Maybe I will include a copy of the US Constitution in my gear/supplies. That way, I can explain to the person trying to take my stuff "for the greater good" that a violation of the 4th and 14th amendments are wrong, that he probably took an oath to defend that same Constitution, and that a violation of my Constitutional Rights is a justification for use of force.

And, yes sir, it is loaded.

No one has of yet given a scenario where heading for the hills is a viable alternative. That is, when leaving a city for a national park or any other wilderness area is a better alternative than even a run down motel in the middle of anywhere.

Or is it that "heading for the hills" is a code word for Sis's or Bro's house? <img src="/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I may be more fortunate than most. 3 years ago my brother in-law and I bought 10 acres in the hills and built a cabin. It is 50 miles away and about an hour door to door. The well is in and we have solar power. The septic system will be added this summer. So, given the choice, it will be the hills. Just remember, I will be there, first!

I agree. Many people seem to be assuming that they will be the only people in them thar hills. No one has mentioned what is likely to happen when half the people from any city ALL head for the same hills! Off the top of my head, here are a few problems you might be likely to encounter:

* Edible wildlife would take off or be killed.
* Many people would bring their pets, which would disappear just before dinner.
* Edible plants would disappear.
* Water supplies contaminated.
* Sewage like you've never seen before will be lying on top of the ground and within easy reach of the waterways. (Even month-old kittens are housetrained better than most humans.)
* People who brought stuff will be attacked by those who didn't, or who ran short.
* Those who have weapons will be using them.
* Dead bodies will be lying all over the place.
* If anyone has an infectious or communicable disease, it will spread.

Home looks better by the minute.

Sue

Hmm,

Actually heading for the hills, as you describe, would require a fundamental lifestyle change for nearly anyone. It would be tough goings, especially in the winter months. Assuming you don't have access to a pre-built fortification (like the cabins I would seek out), you are stuck with temporary accomodations and no sure source of food or water. While that is fun for a weekend and a nice challenge for a week or two, it is grueling for extended periods. Oft times it will require frequent relocation, and everybody's supplies run out eventually.

Things have to get pretty bad down in the valley before the prospect of hitting the trail sounds like a suitable alternative. Take the examples I cited earlier (pandemic, civil unrest, invasion) that would make me flee my home in the first place, and then multiply them so that any civilized location would pose significant risk(global pandemic, world collapse, world war, apocolypse), and that is about what it takes to make heading for the hills a truly viable choice.

Heading for the hills should mean leaving all civilized comfort and convenience behind, with only the stuff you can pack with you to live off of. I believe that was the original intent. It doesn't include heading for the vacation house or that convenient bed and breakfast chalet off the beaten path, it means roughing it, or it should in this context anyways.

Surely any shelter is going to reserve right of refusal. Whatever the constitution says, if you won't give up your gun they don't have to allow you in.

Generally speaking, in the USA only elected officials (the President, Governor, etc.) have the authority to declare a state of emergency, thereby suspending portions of the Constitution. The people running the shelter would not have that authority. But as a practical matter you are correct--if they don't want you in you are not getting in, and once in if they want your stuff they are going to get it. They may face legal sanctions later however.

Regards, Vince

That's pretty much how it works. Now if they come to my home and try to take it, well, we've covered that response before.

<img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

"It doesn't include heading for the vacation house or that convenient bed and breakfast chalet off the beaten path, it means roughing it, or it should in this context anyways."

Why? And why this context? Shelter is shelter, and the tighter against the elements, the better. I think most people could live better and longer in an 8'x12' rustic log cabin than under a tarp or in a hole in the ground.

The criteria here ISN'T how hard you can make it for yourself and your family!

Sue