Hi!

I put my hands on a Primus Firesteel. It's a little metal alloy rod attached to a small cord along with a striking plate. I am able to strike the rod and generate a spark, but how am I supposed to light up tinder with this?

I saw on some websites that some fire steels require you to strike the thing and produce some tiny bits of metal that you light up with a spark afterwards.

Can someone clear things up for me a bit? <img src="/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

The sparks will light most tinder (lint, fluffed up cotton soaked in vasoline, fluffed up tinder quik, and natural tinder). You may have to get it close and spark it several times quickly to light it. Sparks alone don't seem very useful at first, but it's pretty ruggid and it sure beats rubbing sticks together <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />



Those are magnesium firestarters, which is basically a sparking rod like you've got, but it's attached to a block of magnesium. The magnesium acts as the tinder- you scrape off a small pile of magnesium, then use the sparking rod to light it.

Bee,

Here's the correct technique:

1. Prepare your tinder bundle and fire lay first. The tinder bundle will include fatwood shavings, vaseline impregated cotton balls, SparkLight TinderQuik, Coghlan's tinder, or natural materials like dry milkweed down, cattail down, birchbark, and/or cedar shavings - something that will readily accept a spark.

2. Hold your striker (misnomer - should be called a scraper)near the tinder with the sparking rod very close to the tinder.

3. Pull the sparking rod (leaving the scraper stationary) in a scraping fashion back toward yourself. Doing so keeps the sparks "aimed" at the tinder and keeps the shower of spark on target.



4. Properly prepared tinder will ignite rapidly.

M

Be aware, too, that not all scrapers are created equal. Some produce more/larger sparks.

Yours appears to come with a smooth-edged scraping tool, whereas many come with a similarly-sized length of hacksaw blade, which produces better results for me (but it tends to "chew up" the rod). Knife blade will work, but you can imagine what it can do to the blade edge (I avoid). Using sharp edge of rock as scraper can produce useable sparks in a pinch.

The scraper-to-rod angle, and scraper-to-rod pressure also impact results.

Practice, practice, practice. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Nice picture!!

Yea Bee the above technique works great just practice it some to get good at it. A small piece of fluffed cotton with Vaseline the size if your fingernail is plenty to practice with. I’ve even been known (your on your own here) to practice with very small pieces on the bottom of a cookie sheet or an iron skillet to keep it from burning things that should not get burned.
Oh and I made what I think is a better scraper out of an old sawsall blade I like the way it sparks better than the factory one.
Anyway have some fun with it and get comfortable with it, because it is a dependable method of making fire.

I was playing with my new MagFire steels last night. Noticed something.

The freakin' scraper stopped working! It worked for a few dozen scrapes, then the performance fell off, then I couldn't strike a spark. Moved to a clean / new spot on the scraper, started working again, but only for a short time. Finally rendered the entire scraper non-functional just by using up all the edge. Dunno what happened. I tried wiping it off, but it didn't help.

Went inside, got an old knife. Whoa. There we go. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But you're right... I wouldn't want to do this a lot... hard on the blade.

Try making a scraper out of an old saw blade (hacksaw, sawsall, etc.). I snapped mine to length drilled a hole in the end and then ground it to the shape I wanted. I also ground the teeth off and rounded the edges, which has so far allowed me to fly with it. Much superior to the cheap scraper that they come with.
But better to find out now than when your teeth are banging together like castanets. <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

So you can fly with it? Hmmmm. <wheels turn>

Not that you could do it in a hurry, but it appeals to me from a worst case scenario point of view. Assuming you could also take a diamond coated knife sharpener on board, this would make a fair improvised blade, wouldn't it? (I say diamond, because the "coarse" grades walk through steel scary fast).

If you're stuck in the wild and you need some awesome tinder try some milkweed down. That stuff is verging on explosive.

In fact, some wild plants ARE explosive. For example the pollen of 'wolf's paw club moss' has been used in flashbulbs. I digress, milkweed down is one of the FEW wild tinders that will even start from the FEEBLE spark of an empty bic lighter.

-Nim

If the spine of the blade is a hard, 90 degree angle, use the back edge of the knife. (assuming it is either a fixed blade or a good lock blade)

A 6" steel ruler like you can find at the hardware will also work.

SgtMike provided a wonderful description to help answer the question - the right materials, equipment and technique all add up to the successful beginning to a roaring fire. I would only have a couple of minor adds. Keep in mind it's the "fuzzy edges" of your tinder that enables it to easily catch, such as the fuzzyness of the obvious cotton ball or dryer lint. A flat leaf, even though bone dry, requires much effort while a pile of crumbled up dead leaves requires less do to all those little edges available to catch the spark. A small pile of pitchwood shavings will catch pretty good, too, but not quite as quickly as the fuzzy edged stuff. Another trick I discovered is to make the strike with the edge of the (dry) cotton ball between the striker and the rod. This way you're not "throwing" the sparks at the tinder, you're "throwing" flaming tinder at more tinder. No aiming required to get that cotton ball going and now you can add the other more flammable tinder to it to really get things started. Just my 2 cents.

SgtMike88Ret has described an excellent technique.
My only suggestion to this is try different angles while holding the striker to see which works best.
With some of the fire steels, they get a blue ish oxidised coating over the surface, and some need a couple of scrapes to get though this coating before they start sparking well.
These fire steels are an alloy manufactured to by softer than the steel used as the striker, so the fire steel wares away creating the sparks. The alloy is also designed to give off very hot sparks. If the striker is to soft, the edge rounds off and the sparks die off. They prefer a sharp edge to work against. Different brands of fire steels have a varying degree of hardness and temperature of sparks.
I make sure that my knifes have an edge on the back of the blade by filing a section so they work with my fire steels. I even filed an edge into my Swiss Tool bottle opener as well because Victorinox round all of their edges too much.
After filing they get a quick test, then left so I dont ware the edge.
I've been told that glass can also be used as the striker but I'm not in any hurry to test it.

When showing a friend that didnt beleive they could make a fire, I used a sheet of paper placed flat on the ground and the shower of sparks ignited it 2nd scrape. Then came the comment "oh, I got to get me one of those"

Another bit of possible useless info: You can start a fire with steel and flint rock. It is harder to do because it works by the flint being harder than the steel, so the steel wares away. If you try this you will find that it needs to much effort to be reliable.

Some handy, never fail strikers that I use routinely:

1. Victorinox Pioneer, Farmer, and Soldier awl blades
2. Victorinox Saw Blade SPINE
3. Hacksaw Blade SPINE
4. Jigsaw Blade SPINE
5. Opinel Blade SPINE
6. Al Mar S2K SPINE
7. Carbon Steel Erikksson Mora 1260 with SPINE sharpened like an ice skate

M

I noticed pretty much the same thing with my scraper. While I'll probably wind up replacing it with a piece of hacksaw blade eventually, as a quick fix I put a much sharper edge on one side of the scraper by simply laying it on the belt sander for a few seconds. This led to greatly improved performance of the striker. Don't let this observation turn you off of the Magfire; it's an excellent product. I'm looking forward to getting the big ones in. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

In addition to the other striker options listed here, utility knife blades also work. The spine is hard and sharp enough to scrape bountiful sparks, and the sharp side doubles as a backup sharps for shaving tinder or what-have-you. I've used this set-up many many times without cutting myself, but the squeamish or clumsy might want to cover the sharp edge with a piece of tape or use gloves.

It does require a bit of pressure to get a spark. I showed my Dad one of my new Magfires and (even though he should know better) he proceeded to scrape away with very little pressure and got no results. The goal is to actually remove a bit of material from the steel, so the edge of the scraper needs to "bite" into the surface a little.

I have recently been using the back side of a Fallkniven F1 and it has worked very well. Lit up cedar bark on the second strike on my most recent attempt and I'm no Firesteel expert either...trust me. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> The F1 has a nice sharp 90* angle on the back so I asume any blade with the same characteristic would perform similarly.

Brian,

Thanks for the reminder - my U2's spine makes a great scraper, too...

M

> If the spine of the blade is a hard, 90 degree angle, use the back edge of the knife. (assuming
> it is either a fixed blade or a good lock blade)

<img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> With some folding knifes, such as Dougs RSK, you can use the spine while the knife is closed. Much safer.

I painted mine with clear fingernail polish to protect it from dings and corrosive environments but there must be other (better?) methods out there.

I'm currently experimenting with one such idea. Last April, I coated a ferro rod with mineral oil and slipped it into a piece of tubing. It's been with me on several week long outings and has been exposed to salt water spray. So far, there's no damage visible, but I haven't taken the rod completely out of the tubing. In contrast, the BSA HotSpark carried (simultaneously) without any protection is showing some fairly severe pitting - still works, though...

M

I just use some heat shrink tube over them both.
Most of the time I dont carry the striker. I use my knife or multi tool as the striker.

I had 2 original "Metal Matches" with the orange plastic end. One I used to make fires and light camp stoves, the other I kept as it was received. I left the used one in a drawer for several years and all that was left was grey dust and an orange piece of plastic. The second one, I put a heavy coat of clear laquer on, it is still intact after 30 years. I have never used it.
On my Firesteel I keep a piece of heat shrink tubing. Any strikes and I recoat it with clear laquer and put it back in the tube. As soon as feasible. It takes quite awhile before they corrode to dust.

In a few weeks, I'll be posting a series of videos to www.magfireusa.com that shows - exactly - what to do. My day job has been really hectic, and I've not has the time to do it.

Suffice it to say that man-made tinder trumps any natural tinder you find 80% of the time. Basically, you can mess around with shaving dry sticks and all that, and scratch and scratch to get a flame, or you can toss an oil-soaked cotton ball into a puddle, hit it with a spark and WHOOSH the flames start. Really. I just did a test on this very method yesterday - I dug a small hole, dumped in some water, three an oil soaked cotton ball into the little puddle and lit it with one spark of a Magfire.

If you don't have the advantage of man-made tinder, you need to have fine, dry "wispy" bits of dry stuff - grass is particularly good, but some shreds of dry bark and bits of tiny wood will be a start. You need to hold your striker edge pretty still and pull the firesteel back - this concentrates the spark in one general area. Press HARD on the striker - you want bits of metal flying off and sparking in your tinder pile.

The other advice you have here is good, I'll annouce the videos when I have them online.

Yeah, the included scrapers are a "backup" for a knife. Remember that the scrapers have a "hook" edge - you can feel it and that's the edge you should be using.
I've been talking to the guys in Finland about the scrapers, and they seem to feel that anyone carrying a Magfire will have a knife - and that the knife is a greatly preferred scraper. The back edge of a knife is a good choice as well.

Ah. Didn't know about the special edge. I'll try it.

In the mean time, mostly just to see how long it would take, I've been putting a knife edge on one of the included strikers. I'll post pics when I'm done, but already it works a lot better. Which isn't surprising, really, since it's becoming more like a knife.

I haven't done any formal testing yet, but so far I notice that the sparks seem to last longer. And they seem to be hotter. I can actually feel the heat as I scrape, which is something I haven't noticed with other fire steels. Again, could be just me, but I think I see a difference.

If you are filing an edge on the strikers, try filing a curved area. On my Swiss tool I've filed the inside curve of the bottle opener to work as a striker. It gets more surface area in contact with the fire steel.

Oooh. Good point. Thanks!

In fact, I guess a half circle cut out of the striker, then sharpened like a serrated edge would be best.

Edit:

Ya know... given that the preferred technique seems to be "hold the striker, move the steel", what do you all think of a striker designed specifically for this. I'm thinking a rectangluar piece with a hole near one end. The edges of the hole are sharpened, and the hole is, say, 2 or 3 inches from one end (to position the sparks over the tinder). There'd be just enough metal above the hole to use to hold the striker. To use, simply position the striker, insert the steel, push down and pull back.

I havent exactly got the best technique, I haven't done much of holding the striker and moving the steel. I started the by holding the fire steel and moving the striker towards the tinder. I haven't spread my tinder out by hitting it by accident yet but I have been close, so holding the striker makes a lot of sense.
Having the curve in the striker (or a V type groove) seems like a good way of keeping everything aimed as well as getting more surface area creating the sparks. I'm not really a fan of using the serrated edge, I am more likely to use that to make tinder scrapings. I prefer either the straight or curved edge for sparking even if it does need a little more pressure.
My EDC is always a Multi tool as the striker and a small fire steel with magnesium on my keyring. (a bit smaller and easier to carry than the Magfires)
My Magfires and some other firesteels are stashed in various grab bags and kits that I use.

I have recently got a couple of these fire starters to play with but I havent had a serious play yet. They are called "The Aussie Survival Tool" The wooden handle is designed to be tinder as well as the magnesium. Its an oily type of wood. (somehow I seemed to have built a small collection of firestarters)
www.the-firestarter.com

If I may add to that...

With some natural tinder it helps to get a knife and scrape it up, so you have either a fine powder or thin strands. Basically you want to get it finely divided so it gets hot before it conducts the heat of the spark away. A lump of wood, even most sawdust, is too big to heat up with a spark. If it doesn't get very hot it won't light.

I agree artificial tinder is best. On the other hand, you can only carry a finite amount so it becomes a bit like carrying a lighter with a finite amount of fuel, or a finite number of matches. A ferro rod is most important as a way to start an almost unlimited number of fires. So it's worth learning how to use "found" tinder - plants, or, in an urban environment, paper and cardboard - to get the most from it.

Bee,

Great question! My 11 year old twins have been working on this skill. Even with fluffed up cotton balls they have trouble getting the cotton ball to light. The first problem they have is getting a good spark. As has been mentioned; either the scrapper is dull or they are not scrapping at a good angle to make sparks. Once they get a good scrapper and technique going their next problem is not getting the sparks close enough to the cotton ball. As has been mentioned you have to hold the scrapper and pull the ferro rod toward you. When you get ready to make the spark the scrapper has to be within ½ inch of the tinder. My boys have worn out a few BS Hot Spark ferro rods working on this skill.

As a side note:
I went camping with my oldest son last weekend in northern Arizona. It was down to 32 in the morning. There was dew on the pine needles and leaves in the morning when I got up and wanted to make a fire. There was no dry natural tinder. But there was a pine tree stump near by. It was a natural stump that had split in an uneven way leaving fingers of fat wood sticking up. I was able to kick off some fat wood sticks. I took one and scrapped the side with a knife to make a half dollar size pile of pitch wood shavings. There was a small log in the fire pit. I placed a pitch wood stick against the log, sticking up. Then I put the pile of pitch wood shavings at the bottom of the pitch wood stick. Then I placed some more sticks against the log to form an A around the pitch wood stick. I was able to then use my County Comm Metal Match to make sparks to light the pile of pitch shavings. I use the back edge of the saw on my Leatherman Charge Ti as the scrapper. The fire from that set the pitch stick on fire. The fire from the pitch stick caught the other sticks on fire and I had a sustainable fire going with little effort; a kick, some scrapping and sparking. I did not use any natural fluffy tinder. Such things would have been wet. Northern Arizona does have what some people call “fire weed” that will catch a spark, if it is dry. For one handed use: stick the knife in the ground and scrape the fat wood and ferro rod against the knife blade.

I finally figured out that the most important thing is to have appropriate tinder.

I took some dryer lint and sent a spark with my fire steel... WOOPH! It lit up instantly and kept burning for a little while, probably enough to light up small branches in a wilderness situation.

Like someone said previously in the thread, it might not be as efficient as a lighter but it's still better than making a fire bow (friction). <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thank you (and everyone else) for your replies. Always feels good to start some interesting threads with lots of useful replies. <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />