Going to NYC with friends tomarrow. Being I don't know NYC's laws, what should I or shouldn't I take?

A detour. I'd advise avoiding it completely.

But if you gotta you gotta. I would say carry and dress as your normal EDC. Except for any large sharps. They tend yo get a bit sticky there about them.

If you atre interested in defence here are some imrovised weapon with the city in mind.

The thing to remember about improvised weapons is they are just that. Weapons are created from objects that come to hand. Remember if you construct a weapon example the length of hose filled with nuts and bolts or the old biker trick of a belt made of chain that is worn outside the belt loops and the police become involved it's still a weapon and you may go to jail.

If on the other hand use what comes to hand in self-defense it's not a weapon. The object is merely something you picked up. Now if you do want to carry a concealed improvised weapon construct something that appears normal but is effective.

Example a small leather draw string pouch filled with change. This is merely your way of carrying change the makes one heck of a blackjack. If equipped with longer strings as a flail.

Loose change or a change purse can be thrown as a distraction. The loose change will thrown at the face will cause anyone to duck aside and raise their hands to protect the eyes. Giving you a few seconds to gain a couple of extra steps to flee or an opening to attack. A change purse about the size of a fist is the same as a rock. Traveling at 30 or 40 miles an hour can definitely leave an impression.

Also a can of cayenne pepper with a loose lid. The active ingredient in cayenne pepper is the ingredient used in pepper spray. This is if pepper spray is illegal in your area. A face full of cayenne will drop almost anyone. Home made pepper spray. Cayenne in alcohol out of a squeeze bottle.

There is always the can of coke in a sock for the frequent flyer. Or if you are worried about the metal can a water bottle works just as well. What screener would disallow a common pack as a carry on with a change of cloths including fresh socks and a plastic bottle full of water? Combined makes a decent black jack.

A tightly rolled magazine is a stick. What is paper made out of, “wood” of course?

Canes or hiking staff are self-explanatory. You have a weak knee so need the support.

Take a cap. The old fashion flat driving hats work best. Place several ounces of lead sinkers in the back. Add a small bag of hooks and some fishing line. Hey it is emergency fishing tackle. Grabbed by the bill and slapped smartly across the face of an assailant. Said person will be very surprised when they wake up.

A roll of change held in the fist. It is just spare change. But it definitely increases the impact. A double A mini flashlight can serve the same function. When using these types of items the most effective strike is to hit like a hammer so the hand load hits. A straight punch can hurt the fingers.

Does anyone remember the old Bic commercial where they fired the pen out of a rifle through a pine board? Sure the plastic shattered but the point remained intact. You now have a stabbing weapon.

Then along the same lines are the rat tailed combs and brushes. They can poke quit a nasty hole. And does any of the older crowd remember the fro picks from the 60’s and 70’s. Back then there were places that outlawed them as a concealed weapon, especially the metal tined ones, because they were being used effectively as one.

A 12-inch steel drafting ruler makes a nasty slashing weapon. Two things don’t sharpen or wrap part of it as a handle. Both scream a prepared weapon. You are slashing not slicing. Add some graph or drawing paper to your clipboard along with drawing or drafting pencils as cover.

A clipboard can be used as a shield to deflect an attack. It can also be used to strike edge on.

The list could go on and on. The ideal concealed weapon is not a weapon at all. Just a common ordinary object that can be used as such. So forget the fancy ninja and oriental fighting weapons. Most of those were common everyday farm implements not weapons back then. With the exception of the cap fishing kit and the homemade pepper spray all are normal but effective tools.

These are objects that you could carry among many others. Then there are environmental objects to consider. These can be found anywhere from the country to the city. All it really takes is the proper mindset to realize their potential. It truly amazes me that airport screening is so concerned about such trivial things like nail clippers. The world is full of weapons you jut have to reach out and use them.

Most government buildings where the rules are the strictest are loaded. Most have those lightweight plastic and bent rod chairs. You could easily beat someone silly with them. Now days almost every place has drop ceilings. T shaped tracks made of metal supports these. While the main runners are long the cross supports usually 2 or 4 feet long. They are not real heavy so don’t hit like a baseball bat they will cause some damage because of speed. The ends are somewhat pointy and could be used as a stabbing weapon.

Rocks, bottles, chunks of bricks, whatever as impact or thrown weapons.

A piece of pipe or a stick is rather obvious.

A trash can lid is both a defensive device and a weapon. Back in the days of the knights of old the shield number one job was to deflect the opponents weapons but was also used effectively to bash flat into someone or smash with the edge. While the old metal can lids are the best especially when turned to offensive strikes the plastic ones will deflect a strike.

The next time you are sitting around cooling your heels waiting for an appointment take a couple of minutes and look around. What is lying about loose and how it could be used. What can you pry from the walls or ceiling that could be used to slash, poke or swat with. Or the same walking down the street. After a few times of doing this deliberately it is amazing how easily it becomes seeing the myriad of objects that surround you that can be used to portect yourself.

Remember anything you deliberately carried for self-defense as long as it has a legitimate purpose the police can ignore it as a weapon. But if it appears to be a contrived weapon you could be in a whole lot of trouble. Do not fancy up or improve the object to make it more lethal. Learn how to use it effectively as it comes out of the box. If it screams weapon you will be looked on as the aggressor not the victim. If you win you will be looked at hard enough as it is. In this current PC world they will give the poor unfortunate criminal the benefit of the doubt. You as the victim defending yourself is considered in a bad light to begin with throw in a weapon or anything prepared as a WEAPON. Well you get the picture. Learn to use the world around you.

Remember C. Y. A. just in case.

Keep your bladewear under 4" and with a single edge only. Pepper spray is legal as long as you aren't a former convicted felon or person convicted of any domestic violence statute...

M

One of your most effective weapons is your feet. Forget going for a guy's genitals or eyes, those are the first two things they protect.

Turn edgewise to an attacker & kick out sideways. Do your best to slam your heel into their kneecap. A leg that folds backwards really keeps your attacker from continuing. If he turns, a kick to the outside of his leg at the knee is just as effective.

Sue

As an ex-manhattan resident, and the Guy Who Knows New York and Can Tell You Where To Go...
0. Good walking shoes.
1. Bottle of water or two
2. A cheap digital camera + spare batteries
3. A flashlight & Whistle (you should always have that anyway)
4. A pocket knife - any under 4"
5. Pepper Spray
6. A red bandanna
7. A small radio

As far as crime - relax. NYC has more cops on the street than anywere in the USA. It's a full-bore police state, like Singapore. As a result,
NY is safer than Indianapolis Indiana, Phoenix Arizona and just about any other million + sized city. Of course, your civil liberties are limited to being able to put on offensive plays and publishing offensive magazines, but they seem to like that OK in NYC these days.

Don't forget to stop in at Arturo's for good italian food - Houston Street @ Thompson, right there on the corner. Also consider The Noho Star - on Bleeker Street - get the ginger ale, it's a treat.

Also, I'd suggest avoiding the over-priced and underwhelming South Street Seaport, instead, go to the rather entertaining and interesting Chinatown.

The tree is still up - 51st and 6th Ave and the store windows are still all done up. A walk on 57th street is always a trip.

Enjoy, it's a pretty great place, I loved living there when it made sense for me.

Im all for self defence, but always remember prevention over cure. NY is not as violent as it was in the 70's and 80's and a little common sence can go a long ways to ensuring the safety of self and family. Don't walk around at night, don't provoke people, don't go into areas with a bad reputation. anyway, thats just my 2 cents.

Can we appear TOO prepared for our own good?

We went to NYC about a year after 9/11 to see a play. I stashed some protective gear on my person, but a member of my family caught sight of it. I didn't stash it very well.

This person said I deserved to get hauled off to jail. I looked as though I was PLANNING for something bad to happen because I was TOO prepared.

To my mind, I was simply trying to be prepared. Fear won out, however, and I ended up going with almost nothing.

I have gotten much better at this sort of thing now, but has anyone ever been singled out for undesired attention because of being too prepared?

-- Craig

Well, I have had a few funny glances when people take a look at my key ring with flashlight, firestarter, SAK, Leatherman Squirt, whistle, vial of water purify tabs, etc...

It's funny though, because the worst thing anyone ever says is something like: "What are you, some kind of Boy Scout or something?" If that's the worst people say, I think I'm doing ok. (Of course, at 40something, I probably don't look like a scout anymore, but, I am a leader in our local troop.)

It has worked the other way though. Once people start to know that you are "equipped", they start to assume you'll have anything. At sporting events with kids, if someone needs an ice pack, FAK, whatever, they start looking for my car. It's not such a bad reputation to have. I wouldn't change my behavior due to social pressure. Those will be the same folks begging for your assistance when something does go wrong.

Agreed.

An office acquaintance once asked what I had under my shirt. My EDC lanyard was bulging through.

I showed them. When they said what the heck is that, I replied it was my boy scout rig and that I was just an overgrown kid who likes his toys.

A few humorous comments were made, but that was it.

When someone asks "What is that bulge under your shirt?" I always reply, "That is my asafetida bag." Then I ask if they have any fresh garlic as mine seams to have lost its potency. Then I walk away leaving them bewildered.

Susan:

Bad move as the need to lift the foot that high gives away your intentions. Aim for the ankle, even if you don,t break it, a scraping blow to the boney area is very painful.

For a woman, I recommend what I like to call "The Spider Monkey Attack". Rush the guy and throw your left arm over his right shoulder and dig your nails into his shirt and/or body and hold tight as you press your chest diagonally across his chest and bury your head into his left armpit area and lock your teeth on his shirt and/or his body. Your right hand is free to swing continuously into his groin, preferably with a sharp and/or cutting object. The position of your body makes it very hard for him to pummel you or push you away. After you have stabbed or sliced him up enough for him to notice that he is bleeding, let him push you away and as you disengage, look at his groin area and say, " Oh my God, I cut it off"! When he looks down, slash him across the top of the eyebrows and run like hell. The blood flowing into his eyes will keep him from chasing you and he will still be trying to assess the groin damage.

It is a great manuver for a smaller statured person to use against a larger individual.

Bountyhunter <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Bountyhunter, it SOUNDS good, but I think I need to see a demonstration....

Actually, the old knee-kick can really work, & when it works, it REALLY works -- you sure don't have to repeat yourself. Two women came out of the place in L.A. where they had learned it, and were jumped by 5 guys. One of the women panicked and ran off screaming and a couple of blocks later nearly got run over by a police car. The officer goes back to the scene to find 4 guys gone, one guy still there, screaming in agony, and one woman, still on her feet, yelling "It works! It works!"

Sue

Sue you must have gone to some of the same places I've been. I have taught that trick off and on for well over 30 years. It only takes 15 pounds of pressure to dislocate the knee. If you can't kick that hard you ptrobably can't walk. Thje best thing about it is the ankle kick and or shin scrape only works if the other person can feel the pain. But dislocate or worse the knee and even if the jerk is on drugs an can't feel it they can't chase after you very fast is the leg keeps folding up. No knee no support.

Are you folks talking SIDE kick or FRONT kick to the knee for MAX effectiveness or just ANY kick to the knee joint?

I've some self-defense practice . . . so I am interested in whatever personal experience/account/story/field info that anyone can point us to please.

Arde:

The way Raspy is describing it, it would have to be a side kick. The way Susan described it, I can't tell, but only a side kick from an inexperienced individual could do sufficient damage. Remember the figure skater that got a direct unexpected pipe to her knees and how little effect it had on her.

The reason I suggested "the spider monkey" manuver is that untrained, and even trained but not regularly practicing individuals will not be able to manuver and use such a kick against the average mugger because the mugger is usually watching for defensive moves.

Avoidance first, capitulation never, especially if they want you to go to a secondary crime scene by promising not to hurt you if you cooperate.

Bountyhunter

You'll be wanting to take your best credit card, because you can buy anything in NYC, including heaps of cool survival gear!
<img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Right answer!!!!!!!!! And if you are in Brooklyn and see Orange/Blue ambulance stop by and say hi, maybe I will be in it. Just say ETS very quickly and do ETS secret handshake or I be calling for back up <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The way I was taught to do the kick was to stand sideways to the oncoming attacker and kick out with the bottom of your heel in a pushing movement, kind of like stomping on a branch to break it. They said don't be wimpy about it -- jamb the sucker's kneecap right through his leg.

I suspect that a kick to the side of the knee takes less pressure, as I had a *dog* do it to me unintentionally. All he did was come at me at a run, then swing his hindquarters into the side of my knee as he took off again. The pain was awful and I couldn't walk even a step, and he didn't hit me as hard as I would try to kick an attacker. I stood there, thinking I would still be there in fall, when I saw a neighbor and yelled for her to go inside & get my Mom's walker.

With a good kick, I'll bet you'd be talking some extensive surgery.

As for telegraphing the move, many a guy has been kicked higher with considerable effectiveness, and I suspect that a guy would suspect that's what you were aiming for, rather than his knee.

OTOH, I haven't been in many brawls, so I will bow to this forum's other participants in that respect. <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Sue

Yes, definitely bring your credit card with the biggest limit, plus a healthy amount of cash. New York is expensive.

The general fear and loathing I see here regarding New York City is quite amusing. My family got off the boat in NYC back in the 1920's and never left. Although I myself now live in the Philadelphia area, I am a native-born New Yorker, and I did go to high school in Manhattan while living in Queens (College Point, to be exact, and Stuyvesant Class of 1986). No city on the face of the earth is probably safer than New York City. It's quite surprising, really, how New Yorkers will help each other and visitors out. Not to mention the huge NYPD and NYFD (my grandfather was a Battalion Chief).

And, of course, crime since the reign of Rudy has been pretty low. Just don't carry a firearm or a locking knife longer than 3 7/8" (4" is the limit). You will notice that most locking knives on the market are no longer than 3 7/8" for just this reason. The NYC Custom Knife Show posts big signs concerning the laws of NYC...

Oh, and buy some subway tokens. They're going out of style quickly, and the subway really is the best way to get around.

Especially in the post-9/11 NYC, New Yorkers really know how to pull together when needful. Yes, there are some bad areas, but you probably won't find your way to them--they're off the beaten track...well, except for Times Square--I wouldn't expose children to that pit of Disney iniquity!

Go see Ground Zero, if you haven't already. Go to the top of the Empire State Building (actually, you might want to avoid carrying a knife to the tourist spots). Go see Lady Liberty. Go to Central Park (but not alone, at night). Drink it in--it's the Center of the World.