Let's start a discussion/rant about knives. Premise 1) a single knife (knife blade only, forget multitools and SAKs for this argument)for camping and survival. 2)not combat, hand-to-hand, survivalism.
..>> Here's my argument:
1) A small to mid size folder like the Ritter Benchmade
2) Locking
3) Any blade configuration you like, as long as it is a folder!
So Let's argue this point:
FIXED BLADE KNIVES, particularly the larger ones, MAKE NO SENSE AND OFFER NO ADVANTAGE (quick.. duck.. here comes a rant).
In a survival situation (not homesteading) you don't need more than a good folder.You're going to burn up more energy than you need to expend hacking at sticks and limbs any bigger than you could break over your knee. You're going to increase the chances of an injury. You're not going to dig holes or mine copper with your fixed blade, anyway. Just "mostly whittle" if you're smart/careful.

Aside from the observation that they look cool (I own many premium custom fixed blade knives, so I'm not underendowed.. in that arena...), tell me something you need a fixed blade knife for in the camping/survival situation.. that couldn't be done with the folder..that should be done in a camping/survival situation. "Should be done" as in.. let's not build suspension bridges or log cabins..

Hi

I have a SAK with a locking blade.

But, I just can't relax with folding knives because I don't have a firm grip on the blade's shaft/handle/extension. . . Every cutting/sawing action puts a bending force on the folding blade, so imagine cutting through a hard/rough material in the wet and when it's freezing and in panic . . .

I agree.

I myself am trying to be prepared for a relatively short survival duration. Maybe 3-4 days. I'm not planning on building a log cabin, nor do I need to snare and prep food (Lord knows I have enough "stored reserves").

My biggest worries are keeping healthy and sheltered, finding some water, and making sure I can get found quickly.

Last night I was reading the bonus material that comes with Doug's PSP. Good reading. If you haven't read it, then I recommend you do so. It can be found at the ETS PSP description page.

I once posted the question of why such a large fixed blade is needed in a survival situation and was told that it was needed to chop/split wood in order to get to dry inner wood (assuming the outter wood was wet).

I've camped for a looong time and never failed to find some dry wood for starting fires - usually deadwood still on trees near the trunk.

The one thing I have missed while using my Rittergrip is the awl that I have on my good old Boy Scout pocketknife. I found I used it a lot for poking holes in things. Not a very big deal. Though I haven't tried it yet - mostly for fear of ruining it - I always figured the tweezers in Doug's PSP could be used for a similar purpose.

Another thing not too often mentioned is the weight of the knife. Before I bought the Rittergrip I bought a Buck Alpha Hunter. While a fine knife, it is just too darn heavy to haul around with me without pulling my pants down (which leads to other social and physical issues). I very much appreciate lightweight knives. Just this morning I picked up the Rittergrip and tossed it in the air a few times (while closed) just to marvel at how light that big blade really is.

I also don't need a 1/4" thick blade. If I'm forcing my Rittergrip blade so hard that it is bending then (1) I am putting myself in danger of a real nasty injury, (2) I'm risking damaging a very important tool, and (3) I am not conserving vital energy.

I think your position makes a lot of sense; however, you state: "...forget multitools and SAKs for this argument..." . Now this is your thread and you make the rules, but I find that when I follow your argument to its natural conclusion, then it leads me inexorably to my Leatherman Wave rather than a plain folder.

Now if you want to kick me out of the discussion I will understand. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Regards, Vince

NAro:

In the urban world of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA, I am limited to a maximum blade length of 3" and a folding type knife. I would prefer a maximum of 4" and a folding type knife.

In the "rural, outback, lower 40, woods, sticks, hunting & camping grounds, etc." I prefer a fixed blade knife with a hilt at least on the cutting side, of at least a 4" up to 6" slightly swept blade (For skinning.), beyond which I do not see any large advantages to and a folder of 4" with a lanyard ring and lanyard attached to my belt.

The preference for a fixed blade is a matter of convenience as I do not want to go to the trouble of opening and closing the blade every time I use the knife. I have never thought of a knife as a substitute for a hammer, chisel, or wood maul. If I want to hammer, chisel, or split something, I will use my hands and feet or modify a rock for that purpose. My carbon steel Craftsman fixed blade (I have got to find that knife in this mess of a house so I can measure the blade length to have when posting about it.) is a nice size, light weight, and about the only thing that needs modification is maybe a synthetic sheath for it. I have other knives and bayonets whose form and/or function I like, and I may carry more than one fixed blade knife with me when I feel it advisable, but the Craftsman is my mainstay for real excursions, and a folder on me will most likely be the only knife available in a true emergency.

Bountyhunter

KenK

I think that there are some key pints which need to be mentioned here. First of all you suggest that you would not expect to be in a survival situation for more than 4 days or so, or at least this is what you imply, but this cannot the same for everybody. you are obviously experienced and know what you are most likely to need, but i don't think anybody is expected to predict what their exact requirements in a survival situation may be, this is why we prepare ourselves with the best equipment we can reasonably carry. now a fixed blade knife is not all that heavy (the mora's are especially light for fixed blades) and is arguably the most important long term tool (and i think this is your point, you prepare for the short term).

secondly, yes a log cabin is slightly over the top for 4 days, but a lean to is not. you need something you can split wood with to be completely comfortable, maybe not in all situations. it's true that folders are becoming more reliable (but only really at the more expensive end of the spectrum), and maybe they can be used fairly efficiently for small work, but an important factor is how comfortable you are using the knife; blisters you don't want. i have not seen or used any folder which is as comfortable to use as my 5" mora steel as ideally i want a smooth oval wooden handle for extended periods of time.

thirdly, and i think this is the idea put across most often, what if your folder does become slightly loose, or worse break off? i would much rather have a full length knife with a tang to fix than half a knife.

just some ideas.

ian

Your premise is probably correct for 90% of the knife's potential use. It's the 10% I worry about. Gather 50' of poly, hemp or Manila line. Soak it and leave in a freezer for one hour. Now wrap yourself in it and jump into the shallow end of a swimming pool. For good measure lets imobilise your using arm. Have somebody toss a tarp over your head. You have a onehanded folder in your pocket and a sheath knife. For our second scenario sit in the park sandbox next Easter. We are hunting eggs, roots and water. Assume we don't have any improvised shovel and must use our knife. I discovered my RSK nearly imobile from lint and dust in my pockets gumming up in the viscous militec oil, even when applied sparingly ( working a waspy horse in a roundpen can stir up the ground!). This is more a maintenance headache, but again a consideration. Knives are just like firemaking gear. They are both so critical , predetermining to carry solely one is 'cutting' it close.

I prefer a folder for EDC, but rather have a fixed knife for outdoor activities or in a survival situation. They are stronger, safer and easier to use IMHO.

Dare I open up this can of worms <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />.

What about having to pry something apart. What about having to dig something up. Fixed blade knives are stronger than folders. In a survival situation a fixed blade knife would be preferable. Where I live everything has been covered with snow for over a month. Snapping a frozen piece of wood over your knee may not even be possible<img src="/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />. Making a fire quickly wood require IMO spliting of the wood to get to a dry core. Try using a folder to split up a log for fire wood. Some folders can do it but it's less than ideal.

Adam

So wait. Your argument is that you'd rather break a branch over your knee, because if you hack at it with a knife you might injure yourself? I would take my chances chopping than risking injuring my leg on a branch that I misjudged I could break. Not to mention some branches are still attached to the tree, and cannot be broken over the knee simply because of their position. I digress...

Your point seems to be heavily based on your philosophy of what should and should not be done with knives. As long as you're doing what you "should" be doing with knives, a folder works just fine. But not everybody agrees with what's acceptable knife use.

Some people think you shouldn't dig, hammer, hack, or pry with a knife. For them, a folder works just fine. Not everybody agrees with that though, and for those who think using a knife like that is acceptable, a fixed blade is generally superior.

But don't make the mistake of thinking that just because someone has a fixed blade that they're immediately going to start abusing their knife. For some, it's a last resort thing, but the fact that it's an OPTION is important to them. Along those same lines, don't assume because someone carries a folder and believes using a knife this way isn't an acceptable practice that they'll never do it. They may have to one day, and their folder may or may not break.

Everything else about survival is "keep it simple" so why do you submit that this is not the case with knives? Generally people want the most ruggid/robust equipment they can practically have, so that they can depend on it if it's all that's standing between life and death. Generally compactness (a folding knife's main asset) comes second to that with the exception of places where something must be small to ensure you carry it, like PSK's. Even then, people strive to find the most dependable items that are still small enough to fit in the kit. I don't understand why you don't think that's the case here.

I can get into the old arguments that, depending on the model, fixed blade knives have no moving parts to maintain and fail, they have no moving parts to get clogged up, interfering with operation, they have no chance failing at the weak spots and folding on your fingers, no matter how remote that chance is (while we're talking about "chances for injury"), and those would all be accurate statements, but it doesn't really solve anything. It again comes down to preference.

That being said, I EDC several folders. I won't feel under equipped with a folder if I find myself in the wilderness and that's all I have, but if I have the choice, I want the strongest, most dependable fixed blade knife I can find.

You're ranting about folders as if they have something to prove. You compare them to fixed blades because they seem to be the benchmark. Well, that's because they are. They don't have to prove themselves, they've been doing that for thousands of years. Instead, you should ask yourself whether the ability to serve in the improvised and less ideal uses of knives is important to you. That's what it really boils down to. If it's not, then use your folder and be happy. It doesn't matter what other people think; to each their own. If it is, then the argument should be

"a fixed blade can do everything a folder can, and it can also do more if needed" not "a folder can do everything a fixed blade can" because that's incorrect unless you add the disclaimer "as long as you're doing what you should be doing with knives", the definition of which, as mentioned, varies from person to person.

I also prefer a fixed blade.



Couldn't have said it better if I tried.

I love reading these arguments.

It's like "is a folding 9mm better than a fixed .45 ?" <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

As the saying goes, a .22 in your pocket is better than a .45 at home.

As I normally EDC a folding knife, that's my first choice.
But when specifically going "outdoors", the social/legal possibilities change and I then always try to bring a fixed blade along.
Both have their usefulness.
And anyhow, redundancy is a key in preparedness...

Versatility/flexibility/options and weight are two categories that come to mind for discussion on this topic. First, we talk a lot about multi-use tools, and some on the forum wouldn't even consider carrying a tool unless there were at least a half dozen things they could do with it. The other side of that coin - maybe you need more than one tool (knife) to do all the possible functions for which it was intended (or not in some cases). It's clear from the postings on this topic that there are many functions that are best left to a "knife". (Of course we all knew that.) It is also clear that some functions would be better performed by one type/style of knife over another, which brings me to the second category. Knives for any reasonable survival use should all weigh less than a pound. So let's not limit ourselves to too few useful tools by thinking that an extra pound may be the difference between life and death. Carrying one good folder and one good fixed blade knife should be SOP. Maybe a slightly larger BOB is in order.

Nice post!

Adam

I'm wondering how many of those posting to this thread have those fixed blade knives within reach right now? If so, what do you do for a living? I know that if I walked into my corporate cube with a fixed blade knife - well, I'd get stopped by security. They don't even blink at the folder. Its just the reality of my life.

Certainly, if I go out camping or hiking, away from my usual day-to-day rut, I will bring a fixed blade along (Becker BK10), but that is heavy and less likely to follow me where ever I go.

I can't help but notice that the Benchmade Rant, SOF Field Knife, and Fallkniven knives are much lighter. Are they suitably strong for a primary field survival blade? For chopping and splitting?

Im at the office at my desk and I have mine! CRK Shadow III on belt with condom, 2 mp1 tabs, ferro rod, sas compass and a couple tabs of tinderquik in the hanlde. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

As I seem to very often do with your posts Burncycle... I agree with you completely. You said what I was thinking! Great explanation!

I think theres a couple butterfly sutures in there too. Have to check that out later. It's packed pretty tight so I'm not going to mess with it right now.

Remember that a folder is a compromise for portability. It will always be, as they are not as strong and simple in operation. Sure, in most situations a folder is fine. What happens when your out in the jungle and need to get through the underbrush or if you need to chop a larger branch off then what you usually use for fire (one for making shelter, a raft, bridge, ect) and you don't have your saw on you. I wouldn't say it is a huge loss having a folder instead of a fixed blade, but a fixed blade is more capable and is the less complicated tool. Therefore, it is technically the better of the two to have. Like you said though a fixed blade isn't always the easiest thing to carry, which is why folders were invented.

As a long time member of the “Sharpened Pry-bar” school, I get a funny feeling if I am not carrying a fixed knife when I go into the “back country”. Normally I carry a 3” benchmade on my belt. But the axis lock has some small springs and such so I don’t consider it more than my “gentlemans” knife. Good for around town so as not to frighten the PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER..

But when I step out of civilization, I carry a larger old benchmade with the frame lock. It is rugged, easy to clean and probably won’t break. I also carry (at the moment) a Becker Crewman. This is my sharpened pry-bar. Granted, it is heavy, but it is worth the freight. Over the years, one such knife or the other has been used to;

Break into a cabin when the lock jammed and it was getting cold, dark and rainy. Without the large metal object we would have had a bad night.

Rip the fastener off of a fence post when (again) the lock malfunctioned. It was that or a bolt cutter. You carry a bolt cutter???

Cut holes in an abandoned car door to make a sled.

Cut holes in an ammo box to use for an anchor. (filled it with rocks)

Punched holes in a 55 gal drum to make a fire “ring”.

Many many times, used it to pry rocks out of the way when I needed them “gone”, like enlarging a “seep” or level the ground under me.

The more common use, dig a “cat hole” to bury human waste.

And of course, many split logs.

Then there is the general hammering, prying and cutting that just come easier with a fixed knife. I really like my old benchmade and try not to abuse it if there is something bigger around.

I could go on a bit more, but you get the idea. It is more than a knife and I have done serious damage to several of them. But it was always worth the doing.

Adam:

In the winter, if you can't break a piece of wood over your knee because it is frozen stiff indicates the wood has moisture in it that is frozen. The energy and time required to split that wood is greater than to find a dry piece which will snap readily if it contains no moisture.

A folding pruning saw will do better at cutting large branches than a knife and weighs very little, plus it is "PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER." friendly.

If you really plan on digging holes, get the smallest combination folding shovel/pick combination you can afford and I am sure it will work faster and better than a knife, and again, it is "PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER." friendly.

Bountyhunter

BH, that's great if those tools are available.

If not, a knife that can do those things in a pinch is a real plus. Of course it won't do it as well as the proper tool, but if it works, who cares?

Don't confuse strength with wieght. Fallkniven tested their knives at an industrial laboratory. Peter once shared some confidential comparisons, and yes they work well for chopping and splitting. The Swedish AF issues them, US Navy passed them as optional flightcrew carry. A Fallkniven will likely bend before breaking. As an anecdotal example, I woke one early morning to discover my cat missing. She had slipped out and was in a 5' oaktree stump surrounded by coyotes. I grabbed the F1 and raced outside. We were seperated by one of those cheap wrought iron security fences with soft welds. I shoved the blade between two panels and leaned on it. A loud PING was followed by @ 80' of fence folding over ( even cheaper installation.) I grabbed my cat and walked back down the hillside, politely saying good morning to my staring nieghbors . Once inside I realised I was in my underwear <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Chris, I would have like to have seen that cat rescue, or the look on your face when that much fence fell over...but I probably wouldn't wanted to have seen you in your underwear!

Back on topic...

I'm something of a knife collector (as you might know). I've got all sorts, from Victorinox Classics to Gerber BMF's to Cold Steel Bushman's, Benchmade 100RR's and Myerchin A508's. In any situation that does not involve self-defense, a large fixed-blade knife is not of much use. A sturdy, sharp, fixed-blade knife with a blade of about 4" is all you can really handle for fine work, and for anything larger, you're much better off carrying a hatchet. Myself, I picked up a nice Gransfors Mini Belt Hatchet at the Woodenboat Show up in Newport last year (I never buy an axe without picking through several examples to find the one with the best handle). There isn't a chopping job other than bushwhacking that a large knife does better than a hatchet (and for that, you really want a machete, anyway).

Folders? They can be very useful, but the mechanism is always going to present a compromise. One thing that I will never use a folder for is any food or digging, for fear of damaging the mechanism. If I were absolutely limited to one knife (not that I can ever really see that happening, of the ones I currently own, I'd probably choose my Benchmade 190 Drop Point Hunter. Of all knives out there? Maybe an old-skool Marbles...good enough for Kephart, good enough for me.

But in Real Life, I never go anywhere with just *one*.

id have to say i prefer a folder for when your out and about in public and cant go with a fixed blade for obvious reasons.

but for any other time i definitely prefer a fixed blade.

My concern is that I may need to split wood to find dry material. A small pruning saw may be fine and more efficient to cut down a 3" dia. piece of dry wood than chopping it, although with a large knife a few swings will slice though that wood so you could argue which is more efficient, now if you are tired and cold it may not be as safe to swing a knife around. If you are really in a survival situation and you need a big fire and you can't spend all you time tending to it you need some large logs to keep it going. Small branches that you snap over your knee are fine for a small camp fire but if you need to signal a plane a large fire may be required. The coals that are devolved after a large fire has been going for a while will allow you to throw on large logs and just leave them to burn.

In the early spring it is always fun to go out just after the snows have melted and try to get a fire started with the available wood. Anything on the ground is soaked. Anything small off the ground is soaked. I usually need to cut down larger branches of standing dead wood and split them up.

As far as digging holes is concerned a knife is a decent digging tool. Why pack a saw and a shovel when a knife can do that and more.

And last but not least a nice sized fixed blade makes a good pry bar.

Don't get me wrong. I (unfortunatly) find myself in plenty of situations where I simply can't properly conceal my 4" EDC fixed blade (mentioned above) and in those situations I do reluctantly carry a BM AXIS lock folder, however, I would never "choose" the folder. It's alway a compromise that I sometimes (as rarely as possible ) have to reluctantly make.

Great feedback gang. I never expected so much response so quickly.

Now.. do you want to change the topic to "knife under 4 inch" fixed or folder vs over 4" fixed or folder.

Perhaps size does count.. shape(folder vs fixed) doesn't.

I'll start:
I believe that a 4" blade provides whatever we need for survival. The uses for and weight/size tradeoff for a large blade fixed OR folder... don't make me lean towards larger. What do you think?

I found that blades up to 4" are my preferred size. So far they were up to every cutting job. I even use them for dressing game. On a special occassion I had to butcher 5 wild boars (about 100 lbs each) that were killed in a collision with a car. The 4" blade was entirely up to the job. I only carry a larger blade when I know that I´ m going to need it.
I severely lean towards the fixed blade as many other posters here. The fixed fixed blades are simply more robust and can be kept clean much easier. For camping or survival keeping the knife clean can be a health issue. As carry my folders in a belt pouch lint isn´t really an issue. I carry the folders to work and in urban environment. My EDC fixed blade has a 2" blade and fits nicely in a front pocket of my vest (redundacy can´t hurt).

Ah ..... what won't we do to help a lady in distress ... ?....

As far as digging goes, sharpen a 2-3 foot long, 1 in diameter stick for use as a digging stick. Worked great for the Native Americans. I find that digging, or simply sticking my knife in the ground temporarly, dulls the edge very fast.

I agree with Frenchy (BTW my Dad's nickname)
For EDC I'll take my 4" framelock, or even smaller (my current EDC is the largest I've ever carried)

I think the original poster's question is more along the lines of "why the heck to people carry such BIG knives out in the woods"

I see a LOT of folks who walk around with a 9-12" blade knife. WHY? If your going to carry something that big, your probably a LOT better off with a smaller knife and a hatchet. In fact, that was my compromise for years - a 4" fixed blade on the belt, with a hatchet on the outside of the pack (and there was always a Boy Scout knife in my pocket - it was my EDC for years - pre leatherman)

A digging stick and a beater stick (for jungle travel) will work but I'm talking about a survival situation where you need to do it now and need it done quickly. With some practice using a knife for digging is not a problem. You need to be careful but on a 7" or 9" blade even if you chip the blade you will still have plenty of blade. A far as dulling the blade it can happen but if you’re careful you should be o.k.. Also, you do pack a sharpener right?

I realize that using the knife in this manner may be considered abuse by some and yes you could argue till your blue in the face that you should use a proper tool for the job. But we are talking survival here. In my mind that means you are in a dire situation with limited tools.

Adam:

I didn't want to say this earlier, but now I just have to.

Your posts sound like you are trying to convince yourself that you need a big knife.

I have a Swiss bayonet sitting on the desk next to my computer right now with a 9-1/4" heavy stainless steel, spear point blade that I like for its design and strength. I would never chose this bayonet over my Craftsman hunting knife in an outdoor excursion, even in a TEOTWAWKI situation, and my Craftsman would probably snap if I tried to dig dirt with it.

If you bought a large military looking engine block stabber, appreciate it for what it is, and accept the fact that the majority of us on this site see it as unnecessary.

Bountyhunter

A wise man once said:
"A quality, practical, fixed blade knife (also called a "sheath," "belt" or "hunting" knife) is ESSENTIAL for inclusion in your survival kit....This leads to my recommendation that a survival knife should have a blade at least four inches long, but no longer than six inches....A survival knife can stand to be a bit longer, but not too much longer."

Try to figure out who said it. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

If I were to drop out of the sky and land in the middle of the forest I would rather have my BK-7 with me than any other folder made. We are talking about survival, in my mind that means limited tools and options. A knife such as my BK-7 w/ its 7" blade can do most jobs, of course better tools will exist. But I'm making a compromise.

It's been a fun discussion and if I'm not with the majority that's fine it?s neither the first time nor will it be the last. <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Also I agree a bayonet would be a bad choice for survival proposes.....At least we can agree on something. <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

adam

To my knowledge that very same wise man has placed his name/trademark only on folders - the Sebenza and the RSK Mk1.

When he first announced the RSK Mk1, he made clear that he chose a folder because he felt it was more likely to be carried.

His bonus survival information that comes with the Pocket Survival Pak recommends inclusion of "A well-built, trustworthy folding (pocket) knife with a locking blade for safety at least 2.5 inches (64 mm) in length."

I agree with your basic point Adam, though I wince at the though of prying/digging with my knife. If given prior notice that I was going to get dropped out of the sky, certainly I would rather have my BK&T fixed blade with me - in my case a BK10. It is a great blade! I bought the BK10, rather than the BK7, based upon Doug's comments. I thought it would do the job and be a bit easier to pack into a day pack. The weight difference is negligable.

Unfortunately I'm unlikely to get that prior notice. My RSK Mk1 folder is with me all the time (or nearby when less than fully clothed - showering, swimming, and, well, you get the idea).

As mentioned by someone else before, I'm focusing on the EDC, while I think you're talking about being well equipped for camping/hiking. If I were heading into a back country area I would certainly stuff the BK10 into my bag.

Gee, bounty, kinda harsh ain't ya? Personally, the ONLY reason I don't carry a bigger blade on a regular basis is because of over-restrictive length laws. Small, fine blades have a definite place in my kit, but so does (at least one) big hack-n-slasher, from everything from splitting wood to digging a cat-hole to brush cutting... not to mention things that go bump in the night <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

Troy

P.S. I know, I know, a .45's much better for things that go bump in the night <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.

Wildcard163:

I didn't mean to sound harsh, but want him to realize that we all have our toys (I mean how many of you are sitting at your computer table with a large bayonet on the table to your left, a 1911A1 .45 auto to your right, a .25 auto in your robe, and a partridge in a pear tree on your head?) and I don't need anyone to agree with my choices to feel good about what I choose to buy or own.

He doesn't need our approval on his choice as long as he is happy with it.

His choices definitely have merit, but I respond from my lifestyle, experiences, and potential possibilities. In that respect, it is hard to relate and see things from a viewpoint that I don't see happening to me.

Bountyhunter

In most situations a sturdy folder or small fixed blade will be all you need but that depends on where you are and what you bring with you other than the knife.

Where I live in Brazil we have all sorts of stuff that large blades are far better for. You can't move well without a machete. The machete is also better for digging and shelter construction, clearing campsites etc. Machete's are lacking in their ability to pry and pierce, as well as all the small whittling jobs that small blades are good for. You really can't get away with one small blade here. I tend to pair my machete with a small, stiff, pointy fixed blade knife.

The large 7 inch knife, a BK-7 in my case, is a make-do compromise of the one-blade concept. They are every bit as good as a machete for taking apart palm trees and dealing with bamboo, openeing coconuts etc. They are a poor substitute for hacking your way through dense undergrowth. They clear campsites well enough and are great for shelter building tasks.

I would not want to be caught out here with only a small folder, no matter how well made. That's my take from South America. Mac

I agree with all your points. I also feel that it's easier to "convince" the average person to carry a locking folding knife than to carry a fixed blade knife. It seems in this day and age fixed blades have some kind of bad stigma attached to them.

Anyway discussion of guns and knives can stir the pot. <img src="/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I think the bottom-line is...as kind of hinted at earlier....its relatively easy to carry an folder for EDC and to have the fixed blade in a BOB (some people will freak out seeing someone with a fixed blade carried around every day).

Since most people have a BOB or other "kit" full of survival gear and equipment, why not have a fixed blade, shovel, and all the other items that you see listed in Doug's 2-person kit. This way you're using tools for their intended purpose and you actually have them all in one spot.

If you're in a situation where you can't reach your BOB or survival kit, you atleast have your folding knife. IMO, if a folder is all I had, I'd have to consider how I would use it trading off the need for digging, etc versus the possibility of breaking/dulling/losing it while using it for something not intended. It all depends on the situation. But my BOB is really close to me anyway (I have several placed in likely locations), and if I really needed a shovel, I could probably improvise it and other tools depending on where I'm at versus destroying my knife.

Just a thought.