Bill,<br><br>I think you'll have to make a new one; I've made and tested about a dozen so far (Scouts; I actually hovered while they followed my instructions). The best hole-maker I've used so far is a pin vise holding a stub of a fairly small needle (I can mic one if it's important). I used CAD to lay out the holes (cut the disk out of the paper and punched the can thru the paper). A very light hammer (4 oz or less) and three hands... one guy holds the can and the pinvise and the second guy taps the pin vise with the hammer when asked. Another advantage of using a needle is that you control the direction (angles) of the jets fairly well as opposed to a drilled hole - and if the jet is not exactly where you want it, you can "tweak" it by re-inserting the needle and angling the hole (bend it).<br><br>Also, a bit of aluminum flashing makes a great windscreen and kicks the efficiency up another notch. I bend the ends so they can interlock (grip the fingers together on your hands, palms facing each other - like that). The pots nestle down about 3/4 of the way inside the windscreens the way I do them.<br><br>IIRC, I modeled these after the Photon stove (what a coincidental name...). I did make one of the pearlite filled ones and it worked fine, but the photon-style are nicer IMHO. My boys and I made about 4 variations of number and placement of jets - they all work about the same (not quite - we can time boil and burn-duration differences) - you may as well enjoy the experimenting for yourself <grin>.<br><br>Did you use my oven-cure tip for the J-B Weld? I am not patient enough to wait 15 hours...<br><br>Tom

Tom, could you email a graphic file (GIF, JPG, whatever) with your hole layout?<br><br>I'll have to make some new ones. The kids each want one of their own now! Once, I perfect it, I'll then I'll work with the scouts in building their own. How much time does it take to have a group build them? 2-3 meetings?<br><br>Have you used it for backpacking yet? If so, do you leave your commercial stove at home?<br><br>I didn't try you're quick cure technique. I was working on it late at night so I let it sit until I got home from work the next day.<br><br>I also haven't constructed the wind screen yet. I have a 3 foot tube of duct hat I was going use, but I think some flashing would be lighter gauge, and weigh less! I want to make the windscreen short enough to fit inside the nylon sack that came with the Snow Peak pot. Everything else fits inside of the pot. <br><br>BTW, mine is the Don Johnson Photon stove too. <br><br>Oh, BTW, regarding painting the bottom of the pot black. I was contemplating how far up the side to paint, such as an inch up from the bottom. I was also considering painting the entire outside black. Any thoughts on that?<br><br>Thanks

Bill,<br><br>Sure - I'll convert it to PDF and send it to you. Might take a day; kinda busy right now.<br><br>As for how long it takes to make them - the bottleneck is tool-based. Some of the steps are best performed in a certain sequence; others can mix it up a little. Two examples: (1) Drilling the central fill hole must be done before the halves are joined, but it can be done either to a whole can before cutting it down (my choice) or after cutting it down (but before splitting the sides). (2) One must cut the dome off the bottom of the third can before cementing it to the cut-down tuna can.<br><br>So figure out the sequence you're going to have them follow and figure out how many groups your tool supply can accomodate. There is no point in having two groups that rely on one or more shared tools; the shared tool bottlenecks both groups. The bottleneck for us was the pin vise and planishing hammer for making the jet holes (and that takes some time) Also, regular hole punches will not hold up to making several of these. Either pick up a couple of cheap spares or get an inexpensive die-type hand punch from Harbor Freight or someone similar (they reach better anyway and have about 7-9 die-punch combos for various size holes - handy gadgets).<br><br>Bring a toaster oven to kick the J-B Weld - about 5 to 10 minutes at 160-180 deg-F (Experiment at home so you know your settings first).<br><br>Pre-cut the aluminum flashing and the hardware cloth. Make SURE you have the tuna cans and/or similar sized cans (#2 1/2 cans & some brands of coffee cans) before the evening you begin the project.<br><br>Sanding the paint off works best wet - use a pan of water or a sink. You'll go thru too much sandpaper (loads up) otherwise.<br><br>Expect some mistakes and have spare materials on hand. Too many boys these days have never done anything with their hands... this is new stuff for many.<br><br>If you really get it organized, figure 2 full meetings (with a third "make-up" in your pocket for absent boys and those who must "start over"). Cut all the parts one meeting and epoxy / make pot holders and windscreens the next. That worked OK for us.<br><br>My boys have used them backpacking and are very pleased with them. Rumor has it that some catastrophe will strike us deep in the woods while on an after dark hike this coming weekend... shhhh! (Weinberg-King State Park, and no, the Scouts don't have a clue other than knowing me...) I would not shy away from it myself, but I have my habits and I have stoves, so... I personally still use my stoves. Normally my old clunker Peak I around here. However, that will probably NOT be in my daypack for a midnight stroll around here with the Scouts.<br><br>As for your pot-painting - heck, I'd only supress it down from the rim as far as you feel it needs to be to avoid "contamination" of the lip of the pot. Never tried that myself - my stuff is just "naturally" blackened. Let us know how it works out, please!<br>

harborfreight.com! !!! That's a dangerous website! Thanks.<br><br>I think I'll begin with my son's patrol. One thing we have not done well is to promote patrol activities. My son's patrol met several times to make a flag when they cnaged names, but they never plan any activities outside of the troop. My son and his Asst. have been alking about getting them together on a weekend for a cooking meeting. His asst. has a recipe for baking chicken under a popcorn tub (ala turkey under a small garbage can). I think I'll print off copies of the instructions for them and suggest that I could help them construct them while the chicken bakes! Then I can have them teach the others how to do it when suddenly everyone wants one. I like making evil plans .<br><br>Speaking of evil, your weekend plans sound perfect. I have recently been think about how to encorporrate such surprises into the program. This weekend I was restocking my first aid kit that I keep in my pack (I kep my meds in there and recycle fresh ones in every 6 months). As I unpacked my Microshield CPR barrier, it occured to me that it really was of no use in the kit. If someone were to drop to the ground and stop breathing, I doubt I'd say, Wait a moment." and run bak to my tnt for the shield.<br><br>So now I've attached it to my Palm Pilot zipper keyring (as in Urban Survival kit), which is detachable so I can attach it to duplicate ings on various pieces o equipment (Pocketz on my belt or the lanyard end to my PSK).<br><br>So tonight's meeting during the openning announcements, I'm going to conduct a Pop Preparedness Quiz. First I'll ask how many know how to recesiate someone who has stopped breathing. Then I'll ask those who's hands are raised if they are prepared right now to perform mouth-to-mouth resecitation. I'm sure a few hands will drop. Lastly, I'll ask how many have mouth barrier with them. I'm sure they'll all drop.<br><br>Perghaps I an ad a quiz once a month. Such as bring a tray with tinder and kindling and see how many are "prepared" to light a fire without a lighter? without a match?<br><br>Back to the stove. I idn't sand of the paint from my cans. Is there a reason other than asthetics?

<<harborfreight.com! !!! That's a dangerous website! >><br><br>Even more so when they have a local store like here...<br><br>I like your ideas re the patrol meetings and the troop meetings.<br><br>We sanded off paint where the epoxy joint was expected to be. Two of my boys think theirs look "right" au natural (sanded all the paint off).<br><br>I have an idea or two for improving the durability of these (the exposed edge of the outer can is fragile) - see what your experiences are and let us know.<br><br>An outdoors demonstration of why NOT to use paint thinner (mineral spirits) instead of alcohol is not a bad idea. (HOT! HOT! BIG FLAMES! SOOT!) I dunno if I'd try it with gasoline or Zippo lighter fluid... they might think it's funny enough to do on purpose. OTOH, remote detonation, er, ignition via a model rocket launch system to sober them up about NOT EVER using gasoline might not be a bad idea... you have to outguess your own boys; I'm keeping ahead of ours SO FAR.<br><br>Watch out for poorly punched holes in the inner can - they can easily slit the outer can when assembled if there are any burrs protruding. It is worth demonstrating this... A good punch makes this a more satisfying project...

I usually make my stoves while my wife is at work, and therefore don't have three hands available. An acceptable substitute I discovered is to do much of the prep work (sanding the paint off, scribing the line for shortening the cans), as well as punching the burner holes, using a FULL can of soda. You gotta be carefull when you punch the first hole of course, but the liquid inside of the can prevents squishing the can by heavy handed use, and the weight helps hold it in place while you poke the holes. After you punch all of the burner holes you pop the top, drain, and then cut...

Good idea! Had not thought about starting with a "virgin" can.

It doesn't hurt as much if you use a can of something you don't like to drink...I have been using Dr. Pepper lately, since I hate the stuff...