" defending freedom, but do go out and use my gear every weekend on hikes and take it camping. I like equipment that is modular and allows me to adapt it to my needs. I also want something that I pretty much won't ever have to replace.

I have owned Camelbak BFM ( a good pack with lots of room although a bit on the heavy side for just the pack ) and Maxpedition Vulture and Falcon. Also both good packs and adaptable, but found both don't quite fit my frame. So, since I am in the financial position to spend my money the way I want, I finally bit the bullet and ordered up a Kifaru EMR and Marauder. Also picked out the XTL lid for the EMR and a cargo chair as well as a few external and internal pockets. I should be getting the packs soon, and so far, am happy with the service and attention to detail I have received. Of course, when you spend that much money on packs, they should treat you well, but I have had far too many experiences where I have been treated badly and spent much less money.

So, if the S... does ever HTF, then when all is said and done, I will at least have the packs I have always wanted. Hopefully the rest will be as easy. Once they arrive, I will do a set-up of my complete B.O.B. and pack load-out and post it here.

No worries. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Equipment selection can easily reach the same zealotry as religon. The only difference is in our temperal world if the first fails we may get to find out the validity of the second. Thats why sharing information is helpfull, but at day's end everyone crawls alone, naked or in thermals back into our own silent down, lamilite or thinsulite wombs, knife of choice to cut any paracord umbelicals come the rebirth of a new day. We hope <img src="/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

I just recently had my new pack come in the mail. It's an REI Lookout. I really have to say this is a great pack. The pack opens ffrom the front with a sort of panel door, allowing you to get things on the bottom of the pack without having to dig. It also has essential survival basic tips sewn into various compartments for a quick reminder. The sternum strap buckle has a whistle molded into the buckle plastic. I thought that was pretty nifty. I haven't had a chance to take it out yet. But I've loaded it up with some pretty hefty stuff and it felt great. There's my two cents on my pack <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Yep, all this high tech pack stuff reminds me of a tv show I was watching about the Maori, where one fellow was packing most of his belongings in a shoulder pack (I say shoulder pack only because the hide bag he was using only had one strap, which was draped over his shoulder) over the hills to another village to trade. When he got there, many of the items he removed were carefully wrapped up in plastic grocery bags, which he carefully unwrapped, folded up, and stowed away for later. It is amazing the contrast between his priorities and those of our throw away society.

I saw equipment that porters use in Africa to carry loads close to 100 lbs. Pieces of canvas and leather held together by patches. Straps are no wider than half an inch with no padding. Loads are big and troublesome: kitchen table, full kitchen stove... Not to mention what they wear: sandals/tennis shoes with some sweat pants to climb mountains that are 6000 meters. And on top of that they are still faster than tourists.

About the only ones not faster than tourists are the new independant aid workers. They'll kling to 500lbs of well drilling equipment that they cant move off a mountain until long after the ants have removed the meat off their bones, and wonder in the afterlife why everyone just shakes their heads at them.

I have to agree with you guys, I took a look at my kit and realized I got a little foamy over my Kifaru pack (aka: heroin w a frame and shoulder straps). I also realized that the entirety of my kit is from different makers. RBR, BH, TAG, Eagle, AMK, BW, and even some locally made stuff from some junk merchant in Kyrgyzstan that just seems to keep working. So, not everything is US made, and it's not all even the best, but it works for me over and over.
I guess that's what counts in the end......but If it was legal, I'd marry that ruck! LOL!
Mike

Ah, you have a muttly! That's what I'm talking about.

Any pictures of your fair.... ruck. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Is www.kifaru.net the only place to buy kifaru products?

You can find them on ebay sometimes (i.e. rarely, at least the packs are rarely on ebay - seems to be some accessories lately). To find them new, Yes you pretty much have to go to their website. And then my understanding is that you still have a wait of several weeks for them to make your pack.

I'm planning to get a Siwash (from the hunting side) in the next couple months. Just gotta hide another $120 from the wife <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.

I purchased a EMR pack from Kifaru last September.
One of the best built pieces of gear I have.
I just ordered a Scout pack last week(about 4 weeks to get one).
You will not be displeased with your Kifaru purchase.

You may want to do a search at http://lightfighter.net/groupee/forums

There is a lot info about Kifau packs there.

The signal-to-noise ratio here is getting to be obnoxious.

Curiously enough, Matt gave the same link in the third post of this thread.