Arguably the biggest challenge in preparing for a permanent bugout is deciding what you will leave behind. I'm perhaps the youngest member; at thirty-two, I have my share of memories in the form of tangible items. How do I choose which memories to leave behind?

Photos can be digitized, if they are not already, and placed in a USB drive. What if the USB drive is taken out by an EMP, damaged in some other way or I have limited computer access? I can't put all of my eggs in one basket.

Some memories are in the form of hand tools. That is an easy decision to make because tools serve a practical purpose.

In the end, it comes down to the individual. There are complexities in the decision-making process that can't be quickly put into words. How does one decide?

Sending things ahead of me is not possible at this time.

Jeanette Isabelle

I've posted this before, but not sure if you have ever acknowledged reading the post... it prompted me to purchase a small utility trailer,(1)to have the means to transport some items if necessary, and (2) offer an off ground platform on which to pitch a temporary shelter if I needed to rebuild my house

http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/blogs/klessons/p/map.html

I've read that before. I didn't think it was all that helpful. I'll reread it just in case I find something valuable the second time around.

You mentioned a utility trailer. I don't have the luxury of having that much with me. It may come down to what I can check in before boarding a plane.

Jeanette Isabelle

Many bug out situations might be long term, but few would have to be truly forever.
Therefore considering burying valuable or useful items with a view to possible later retrieval.

Even if you return years later and find that your home has been burnt, looted, or destroyed by nature, buried caches would probably survive.
A wide range of watertight containers are available.
Burial is better done in plenty of time, not during the panic of an emergency. Make certain that you can locate your cache, perhaps years later.
Large trees make good landmarks, even if destroyed by fire or cut down for wood, the stump should be recognised.

Contents could include
20 year shelf life dried food
Water filters.
20 year shelf life batteries.
Candles, matches, lighter fluid.
Ammunition, preferably in sealed tins.
Small tools, a hatchet, a saw and so on.
A few gold coins.
Photographs and other sentimental items.
Synthetic cord and rope.
A tarp, or two.

Like that page. Big fan of data backup.


Jeanette_Isabelle

I have a few technical issues with his backup solutions, but agree with ideas behind them.

IDEA- While his method may not work for you, I think the philosophy applies to most of us.


IDEA Data: back it up!
APPLICATION Data: When he did his writeup, the cloud did not exist. I have all my documents/photos on my PC, on a NAS, on a paid, ENCRYPTED Cloud service. I like USB, but it is not enough. If my house blew up, I still have 90% of our data. My resume is on cloud, in email; heck, I have a copy at work.

IDEA- PLAN Jeanette_Isabelle Your plan may not be HIS plan, but in this regard, while your plan and his are not the same, you both PLAN.
Application- PLAN you are already doing it.

IDEA STUFF- What can you not live without, or what do you need to rebuild?
APPLICATION- Stuff- This is tough. I have insurance, with riders for expensive stuff. I need the stuff that will get us out and keep us comfortable. I have a trunk of "Oh Crap" in the garage (reminds me, the clothes need updating- Darn kids keep growing) Basically a glorified suitcase, but bigger. In MY case, If I have the kids, the wife, Ideally the dogs, and a few days of stuff until the shock wears off, everything else is a push. Wife's Van will hold us, plus stuff, with range of 400 miles on full tank. That gets us to local relative, or Minneapolis for distant relatives.

I'm preparing for the Seven Seals and the Seven Trumpets mentioned in The Revelation of Yeshua Messiah. Once I leave home, I will never see it again.

Jeanette Isabelle

I'm rereading it. It's good to refresh because one of the things he drives home is getting a laptop. A laptop is something I'm considering; I can't afford to buy one at this time. I believe I will in two years.

I'm still left with a question that I don't think anyone here can answer. How do I choose which memories to leave behind?

Some things I want to bring with me are Stagebills of operas and other theater productions I have seen. I have the book The Shepherd of the Hills, autographed by the cast of The Shepherd of the Hills.

https://theshepherdofthehills.com/drama/

I have my eighteenth birthday gift, an original drawing by the cartoonist Bill Holbrook. I'm keeping the original; here's a digital copy:



I have a limited edition CD set by The Sounds of Christmas Orchestra and Chorus.

I'm going through comic books by Isabel Marks to decide if I should keep them or not.

http://namirdeiter.com/

My favorite is Best of Dealing With It, her autobiographical comic which is no longer online. When I ordered it, Isabel included buttons of my two favorite characters: Joy and Gabby.

I'm keeping my diploma and the tools that tell a story; I probably need to leave behind the dream catcher that my Native American friend, Raven Child, made for me.

Jeanette Isabelle

If all you need are the memories, buy an external hard-drive. Something like the WD - easystore® 4TB External USB 3.0. That’s just one, there are a lot of ‘em. Load up all your documents and digital media, pictures, videos — and just take the hard drive with you.

Jeanette Isabelle

All memories are fleeting, even my memory of earlier posts in this thread.

However, do what you can. It may fail to an EMP or some other casualty, but at least you will have tried. There are methods of protecting devices from an EMP, smaller devices are easier. As for limited space and doing a triage of sorts wrt what to take and what to leave behind, can’t help you with that.

Jeanette Isabelle[/quote]

Jeanette_Isabelle-
If you have unlimited room, paper is king. Unlimited room, waterproofer storage, done.

If not, there IS a EMP Proof digital solution. There are archival grade DVD and blu rays. The brand that I preferred in personal research is M-Disc. Still pros and cons....

Cons first- Many new machines do not have optical drives. This limits hardware. They ARE Digital- no electricity, no access

But...

Pros--
Optical Media are EMP Proof and waterproof.
M-Disc have been tested, and tests indicate storage life of over 50 years.
LG- branded DVD and Blueray players can both read and write the discs, almost any brand can read them.
If you are storing pictures, not documents, many DVD and Blu Ray players can view pictures, so for some media, you would not need a PC.

*** slight aside, used laptops are cheap. Craigslist has them for $50.00 You need someone who knows PCs

https://ocala.craigslist.org/sys/d/toshiba-p25-s507-laptop/6643808288.html Too Slow for me 50.00

https://ocala.craigslist.org/sys/d/dell-latitude-e6410-laptop/6645613848.html I have 2 of these, one from newegg 225.00, one from craigslist in Omaha 75.00. This one is 95.00

https://ocala.craigslist.org/sys/d/dell-latitude-d620-dual-core/6644174254.html Slow, but workable. 55.00

If you have faraday cage, put a spare laptop inside the cage. pull it out to charge once every quarter.

"Triage" is an excellent way to put it. I don't think there is anything to make this task easier other than use this forum as a sounding board. As I went through my fire-proof safe and a box (I have not unpacked even after four years), I was adding items I want to take with me: a birthday card from my eighteenth birthday, a letter from the cartoonist Bill Holbrook, journals and printouts of E-mail from fifteen years ago.

Adding stuff is the opposite direction I want to go. Nevertheless, these things remind me what life was like before the doctors, who were treating my disassociation, made life worse. I was a lot happier when I [actually my subconscious] was writing cryptic messages to myself.

Jeanette Isabelle

Categorize and prioritize your data. Things you must have like social security cards, birth certificate, etc to start a life over in a new location you need in that fireproof safe. Sentimental items you could live without. Scan/ take pictures of those and put in a box in the crawlspace/attic, that are nice to have in a planned move but lower priority in an unplanned evacuation.

Backups, make multiple. Keep the most important stuff, the stuff you use every day or required documents on your laptop and a copy on the desktop/server/external drive. Then make regular copies to flash/cd's/dvd's, etc. Always have more than one copy on more than one type of media.

WRT an affordable laptop look for a place that sells 'refurbished' business models. They will last for many years so you don't have to replace them as often. Most of the laptops in my house are 6-10 years old and cost me $200-$300 "new".

Then work down to things like tools and such.
If you want to keep sentimental items in a fireproof box then buy a second one. So you have a small portable for the .gov required papers and a second for other items. Make a list of each box/bag/etc and make a priority.

Something like:
1. Bug out bags
2. fireproof box with documents/backups
3. hotel overnight bag
4. self defense tools
5. additional clothing shelter
6. general tools
7. etc

you start at 1 and depending on the amount of time you have to pack and go work through the list.

Personal items tell a story and help us to remember the good things.

A fireproof safe is too heavy and bulky to bring with me. Items inside will have to be packed in a check in bag.

Jeanette Isabelle

My wife & I have been in our current house for 16 years. We were in our previous house for 10. This is the longest either of us have lived in any house. WE'VE GOT TOO MUCH JUNK.

A box here, and a box there, a box of my memories, her memories, a box of stuff that "has to stay in the family" from my parents, old homeschool projects, etc., etc. Add prepping with "this may come in handy some day...", "I need this in case ...." and the basement's got too much stuff (not hoarder levels).

I've also realized that a lot of those older memories that seemed so precious when I was a young adult, have lost some, or most, of their sentimentality as I'm now old enough to join AARP.

With many of the natural disasters happening around the country and world, I started wondering just what would I HAVE to keep with me, and what is sentimental baggage? I look at what my great-grandparents and their ancestors had, and there really wasn't that much. My grandparents, while far from wealthy, were the first generations to really have any means with which to accumulate stuff. There are reports of many people who lost houses to wildfires that were actually grateful because they didn't have to go thru sorting and disposing of "valuables".

Earlier this year, I heard someone talking about de-cluttering by asking yourself "Do I use it? Do I love it? Would I buy it again". I added a few notes, "Prepper / Packrat / Hoarder? Legitimate Heirloom?" and then printed it and posted it in my basement to force me to really look at WHY I was keeping things. Was I keeping it for legitimate prepping needs? Was I keeping it just because I don't want to get rid of it, "there must be a use for it"? or was I becoming a hoarder and just not wanting to dispose of it because ...? If something happened to me, would my wife & kids even give it a second thought before throwing it out?

American (western civilization) affluence has given us the luxury of sentimentality and the means to indulge.

Time for me to stop preaching (to myself), and get cleaning.

My doll collection and ermine plush toy would have to be left behind because they are too big.



One criterion I use is, does this tell a story? If archeologists from another time found everything I brought with me, could those items tell my complete story?

Something that would be more helpful is to understand this: Decisions can't be made overnight. Ever since I was a teenager, I saw footages on the evening news of refugees having to leave their homes and the only treasures they could keep were what they could carry. That would be impossible for those of us living in the United States. We can't carry everything we own on our person. For me, it took years of going through things, again and again, to decide what goes and what stays. The process only gets better over time.

Over this time I've gained more; that's because life happens. If I haven't acquired more, I'm not living. The newer items also need to be entered into the equation.

Jeanette Isabelle

Me too. Just finished cleaning out some gear that hasn't been used in thirty years, and I doubt I will be flirting with 20,000 feet in Alaska snow and ice - hence no need for the double boots,overboots, and crampons. Kept the ice ax, though. It will be handy for field work, excavating fossils. I am just not doing the trips of my youth, and I don't need the attendant gear. Time to donate or sell....

Evacuating on short notice last year in the face of a fast moving fire was a valuable lesson. You can carry everything you need on your person. I and mrs Hikermor did it, and no regrets. I found myself speculating about the house burning down and what pleasure it would be to rebuild and replace our lousy kitchen with something much better. After all, it is just stuff, and stuff can be replaced. Probably better that we aren't going through that process. But every cloud has its silver lining.

Don’t be in such a rush to get rid of your cold weather gear...
Earth's "Big Freeze" Looms As Sun Remains Devoid Of Sunspots For Most Of 2018

So there you are, a second Maunder Minimum is the perfect excuse to hold onto that arctic parka.

Don't worry. I still have a couple of really good parkas around. They are entirely too useful....

Is there anything that anyone owns that, currently, holds no value except sentimental value?

Jeanette Isabelle

I have a candle in colours of Estonias flag and a couple of small table flags = flag of Estonia and the flag of the estonian city of Tartu.
Because my girlfriend is estonian and she studied at the university of Tartu.

I have a couple of medals and certificates from shooting contests and a couple of QSL cards from HAM activities. I also have a ruber duck as signature item.

I was beginning to think I was the only person in this forum who still hangs on to sentimental items.

Jeanette Isabelle

I have half a house full of stuff that held value for my late wife that individually mean little to me but collectively constitute her prepping and hobby activities over the years.
Some of the stuff has aged out to being possibly unusable. (Y2K stored food for example)

Many items I just wonder why they are in the house.

And I don't know if, or what, I should do about them.

My shooting competition plaques, a weird clock that broke a few weeks after I got it (and I keep it to remind me that the person who gave it to me might be right twice a day), more shooting plaques, old and/or irrelevant IT-related certifications (the first one awarded when I was ten years old), at least a thousand books I won't read again, Girl Scout gear from when my better half led a troop years ago, the list goes on. We make periodic efforts to declutter with some occasional success.

Inheriting items that meant something to a deceased loved one complicates things further when deciding what and what not bring with you in a permanent bugout. I'm using a drawing table, which belonged to Dad, as a computer desk; clearly, I'm not bugging out with a drawing table.

I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts Mom will pack her grandmother's Bible.

Jeanette Isabelle

I don't know about others, but the most important substance I inherited from my parents was their DNA, and it a high priority to pass it on and safeguard it in future generations. Other material items are of far less concern.

Last year I walked away from a house full of cherished items (grandparent's furniture, fine china, etc.), not knowing whether any of that stuff would survive. But the DNA, and the ability to support the DNA I had passed on to my children, was in good shape. The rest was just stuff, which could be replaced, in kind, at least.

I did it once, and i would do it again, in a heartbeat.

For the record,one of the items I left behind was a grey fleece sweater I purchased more than thirty years ago. It protected and warmed me through some really hairy SAR operations, warmed me while scuba diving in frigid Lake Michigan, and was my garment of choice of my first post-divorce date - talk about versatile usage. Rather worn now, I cherish it highly, but it is really just an item of clothing.

Items, such as your sweater, tell a story. You can pass down your DNA and nothing else; you will end up with a generation not knowing anything about their past or where they are from.

Jeanette Isabelle

I went through my non-practical treasures again to determine what I will bring with me and will be left behind. Though I added one item to the list, the bulk of what I'm packing is smaller. In no particular order here is the current list of things I'm bringing with me:

Limited edition CD set by The Sounds of Christmas Orchestra and Chorus
High School Diploma
Four Dallas Opera Stagebills
The book The Shepherd of the Hills, autographed by the cast of The Shepherd of the Hills.
https://theshepherdofthehills.com/drama/
Two other programs from live performances
Journal
Twenty-four pages of printed E-mail and drawings
Eighteenth birthday gift, an original drawing by the cartoonist Bill Holbrook

Eighteenth birthday card
The original drawing of the July 8, 2004, Kevin and Kell comic strip

https://kevinandkell.com/2004/kk0708.html
Note: The digital form was edited
A letter from the cartoonist Bill Holbrook
USB drive

I think that's everything. This is the test I use to decide what I will bring with me: Does it tell a story? Would an archeologist from another time know my life's story based on the treasure he/she discovers? Though the Christmas CD, the Stagebills, book and remaining programs do not fit the "puzzle," I think, in light of everything else, the meaning is obvious: they reveal what these items mean to the owner.

Jeanette Isabelle

Jeanette,

If you evacuate and can't go back for some time, one of the primary things you are going to need is documentation. Go to the Listening to Katrina website for lots of good information about Documentation.


All of this will fit on a USB drive. This is part of my EDC. You can also encrypt it and store it on the cloud.

Beyond what I've stated, there is something about a tangible item that can't be quantified.

Jeanette Isabelle

It's a prayer book, not a Bible. Anyhow, I was surprised when she said she would not bring it with her (unless there is space available) when I brought up this subject. Her reasoning is history does not matter when you are in survival mode.

We would permanently leave our home and go to our bug out location; I would not go so far to say we would be in survival mode.

Hikermor said the most important thing is our DNA. I agree; our history has to be a close second.

Am I the only one who places great importance on preserving history? I know that when we permanently vacate, we can't bring an entire library with us. We have to prioritize. I can't do that for anyone except myself. I hope what I bring not only encompasses my history but some history of others as well.

Jeanette Isabelle

I hate to repeat a question; no one answered. I'll rephrase the question.

The original post was about comfort items. After going after what I have multiple times, I believe what I need to focus on has changed. This is more about history. A lot, not everything, can be placed on a USB drive. Either way, hard copies are needed because no one knows what will happen. Something can happen to hard copies. No matter how you look at it, a minimum of two types of copies is needed.

My question: We left our home. We will never see it again. We managed to save our DNA. How important is the recorded history I brought with me? Should I concern myself with what people from another time will learn about myself, family and friends? Should I concern myself with what they will learn about our time? Most of it is paper. Therefore it does not take up a lot of space; it does some.

Jeanette Isabelle

I can get a lot of stuff, fifteen years of my life (1994-2009), into a 1" binder.

I have a few other things that are small that I can include.

I most likely will not bring the CD set with me. It's too bulky and there is nothing about it to tell my story. After all, the point is to preserve my history.

Jeanette Isabelle

I've been working on this project almost every day and the contents from the 1" binder are now in two folders, saving space. Moreover, the stuff in them is more organized. I was even able to include a letter and a birthday card in one of the pockets.

To get all of the printed E-mail in one folder, I had to prioritize. If an E-mail did not have enough relevant information, it had to go.

The more I work on it, the more it's about preserving fifteen years of my life (1994 - 2009). As for why those fifteen years and no more, I'm not sure.

Jeanette Isabelle

For digital storage, do you have everything you need backed up on an SD or micro-SD card? Small, relatively rugged and you can tape one or two inside your 1” binder. All you need later is a compatible PC.

Correction. It's a story that begins with the March 19, 1994 entry of my friend's journal to an E-mail Aiesha sent to me on August 11, 2009.

I'm not sure why my story (told through a journal, E-mail, drawings and a letter) does not go beyond August 11, 2009; there it is. Perhaps there is a record, somewhere, that picks up where Aiesha's E-mail ends.

In any case, a person's history or story is worth preserving even if they are not coming home again.

Jeanette Isabelle

As I scanned all the e-mail threads I have in my inbox (there is a lot) I found an e-mail conversation from April 12, 2012, that helps to tie up a loose end. Nevertheless, I now have a nearly three-year gap from the previous e-mail, sent on August 11, 2009, to April 12, 2012.

I'm still looking for records, in any form, that tells my story.

I was able to more trimming by removing stuff that is more confusing than helpful.

Jeanette Isabelle

The following are the tools I have:

Ratchet
Ratchet Extension
Socket: 1/2"
Wrenches: 11/16, 9/16 and 1/2
Philips Screwdriver
Folding Box Cutter
Replacement Blades: 10

I used the ratchet extension once for a socket I borrowed. I see no point in bringing it with me.

I use the box cutter for opening boxes. Do I need to open packages when bugging out permanently?

Jeanette Isabelle

JI...at a minimum, especially if your plans are to cook over an open fire, some form of small slip joint pliers, or Vise Grip pliers (I tend to always need to move some pot of hot food), a Phillips/straight blade reversible screw driver and a form of cutting blade... a quality multi tool would serve you well

I don't see a reason to drop my screwdriver to get a multi-tool. Granted, when bugging out, go lightweight. I don't know what our odds are in bugging out.

I have two cutting blades: EMT shears and a box cutter.

Jeanette Isabelle

I assumed you were asking for suggestions... I'll refrain from offering any in the future... regards

That is uncalled for and rude.

Agree.

If I'm asking difficult questions, I need to rethink this. I suspected something's wrong when the questions I asked went unanswered. That is why I rephrased the same questions.

I need for you to be a straight shooter. If there is a problem with what I asked, say something! I'm out here trying to guess why I'm getting no responses and when I do, it does not seem relevant to what I'm asking.

Jeanette Isabelle

OK, you want a straight shooter answer. Speaking only for myself, I haven't responded because I don't find the topic particularly interesting. The questions you asked aren't difficult, they are just not very interesting to me. That being the case, since I have nothing worthwhile to add to the discussion, I felt the polite thing was to stay out of it.

I sent a private message asking Chaos Magnet why a post, expressing thanks to AKSAR, was deleted.

I also sent a private message to AKSAR thanking him for being a straight shooter, in case he did not see it.

I hope this clears up the confusion.

Jeanette Isabelle