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#42890 - 07/04/05 11:15 PM Re: Help them live or let them die?
BigAssDiesel Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 58
I am a Paramedic. I keep a bag in my truck that has a number of items (IV sets, Saline, Lac. Ringers bags, Epi-pens, Benedryl, etc) If it were a true life threatning emergency I would do whatever I could.

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#42891 - 07/05/05 12:06 AM Re: Help them live or let them die?
Chris Kavanaugh Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 3824
When I was on active service it was made very clear we were obligated to render assistance in any emergency until proper authorities arrived with greater resources( including skill) To do anything less, if observed fell under the civilian concept of Depraved Indifference and several articles of the UCMJ. As a civilian, I am becoming almost as frightened of the legal fallout as the adrenal rush and pavlovian response to act. I recently evacuated a few horses during a local brushfire next to the 101 freeway. I had the skill, a familiar gametrail escape route and a safe evacuation point( a fenced tennis court.) I even had the permission of the local CHP and Fire Department who know me. 3, 1200 lb frightened animals are the last thing an allready taxed firecrew and CHiPS shutting down a major freeway need running around in blind fear. My thanks? One of the horses suffered a pretty nasty looking wound to the cannon bone of a rear leg. It took the DVM all of 20 minutes to clean up the mess. It's going to take me a formal appearance in court. The owners called Animal Control and I am being sued. My own horses were inspected by the Agency that has called on me countless times to 'volunteer' during major fires. They have a photo of me standing waistdeep in the surf controlling 2 burned horses during the Malibu fire. Now I know why people hide behind tinted windows <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />


Edited by Chris Kavanaugh (07/05/05 12:12 AM)

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#42892 - 07/05/05 12:11 AM Re: Help them live or let them die?
aardwolfe Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 924
Loc: St. John's, Newfoundland
Just a crazy thought - can't you countersue, on the grounds that *their* animal put you at risk?
_________________________
"The mind is not a vessel to be filled but a fire to be kindled."
-Plutarch

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#42893 - 07/05/05 02:32 AM Good luck in court.
Stu Offline
I am not a P.P.o.W.
Old Hand

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: Finger Lakes of NY State
Seems we have a society in that people won't take responsibility for their own actions and want too blame others for what they do wrong. Here you tried to protect their animals in a bad situation, and they are suing you. What a loser owner.

I saw a nice Akita pup get hit by a car, called animal control – who said it would be several hours before they could get there. I took the suffering pup to a emergency DVM and had him treated. Took the pup home and called the humane society, who contacted the owner 2 days later. All the owner did was [censored] about the cost of the treatment that I asked to be reimbursed for. It was less than the offered reward for the pup. After the owner refused to pay, I owned the pup. He became a good friend for a long time.
_________________________
Our most important survival tool is our brain, and for many, that tool is way underused! SBRaider
Head Cat Herder

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#42894 - 07/05/05 03:27 AM Re: Good luck in court.
Anonymous
Unregistered


Good luck, Chris.

My first responder is long since expired, and I have nightmares about this kind of thing.

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#42895 - 07/05/05 05:17 AM This must be the original news item
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
Here is one of the original news items about this incident:

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/news/100803_local_inhaler.html

These weren't younger children, as I had assumed (I was reading this in the paper upside down, originally), but two 15-yr-olds, who used the same medication, and had permission from parents to use the other's medication if a problem arose.

The boy was expelled and charged with a felony. I couldn't find much further information on this case -- the girl was removed from the public school by her parents & put in a private school, but the last I could find, the boy was expelled, arrested, put in jail and was still being charged with a felony.

In looking for this article, I found others where the usual action by the schools was to confiscate the inhalers and keep them locked up in the office somewhere. If a kid needs his in a hurry, too bad!

Most of these problems are taking place in public schools, with their usual fix-everything, "zero-tolerance", nose in the air insanity.

In a related article, a mother said that if a student put a plastic bag over a teacher's head for even a few seconds, he would be charged with assault, but the schools see nothing wrong with doing virtually the same thing with their students.

Sue

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#42896 - 07/05/05 08:27 AM Re: Help them live or let them die?
pteron Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 10/01/01
Posts: 59
Loc: UK
Chris, in general I agree with you, but one of the most interesting studies of recent times found that the rate of asthma in Sweden (majorly green country) far exceeded that of East Germany (industrial smog). This appears counter intuitive and I'm not aware of any explanation for it.

My own (and my son's) asthma has been controlled without drugs for many years now, basically after we removed wall to wall carpets from our life and changed from a modern 'seal all the draught points and use central heating' house to an old, notionally dusty, but well ventilated house.

Asthma in the west needs investigating by intelligent people who do not have a drug to push.

Andy

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#42897 - 07/05/05 09:49 AM Re: This must be the original news item
johnbaker Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/17/02
Posts: 384
Loc: USA
I looked a little more. The boy who lent his inhaler (to his girl friend who used the identical inhaler) was the one expelled and arrested. According to the news article, within 2 days the criminal charge was dropped and he was allowed to return to school. For some incomprehensible reason his parents instead opted to home-school him. Gee, I wonder why. This was obviously a situation calling for a good lawyer representing the boy.

The later news report can be found at http://freerepublic.info/focus/f-news/999350/posts

I periodically teach a class on Constitutional rights and obligations (BSA First Class requirement #5). One of the things I emphasize to my students is never under any circumstances to admit to any possible criminal wrongdoing to anyone who potentially may perform law enforcement functions. Also, I stress the importance of never talking with law enforcement authorities re any potentially criminal investigation into your behavior in the absence of your own lawyer. Minor traffic violations are the only exception.

John


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#42898 - 07/05/05 07:52 PM Re: Good luck in court.
Craig Offline


Registered: 11/13/01
Posts: 1784
Loc: Collegeville, PA, USA
Quote:
After the owner refused to pay, I owned the pup.


You did a good thing. It is sad and sobering to realize the sort of poeple the owner represents outnumber us. Or make more noise, or file more lawsuits, or something. Sigh.

-- Craig

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#42899 - 07/05/05 08:00 PM Re: Help them live or let them die?
Craig Offline


Registered: 11/13/01
Posts: 1784
Loc: Collegeville, PA, USA
Quote:
Now I know why people hide behind tinted windows


As I recall, the entire legal landscape changed when the courts ruled tobacco companies could be sued for smokers' deaths and health problems.

That decision was pure insanity that killed personal accountability and opened the lawsuit floodgates.

If you smoke, you decide to take that action and take the consequences. That's what we adults do. The ruling basically sees us as children.

-- Craig

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