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#39206 - 03/24/05 04:59 PM Re: Generators and disasters
Anonymous
Unregistered


You have a solid argument for putting a generator low on the priority list.
However, it could depend on how you or your surroundings might be impacted by a disaster. A simple power outage is one thing, the possible damage from a hurricane or earthquake may dictate that with the power out and some damage to deal with, a generator would allow the use (safe use) of certain power tools and lights, as well as the capability to re-charge batteries for some power tools.

Again, it seems to boil down to a decision of personal choice and the amount of money you want to invest in a "what if"scenario.
Having a garage full of very usefull tools during a disaster would be a shame if they were needed and no power source was available.
As a believer in being self sufficient at all times, I think I would still make the investment. Not sure I would keep a generator full and ready to go, but I would gather as much information as possible on the proper storage, maintenance, etc.

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#39207 - 03/24/05 05:32 PM Re: Generators and disasters-Generator noise
bountyhunter Offline


Registered: 11/14/03
Posts: 1224
Loc: Milwaukee, WI USA
To all:

Noise is such a simple and inexpensive problem to deal with, I am suprised to find several postings complaining about it.

The majority of the noise from gas run generators is made by the exhaust of the engine. The cheapest way to resolve that is with a multi-muffler manifold or attaching a large car muffler to it.

Get some black iron pipe which is the same diameter as your engine muffler that screws into the engine exhaust port. To that, install a black iron tee with the center section of the tee the same size as the pipe thread coming out of the engine and the two opposing fittings at least one size larger. Run a pipe from the end of each opposing tee to another tee where the opposing tee connections are the same diameter. The center connection at those tee fittings should be the same size as the muffler you are going to attach to it. Run another pipe from each of those tees to a 90 degree reducing elbow that has the same size pipe diameter at one end and the muffler pipes diameter at the other end. Make sure that the pipes running between the tees and elbows are long enough to allow muffler installation at each point. Attach (4) mufflers and listen to it purr all day long. For an automotive muffler you only need to run pipes, & adapters to clear the generator before clamping the muffler.

The biggest thing to contend with will be the weight this modification puts on the engine exhaust port. If the engine is solidly mounted, just run (2) support bars from a couple of points on the generator chassis meeting at a "U" shaped support at the end of the newly installed manifold. Make the manifold end of the support "U" or "V" shaped so that the manifold just lays on it and do not use any clamps at that end so that the manifold can flex freely when heated by the exhaust.

If the engine is mounted on springs or rubber vibration isolators, you will have to attach a support to the top part of (2) of the engines mounting base bolts so that the support travels with the engine and does not stress the manifold or the engines exhaust port. The (2) support bars should meet at a "U" or "V" fitting supporting the manifold with no clamps so that the manifold can flex freely when heat from the exhaust causes expansion.

Good luck!

Bountyhunter

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#39208 - 03/24/05 09:53 PM Re: Generators and disasters
brian Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 1468
Loc: Texas
Personally I think the whole idea of having and maintaining a generator and storing fuel is a waste of time, money and effort for the most part. For 99% of the people out there a generator is about comfort and convenience rather than survival. If youre the other 1% and depend on electricity to power your oxygen tent or something else that keeps you alive and healthy then get the best you can find. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Learn to improvise everything.

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#39209 - 03/25/05 02:05 AM Re: Generators and disasters
Anonymous
Unregistered


I disagree. For me, and a lot of people I know, having a generator isn't about making blended margaritas after a disaster. It's for the days or weeks aftewards without power. It's for when society begins to normalize and you have to return to your lives. It's inevitavle, eople have to go back to work. I know, I know. It's tough. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> It ain't fun sleeping in high humidity in a hot room with little or no airflow. Then you have to wake up and take a tepid shower and throw on a tie. Add in the fact that some have to take care of the elderly or children and it becomes more difficult. Sure, not getting good sleep, putting on work clothes and going to work stinky ain't gonna kill anybody, but part of survival is managing the mental aspect. Running a wall AC unit, having ice water, and taking a warm shower can go a long way. It may not be survival per se, but there's a reason people don't just store 50 gallons of water, some mainstay rations, and a tarp. If you and your family have to live a few weeks without any power, perspectives change. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Oh yeah, the margaritas are nice tooo.... <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

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#39210 - 03/25/05 04:23 AM Re: Generators and disasters-Generator noise
RayW Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/06/01
Posts: 601
Loc: Orlando, FL
Hey Bounty, the larger muffler is much more effective on the newer OHV engines, i have tried using the auto mufflers on the older flat head Briggs & Stratton engines and it does does take some of the bass note out of the engine noise but it is still loud a 100 feet away. I currently have one of the flat head engines on the spare generator that i loaned to my neighbor during all three of the hurricanes that blew through the neighborhood last year, they had it on the other side of thier house and we are on acre lots. They get up around 6 am because at 6:05 the gen set started up and i could hear it quite well. I have since reinstalled the factory muffler (much smaller package without the big can) and i can't tell any difference in the sound when it is over there. And i am not complaining about the noise, but if i lived in a neighborhood where the houses are close together it might be a different story. And having a spare gen set has it's benefits, while i re-wired his well pump to run on the generator he went out gas shopping. I definitely had the better end of the deal.

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#39211 - 03/25/05 05:53 AM Re: Generators and disasters-Generator noise
AyersTG Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/10/01
Posts: 1272
Loc: Upper Mississippi River Valley...
The quietest conventional gensets I know of are studio gensets. We used them in the 9th Infantry Division (Motorized) a long time ago (painted proper colors, of course). They were extremely quiet - drove the OPFOR nuts at the NTC because they were used to homing in on brigade CPs by listening for the generators (they never did find our CP - that was just one reason).

Too big for residential standby use, of course - but if you have an opportunity to study one, it will give you a lot of good ideas about how to significantly reduce the noise signature of any genset.

But an air-cooled genset is not going to be capable of being silenced as much as a water cooled one - no way.

Tom


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#39212 - 03/25/05 11:26 AM Re: Generators and disasters-Generator noise
stormadvisor Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/14/05
Posts: 87
Loc: Ohio
Quote:
Too big for residential standby use, of course


If you get a couple neighbors together, you could power your houses <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Being a ham operator I try to keep a good supply of batteries. A good set of batteries on a trickle charge with an inverter would provide the "emergency power" needed for communications and other things on an as needed basis. It definitely would not work for long term unless you really conserve or have really LARGE batteries. I plan on doing this because I just moved and am on a well now. The generator is in the plans for the future though.

As to fuel. I have a ham friend who is also a M.A.R.S. operator and he has his generator hooked up to his natural gas supply. Now this would only work if the supply line was not damaged, but he has told me that most generators can be converted for this with minimal cost. Most of the time it takes a call to the manufacture to get the instructions.
_________________________
Stormadvisor

Can't change the weather. Might as well enjoy it.

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#39213 - 03/25/05 01:37 PM Re: Generators and disasters
williamlatham Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 265
Loc: Stafford, VA, USA
I have to agree with you Brian. Generators are about convenience. The Amish and anyone living off the grid can attest to this. Unfortunately I was in the 1%, but only because I had a couple of thousand invested in saltwater fish and the tank needed to be maintained.

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#39214 - 03/25/05 02:20 PM Re: Generators and disasters-Generator noise
RayW Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/06/01
Posts: 601
Loc: Orlando, FL
What is nice about propane and natural gas is it doesn't go bad from storage. No more gummed up carbs. And with some of the conversions you can still run gasoline. If you get a gen set and want to convert it try this site,

http://www.uscarb.com/

Have never dealt with them but the site has a lot of information.

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#39215 - 03/30/05 02:12 PM Re: Generators and disasters
brian Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 1468
Loc: Texas
Im sorry but I hear you talking about convenience and comfort... not survival.
_________________________
Learn to improvise everything.

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