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#280401 - 04/19/16 01:18 PM Re: Top 10 YouTube Survivalist Channels [Re: Bingley]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
You put it quite well. The usual solution to the imagined problem is a return to simpler times and something like pioneer self sufficiency - good luck with that. Of course, the thinking goes that good luck will occur, provided you have enough ammo to defend your stash. The imagined failure is often conceived of as a sudden catastrophic collapse of all order, with complete, everyone for themselves, dog eat dog existence. Probably not so much.

I am reminded of a famous line - "this is the way the world ends - not with a bang, but a whimper" ts eliot??
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#280405 - 04/19/16 03:57 PM Re: Top 10 YouTube Survivalist Channels [Re: quick_joey_small]
tomfaranda Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/14/08
Posts: 301
Loc: Croton on Hudson, NY
Yup. From "The Wasteland", TS Eliot.

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#280409 - 04/19/16 05:36 PM Re: Top 10 YouTube Survivalist Channels [Re: Bingley]
Mark_R Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 05/29/10
Posts: 863
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: Bingley
Sure, there are disasters happening around the world -- just look at Syria! Look at ISIS-controlled territories! But the world envisioned in most TEOTWAWKI planning resembles Walking Dead more than any sort of known historical situation.

I have attempted to start some discussions with survivalists about how they'd fare in actual historical situations. Some of the worst ones include war, completely corrupt and depraved governments, and natural and man-made disasters happening at the same time. In other words, you're caught between forces that you cannot possibly fight. Alas, they don't understand this. They're thinking in an innocent, American way: TEOTWAWKI means a return to the frontier days, with threats from small, dangerous roving bands of desperadoes. The military, if it survives in some form, is "probably on our side." So mainly you need to homestead, and have an ample supply of ammo. For them, TEOTWAWKI is a version of the wild west.

Maybe TEOTWAWKI is totally different from the disaster zones and war zones around the world, but to me, if you cannot survive ISIS, then you don't have a good shot at surviving something even worse.


I'm inclined to think that TEOTWAWKI would be the result of conflict. Either an invasion, or a state sponsored genocide/oppression. The poor schlmozzles in the Russian Gulag definitely had things as they knew it end. So did the piles of bones in Armenia, Assyria, Greece, Rwanda, Cambodia, Bosnia, and a legion of other locations.

Playing pioneer during TEOTWAWKI is a nice fantasy, but it is an unlikely one. If things get bad enough to be called TEOTWAWKI, it'll probably be state supported, and tolerated, if not encouraged, by the local population.
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#280420 - 04/20/16 05:13 AM Re: Top 10 YouTube Survivalist Channels [Re: quick_joey_small]
Phaedrus Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 3154
Loc: Big Sky Country
I'm hesitant to expand much just since this topic is 1) done to death and 2) not really what ETS is about. But briefly, yes- of course S has HTF in the past and will in the future. No place is completely immune to a breakdown of the social order. I think it's unlikely that a Western liberal democracy will descend into anarchy anytime soon but I'll concede it's not impossible. My main issue with the entire TEOTWAWKI thing is that it will almost certainly be nothing like the survivalists think it will be. The closest analogs to TEOTWAWKI in modern times would probably be the war in Bosnia in the 90's. None of the current survivalist strategies would have been of much us in that situation. I don't think you really can be prepared for the utter collapse of human civilization and a descent to Mad Max conditions. Personally I'm not sure I would want to survive it, either. I like the wilderness but I enjoy living within the context of being part of human society. Scratching out a few years living like an animal doesn't hold much appeal for me.

[/rant off] blush
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#280421 - 04/20/16 12:59 PM Re: Top 10 YouTube Survivalist Channels [Re: quick_joey_small]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
Good rant!
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