Considering spending $15-20K on a used version. Is this a good all-around vehicle? It seems reliable and luxurious but can tow whatever you need and can fit stuff inside.

It depends on what you want to do. For one thing while these suv labeled minivans can tow, the short wheelbase and not being a true truck don't make them very good tow vehicles for anything more than towing a small trailer.
From your other posts it seems your getting into outdoors type of things, do you really want to worry about cleaning mud off that $ leather and carpet.
I've owned/driven cars, suv's minivans, and trucks and I can say that the worst vehicles I've owned are minivans (which most of these mini and Luxury SUV's are) because they try to do too many things and end up not doing any well. The best vehicles I have owned are basic trucks, You don't have the extra maintenance that a front wheel drive needs and can be an SUV by throwing a cap on the back but still able to haul dirt/rocks/whatever in the bed without getting the carpet dirty. The old fashioned and simple body on frame has proven to be the most reliable. I typically run my trucks to 200k miles without issues.

This is just a fancy Toyota Land Cruiser, right? If so, it's a real truck and can go off-road. But it's very thirsty and swallows fuel like it's going out of style. IMHO, it would make a poor emergency vehicle. You'll be sitting on the shoulder out of gas while all those Prius owners drive by and wave.

I think if we've learned anything this year, it's that gas is hard to come by during mass evacuations. We have two SUVs now, but our next car will be likely be a hybrid. Hopefully by the 2nd or 3rd generation of hybrids, they'll have the kinks worked out.

What exactly is it that you want to tow?

Basically these are an up market 80 series Toyota Landcruiser.
Here in Australia the 80 series has proven a very rubust and reliable 4wd. Actually it is probably the most reliable. Even better than its replacement, the 100 series.
If you want fuel economy the diesel has proven the best. It has less power, but its power is in the lower rev range so you dont have to rev the guts out of it.
The V8 and 6 cylinder petrol models suck to fuel to much to make it of any use for a bug out. (In my opinion)

Here in Australia more Landcruisers are sold than in the US, so they suit our conditions. Have a look and see what sells where you are, and why they sell. Then look at what is the most reliable.
Then look at what suits you for your needs from the list.
I personally would be going for the Toyota over the Lexus.

Also you may find that one is better than the other, but the local backup is not as good. Pick the one with good backup.

They don't make it in a Diesel here. They really should make more diesels in the states.

Fitzoid,
Forget hybrids for a while. The technology really isn't here yet. Battery technology is the major hold up. Diesel really is a lot better. Lok at the Volkswagen Jetta, in manual it gets around 55mpg and has more power then any hybrid. Modern diesels are a lot better then most people think and will soon become more popular with the change to low sulfer diesel here in the states in 2006 and the interest in Biodiesel.

Ahh, I was thinking it was one of the overgrown minivans, I didn't know that they had any real trucks. I suppose I don't keep up enough on the overpriced Toyotas <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I have little experience with Lexus vehicles but I am certain you will enjoy that vehicle very much. I personally would not buy a used Lexus with the intention of keeping it for many years due to the very high cost of maintenance & parts. There is probably nothing you can do yourself other than change the oil and very little your friendly neighbourhood mechanic can do either.

It’s such an upscale vehicle I wouldn’t want to muddy up the carpets!!!

Get a good US built pickup for all your off-road/towing/carrying needs. Cheap parts + maintenance & get fancy wheels to show off once in a while.

My 2 c

I disagree. The 80 series Landcruisers are very easy to work on, and as these are based on that series, so I can see no problem.
I do admit that I am not sure of your market over there, and what backup you have, but one of the reasons they are so popular over here is because they are so easy to fix and run. Thats why they use them 1000's of kilometers out in the middle of no where,through out central Australia.
I'm not a mechanic, but I get to work on friends 80 series Landcruisers, and I used to own an older model Landcruiser(and wish I never sold it) and I find them easy.

I confess my general ignorance about the truck but I would suspect the older the better. Technology makes our life simple only when it works. The new LX450 have full time 4wd active traction control (using the brakes), adaptive variable suspension, adjustable height control, electronically controlled transmission … As a rule, I am weary of fancy technology…

Actually the suspension would be scarey to fix on the edge of the track.
The full time 4wd and electronic transmission is standard Landcruiser, so they wouldnt worry me too much.
I would also learn to use it with the traction control turned off. That way if it fails, you still know how to drive it.

I would preffer a more basic model myself, but they are a very capable vehicle.

Ii have owned in my time probably 100 vehicles. Businness use and a dedicated gear head. Without a doubt the best I have ever owned is a 1992 Lexus SC400.

But I did love dearly my '46 Ford coupe with a flathead V8.

randjack,
Those old coupes are fun! I've got a '32 Model B 5-Window with a 327 (High compression, twin 4bbl carbs, around 400hp) and a Turbo 350 trans. Before that it had the same motor with a three speed rockcrusher with the original rear gearing (6.13s I think) What a fun car, nothing could touch it from stop light to stop light, but it could only do about 55 on the highway tops. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

I think the '46 had a 4.11 diff, but it was a 3 speed with a manual OD. It was good for 65 mph on the road, but no mas for cruzin. Remember how good those cars smell inside? Wool & mohair headliners & carpet, leather .. oh well.

Real Leather too, the kind made from cows. Not that plastic stuff they call leather now that you can fry an egg on in the summer. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

I spose we're getting a little stupid here with a semi-private conversation that may or may not be of any interest to anybody else, but what about that feel in your hand as you slip from one marginally synchronized gear to another? Who knows how to double clutch anymore, much less shift just by matching gear speeds.

I just bought a 2003 Mustang Cobra a year ago. The car comes with a built in shift light on the dash to tell you when to shift during everyday driving. I couldn't believe it. What a joke. (By the way, it says to shift way to early, I guess for gas mileage)

Anyway, the big thing I love about those old cars is how easy they are to work on. You could fix anything in that car with a set of craftsman tools and parts from your local NAPA. I have a '73 Chevy blazer I use for plowing that I could sit in the engine compartment to work on it. I open the hood on the mustang to do something and I just close it. I don't even think I could change the belt. O well, guess we better get back on topic. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Hi randjack

I liked your post.

When I was first learning to drive, I asked anyone and everyone who had a car, to let me have a go. Two of the most interesting ones were a mini copper s and a series 1 ex MOD land rover. The mini had been "tweaked" just a lot and was basicaly a rocket power roller skate, with a leather button steering wheel. For sheer feel of power I've driven nothing since that even comes close to that flying by the seat of your pants sensation, beside that you only had to look wrong at the steering wheel and you'd be off back to where you came. But for challenge the series 1 for me a meer 16yrs old, the series 1 was a hell of a vehicle to learn in. Low reving diesel, no synchro-mesh what-so-ever. You learned real fast just when to change gear and how, double clutching all the way. The time spent in that vehicle helped to drive many an arkward HGV. Ah those were the days.

Many years ago I worked for General Motors at their proving ground in Milford, Michigan so I can give you a little history behind those shift indicator lights ...

They were put in cars to make it easier for manufacturers of cars with manual transmissions to meet/pass EPA fuel economy regulations. The deal was that the manufacturer would install the shift indicator light, which was designed to maximize fuel mileage, BUT the manufacturer had to then prove that customers actually used the shift indicator light.

Every some number of years GM would have to do a fairly large customer survey to find out how many of them actually used the shift indicator light. If the usage was above a specified percentage - and it was, then GM could use the shift indicator light recommended mileage.

I suspect Ford was doing the same thing as GM.

As they say ... your actual mileage may vary. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

That makes sense. The EPA really ruins everything. <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

By the way, if you really want to learn how to drive stick then drive this thing around for a while:


That is my 1968 Brockway with what is known as a "five-and-a-four", if anyone can figure out what that means then you know that if you can drive that you can drive anything.

Five forward gears & 4 reverse or after going through the gears 1-5 back to 4th is actually 6th, etc.?

Think two manual transmissions back to back. The only way to get the 20 gears the truck needed was to give it two transmissions. So you have two shifters and have to take your hands off the wheel of a 35 ton rolling house that doesn't brake or steer very well. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Eeeek! I had enough trouble with a 3 on the column Ford F100.

Like an old 10-speed, which was 2 and 5. Or more modern bikes are usually 3 and 7, for 21 speeds.

3-on-the-trees are fun! (Until they wear out and don't want to shift) <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />