Quite a number of countries, including mine, Australia, are targets. Others including countries like Indonesia, Singapore, Egypt are also targets not just the West

Yes quite right a number of Irish Republicans wanted the British out of Northern Ireland and took political and terrorist action to get them out. Just like in Iraq. Bombs went off in Britain and the public response was measured as was the Britsih governments. It went on for years. So when ais the US pulling out of Iraq?

Probably never. We have too many interests to protect in that region.

I guess the question is "Will Iraq be our ally after we declare victory and switch to occupation ops?" I am guessing that they will.

Heck, how long have we had bases in Japan and Germany after we won WWII? or Korea after that conflict was over (technically we are still at war there).

This idea that we will just pack up all our troops and equipment and go home is unrealistic, even if we were to relinquish all the daily patrols and counter-insurgent actions to the Iraqis tomorrow, we would still keep at least a few thousand troops and supplies in strategically located and well fortified bases. I bet the "IZ" will be controlled by allied forces for at least another decade.

We aren't going anywhere for a long while.

The bases in Germany were maintained in response to the USSR during the Cold War. I don't know what troop level they have maintained since the collapse of the USSR but I'll bet it is much lower even before the troops were needed in Iraq. Part of the reason they are still there is what would pulling them out do to the local economy of a NATO ally. Look at how the representatives lobbied to influence which bases were closed in the 90's.

I didn't mean to imply that they weren't being hit. Countries like Egypt are getting hit at least partly because they are allied with us. The extremists call the West and in particular the US the Great Satan.



The plan has always been to get a good handle on the security problems then work on the political side. Last I'd really listened to the news, we are doing exactly that. Something like 30,000 of the militants in Iraq have switched sides in the fight against Al Quaida (sp?).

Yes, NATO was a political necessity. I suppose there will always be an excuse for us to keep our presence worldwide at one place or another. If not Germany, then Kazakstan, or Uzbekistan, or Sudan, or Antartcica, or Diego Garcia. So long as we continue to believe we have to be the world police and welfare agency, we will always feel the need to "protect our interests abroad".

Well going in to Iraq may have been a mistake, since Saddam was pretty much able to keep his unruly countrymen under control, secular or fundamentalist.

Always wondered why a non-fundamentalist guy in a homburg, who likes whiskey, lets women wear what they like, has Christian friends and colleagues and who owns some neat bolt action rifles (potential NRA member here) was toppled to put in a corrupt puppet democracy giving a bunch of fundamentalist fanatics the opportunity to destabilize the region.

Going into Afghanistan was understandable but Iraq....?

Just hope the US has the political will to to last the long haul and help the Iraqis sort out the mess.

We would've left the SOD alone, if he'd have just stayed the heck outta Kuwait. But no, he just had to go where he wasn't supposed to. He was the best thing we had to deal with Iran until he got too greedy. Unfortunately, Kuwait was a more important asset than Iraq to us at the time, and then he got defiant with Bush Sr and had to be punished...

I don't think going to Iraq was such a mistake, it was afterwards, when we pandered to the Shi'ite crowd and let Iran and Syria do what they pleased that was the big mistake. I think most Iraqis were not fundamentalists before we invaded, but as the terrorism takes it's toll, it is becoming more and more like Palestine. People will only live with desperation for so long before they start grabbing for any support they can get.

See my next forum topic.

If we weren't who would be? If the US started contributing to the UN in relation to our representation it'd be a serious cut to their finances. They currently expect us to foot 22% of their budget and 1/4 of the peacekeeping budget. They shouldn't ask us to pay for fixing the world's problems & expect us not to act like it.

True. But it'll definitely be more than a few thousand. More like tens of thousands (not counting private contractors). With all this talk of withdrawl no politicians or pundits mention there are up to four permanent "mega bases" in various stages of construction around the country. Balad air base, Al-Asad, etc. Not to mention the vatican sized, billion dollar embassy. You don't invest those kinds of resources if you plan on leaving.