Most of the problem makers around here have already met my dog and want nothing to do with him. Besides that little fact I was just suggesting that there are a lot more ways of going about this than wood and nails. Your post does not say were you are from but I am sure that is coloring your ideas I know my experiences color mine. This is not just theory with me I have been there several times. Vandals and looters would not last very long in the places I talk about. In fact several years ago some hoods from the big city came to show the local element how its done up there. Two days later they were in bags headed back to the big city, they had found out how it?s done in our neck of the woods. You just can?t kick someone?s door in and expect to live through it more than a time or two.
You should read up on Israeli mob control thought it might give you some ideas as to what is possible with little effort or fuss.
Anyone foolish enough to think that I would be dry after hearing a few blast from the Ol 12 would be in for a nice little surprise party held in their honor by the Ol Daddy Dog himself. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

You’re making me homesick!!
I sure miss being out away from anything I live in a small town for the next two years at least but after that we will be headed back to the country.
Hey I bet your neighbors call you and tell you a strange car is headed your way or your aunt or uncle is dropping by as they just passed by their place. People can’t imagine knowing people that live miles away like that.
Those that have not driven an hour each ways to get groceries haven’t a clue what you’re talking about I bet.

Speaking as someone who returned from college unannounced, I REALLY wish my neighbors did that. So do my folks. <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

But they will call you, then the cops, if they only hear one or two gunshots, and if you don't answer, take a look themselves. (If they hear a lot, they figure the range is in use. :P ) And will call you and ask if you are busy because they spotted someone up in the woods at night with a flashlight. Or will come over with thier tractor and pull you car out of the drive way you you find out that donut tires really suck on ice and the drive is plowed four inches skinnier than your car is long...

And happily foist off extra zuchinni on you, and smile when I get back with squash.

Volunteer fire department, to. Very handy.

Yep, I miss it when I'm not at home.

Great topic! Assuming I'm home when TSHTF, like you I'd be stongly inclined to shelter-in-place unless the event involves something that directly threatens me. But I think my reasons are different from those of most folks on the ETS forums. For one thing, with about 2 million other folks in Manhattan proper and only a few bridges/tunnels leading off the island, the lines to bug out would be just horrific -- I'd need an awfully good reason to leave, which means:

• As to natural disasters, I'm on the 23d floor, so flooding isn't really an issue ... if there's a quake I'd stay home for a couple of days (if the structural integrity hasn't been compromised) until the crowds clear out, then head for friends or relatives with homes a little closer to the ground ... my building is supposedly fireproof construction, so structure fire is pretty irrelevant (though the resulting smoke might be a problem) ... and hurricanes, well the bathroom is windowless so no danger from flying glass, and I guess I'll just have to hope that the building was built to code.
• As for terrorism, if it's a field-effect attack (dirty bomb, aerial distribution of smallpox, etc.) I'd have a tough decision between bugging out and just sealing the h--- out of my windows & doors with duct tape & plastic sheeting ... if it's a localized attack (like the WTC or last week's London bombs), I'll bug in unless the attack directly affects me or my apartment.
• In case of civil unrest, well I figure my building's super would arrange for security on the ground floor and/or shut down the elevator (and I figure most looters wouldn't be climbing 22 floors to get to my apartment).

On the other hand, if I'm stuck at the office out in the 'burbs (as happened with both 9/11 and the August '03 blackout), I'd be somewhat more inclined to consider bugging out ... I have a minimal BOB stashed under my desk, including hiking-friendly footwear, and colleagues who have generously offered me shelter when I was stranded those 2 times, so I'd have lots of choices.

Buggin' In is always our #1 choice.

For some of us here on the forum, intermediate scenarios are very complicated - I have community duties, as do many others. Maybe it's bad enough that I order (or they know to because of the situation) the family to bug out, but I need to stay. That turns into a real nail biter to plan. PLAN. That's an important thing - even if "the plan" has to be scrapped or modified, the planning will help. Probably. <shrug> You do what is prudent in advance and deal with it as it comes. If all risk was eliminated from life it would be pretty boring.

Great topic.

Regards,

Tom

This all assumes we are home or can get home when TSHTF and for those of us commuters that work a 40 hour weeks far from the house this is not so likely. This is why EDC, knowledge and practice is so important... and a vehicle kit too if you can get to your vehicle.

Well, only two of the routes I can count on to be minimal traffic. They are gravel farm roads that aren't shown on normal maps, and unless you are looking for them, you're not even going to know they are there. Much of eastern Washington is desolate, with nothing but large dryland wheat farms (although irrigated vineyards are popping up more and more). The other two routes do require some transit on major thoroughfares, unavoidable I'm afraid. Still, there are detours I can take along these routes if need be.

Ultimately I have to agree that bugging out is kinda like a last desperate act. If things really got that bad, I'd probably only be delaying the inevitable anyways. That's why I don't lose any sleep at night worrying about such things. I've done what I can, and I am as ready as my pocketbook will allow right now.

Now when I get back from Baghdad, that's another story to tell...

Sounds like you've got the ultimate security system, got any pic.s. I had two pits for 16 years, and am a fan of all the 'gator jawed breeds. The temperament of the dog has a lot to do with the owner, mine were overgrown lapdogs... unless you grabbed one of the family, then it was chow time.

Troy

A mag. tube extender gets you up to 8, and it's not at all difficult to "reload on the run". Two dogs ARE better than one, and who says you can't have a partner gunning with you???

In a large scale, non-localized, panic-inducing threat, bugging out isn't a very viable option in many cases. Specifically those of us living in heavily populated areas.

Consider for example, there are several million people in the Puget Sound (greater Seattle) area. If they all headed for the hills at once, you are not likely to get very far in any reasonable timeframe unless you had early warning or you already live on the outskirts, or have some other angle (boat, plane nearby).

I don't think this is a very easy problem to solve. Certainly if anyone has a bright ideas (other than move) it would be great to hear them.

In my case, I'm certainly inclined to SIP unless really pushed (house underwater type thing). From that perspective, I think just having a BOB with reasponable provisions would be good enough improve your situation.

-john