Mora's first full-tang knife. I'll be on the lookout for this.

http://morakniv.se/news/morakniv-launches-full-tang-knife


Brochure and specs:

https://issuu.com/morakniv/docs/morakniv_garberg_folder


$99-109

https://gearjunkie.com/morakniv-garberg-survival-bushcraft-knife


.

I'm trying to fit "Mora knife" and "$99-109" into my brain at the same time.
-Blast

I'll be in the market for one just as soon as my rat tail models wear out. I've had one since about 1975 or so - I was cutting with it today.

Ain´t gonna happen.
Mora = decent (not excellent) quality for a low price. If I would want a high price knife I go to some other maker known for top quality.

I watched Dave Canterbury's Wilderness Outfitter review on that channel. Ridiculous price.

At $100 it does open up a lot of other options.

Well people have paid that and more for similair products.



Well manufactures have known to be able to move from market segment or add a marker segment by having different lines for different quality/price points.

It takes some use to, that the budget brand now has more expensive offering. I have not seen this knife in real life, but if the quality is up to the $100+ quality point, than it could be a just another new option.

Mora knives are truly excellent values. When you consider more expensive knives, you don't have to go very far up the price scale to realize you are in "bling" country. Frankly I think it is hard to justify spending more than $100 on any knife, based solely on the utility of the instrument.

Many times I have seen items listed on a company site. They are listed a "MSRP". It stands for Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price. After a while you will see them at a much lower price on Amazon and such. Wait a few months and you will see them much cheaper....

BOATMAN
John

Tjin wrote:
< Well manufactures have known to be able to move from market segment or add a marker segment by having different lines for different quality/price points.

Good Point! Toyota will sell you a $15,000 Yaris and a $120,000 Lexus. Why can't a manufacturer produce different qualities of goods?

qjs

Interesting knife - it looks like the blade shape and dimensions are very similar to the Bushcraft Black. If so then it may fit my existing custom kydex sheath for the BB. The Garberg comes with a choice of plastic or leather sheaths.

I'm not familiar with the stainless steel - Sandvik 14C28N, anybody elese know anything about it?

I'm not sure why people are so bummed out about the price... perhaps because Moras have traditionally been very cheap and they can't get past the idea of a higher priced Mora? Take a look at the cost of any other "survival" or "bushcraft" knives out there and even $99 isn't unreasonable. It depends on the steel qualities, IMHO as for whether it is worth it or not. If they made it out of 1095, it probably would have been a fair bit cheaper. An Ontario Rat-5 sells for $75 on Amazon so one might consider the Garberg to be $10 too high - time will tell.

I know DC is high on the Bushcraft Black as a great 2nd knife but not as the main knife that you could bet your life on. I find it interesting that he has endorsed this new knife as 1-tool option. He has said in the past that his preferred knife be at least a 5" blade, non-coated, high carbon steel like 1095, full tang and either a Scandi or flat grind. Has he relaxed his preferences because of an endorsement deal?

See cliff stamp blade_materials

There is even a thread on this knife in the forum New Full Tang MORA "Garberg"

It looks interesting IMO. When you see how much knife you get for $20 you can't help but wonder how great it might be for five times that price. I love Mora knives!

Why do people think you need a knife costing hundred of dollars? The basic $15 moras do everything you need in bushcraft so what is the advantage of the pricier ones?

qjs

They look cool. After all, our ancestors used knives that were not some X95cr23 kind of wondersteel and still managed to gut the deer and slice the bacon. Before that flint and chert were king, actually with even sharper edges than you can achieve with steel - the down side was that the sharp edge degraded quite rapidly. If they would have possessed the internet back then, they would have debated flint sources in the same way we contrast various super steels.

If I had to restrict myself to one blade, it would probably be a Mora or similar.

you get less knife and more prybar

I have a small collection of knives in the sub-$200 range, including one Mora and a few others in the same price range. The ones I like and use the most tend to get sharper and stay sharper than the less expensive ones. They tend to have better ergonomics and better edge-holding than basic Moras.

I'm not anti-Mora at all -- they're good blades and many are phenomenal for the price. However, since I can afford a knife that is qualitatively better, that's what I use.

As has been discussed before, I am very tough on knives. To me they are tools, not decorations. As Chaosmagnet says, they must work, last, hold an edge, and not be too hard to sharpen. I have broken military issue K-Bars like they were nothing. If you are only using the knife to cut and skin, the Mora is great.

I do have to confess to owning a few hand made knives that did cost a lot, but they are used and they are all great, durable knives. Most of them were also made by friends of mine that I served with, so there is also a personal connection.

OK, Montanero, I have to ask - just what kind of task breaks a Kabar or similar tough, durable knife? I have mostly used mine for fairly knife-like tasks, like cutting and skinning. I imagine that in some of the situations you have seen, you have had opportunity to really stress blades.

War stories, please.....Inquiring minds want to know.

I recall a thread on Bladeforums long time back re a Cold Steel Recon (?) which failed at the stress riser (that 90 deg angle at the hilt between the blade and tang). The gent was batoning in cold weather IIRC -- probably bad technique.

The way I understand CS-Recon-Scout-Fails-Miserably
this blade failed because of poor quality control (heat treatment). ColdSteel sent a replacement.
Its a 5/16inch blade, thats 0.3125inch thick and the edge is 0.060" thick and 43 degrees included (22.5 dps)
That is very thick, it should be able to handle anything.



For some perspective see this comment

and this one

First off, I do not view the old issue K-Bar as a durable or tough. The narrow tang reduced the strength and the metal was not real good. I chipped them, broke them and bent them all of the time, until I found something better.

Some context is necessary. I was in the infantry (82nd Airborne, VERY light infantry) and in Special Forces, spending a great deal of time in the field, from the Arctic to the jungle, mountains and desert. You carried what you could, but what you carried was all that you had. Military missions go beyond the "survive until rescue" type of scenario. If the mission required something to be done, you had to do it with what you carried in on your back. With all of the necessary mission gear, there was little room for other tools, so you carried an entrenching tool and a knife. There were not as many options for knives then, nor were there many options for saws or hatchets/tomahawks. If you did not carry it in, you did not have it. It was normal in SF for the rucksacks to weigh in excess of 120 pounds. My back still hurts.

The tasks that destroyed K-Bars was prying, chopping and digging. Not what you WANT to do with a knife, but if you have nothing else to do it with, that is what you use. I have breached solid wood doors with one (or tried to), pried apart wooden pallets, pried windows and car doors, and dug holes in rocky soil. Again, not your normal survival tasks. However, I will throw it out there, that you never know what you will need to do to survive. Maybe break into a building for shelter. Maybe dig a hole for shelter. Try to build a raft maybe. If your knife breaks, you are not only unable to finish that task, but you have no tool for other, more survivally types of things.

I want a tool that can withstand anything I do to it, short of placing it in a vise and hitting it with a sledge hammer. But if it can withstand that too, all the better. What I ended up carrying for years was the Gerber BMF, and the Cold Steel Recon Tanto. Put them throigh hell, and they never had a problem. Now I have the great and durable field tools I needed when I was in the Army (what I would not give to have had them then).

With entrenching tools (E tools), I had the same type of problem. The new (to me) folding E tools did not last. If you were digging in anything other than sand or soft soil, they would break or the shovel would not stay in place. I carried an old one from the WW II or Korean War era, which did not fold up so small, but was much more durable. Now I like the Cold Steel Special Forces shovel. Digs like a champ, chops well, and I have not broken it, yet!

Sorry, no war stories.

But you can get a Boker Plus VoxKnives Rold D2 Camp Knife for $129...

http://www.knifecenter.com/item/BO02BO27...handles-02bo272

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oMvFTiu8Bs

The supplied sheath isn't very good but you can get a Wolf Winds Leatherworks replacement.

http://wolfwindleatherworks.com/products.aspx?id_idioma=1&id=41

Thank you very much for a very illuminating reply to my query. You have clearly experienced situations that put extreme stress on whatever equipment you can provide and you clearly make the case for legitimate needs for extremely tough blades that can suffer abuse and not break.

Interesting, my current needs are a bit closer to normal. I, too, dig in rocky soil, usually while backpacking or hiking, often at distance from a vehicle, but I am retrieving fossils, and the pace is somewhat more leisurely than what you experienced. I find that I need a fine digging tool (pointing trowel, sharpened) and more and more often, a rough tool, typically used to pry rocks out of the way. Balancing weight and utility, I more and more often pack a small (8" or so) pry bar. And I improvise and adapt a lot,using rocks for hammers etc.

Your comments about e-tools are interesting. I have a WWII style e-tool in my vehicle and I find it very useful at digging out the car from time to time. Love the easily adjustable blade. Also useful for the occasional fossil...

Yeah, aren't even ESEE 4's around $100. Though if was wanting a tough knife for wood processing...

https://www.varusteleka.com/en/product/terava-skrama-bush-knife-carbon-w-leather-sheath/30189

$102 with leather sheath.

Montanero and Hikermor, thumbs up and thanks for a very informative discussion. This has to be one of the better threads in a long while...

To add my 2 cents, I really don't think there's a one-size-fits-all solution when it comes "survival" knives (as much as I've come to dislike that term). What you need to define first is what exactly you're looking for in a knife and what trade-offs you are willing to accept. The dilemma being mainly cutting performance and overall practical utility vs robust design.

I've used Moras and more expensive Scandinavian blades all my life and never experienced one single gross failure. I've only seen one puukko break, and that was clearly a user's fault (hitting the spine of the blade with a rock when batoning through some very hard, knotty wood).

Now I'm sure I could break a Mora if I wanted to. I have made a good number of blades as an amateur knifemaker in my time, by forging or stock removal, doing my own heat treating and experimenting with different designs. But I don't see how a Mora or any comparable scandi blade could fail when used "properly" for the tasks it's been designed to.

Most of my outdoor activities requiring the use of a knife would be best described as "bushcraft". I use my knives primarily as cutting instruments for procesing wood, and to a lesser extent food. I take great care to preserve the edge as far as possible. It has to be sharp to do the kind of work I need to do regularly, so no digging, smashing cinder blocks and the like. I can use my knife to fashion a digging stick if I have to, that will work better than using my knife (and ruin the edge). If I have to smash something, I'll probably use a rock first - or maybe carve a heavy wooden club if I have to.

I guess that is the kind of logic behind bushcraft and for that purpose a relatively compact, razor sharp Mora or some more elaborate equivalent will do an excellent job. And in fact it will do much better than heavy duty "survival" knives simply because of the far superior edge geometry that comes with a thinner blade and a more acute primary grind.

That said, I can absolutely understand that in a particular situation (e.g. military, emergency response etc.) a knife might be used for very different tasks. Hence the need for a "sharpened prybar". I'm sure a CS Recon Tanto would fall neatly into that category. As would any other similar knife with a thick, heavy blade and full-tang design.

The trick is, a "sharpened prybar" type of knife is not going to perform nearly as well as a general purpose cutting tool. In my experience, that severely limits its value in a general outdoor setting. Many people these days seem to think that a good "survival" knife ought to be indestructible. Sure, if you're going to need it for prying doors and punching holes through brick walls. But IMHO something along the lines of a Mora or puukko is going to work much better for more mundane, everyday tasks normally done with a knife.

So when it comes to knives it's very much a matter of their intended function dictating the design. And there is always a compromise of some sort. BTW, the USMC Kabar has been mentioned in an earlier thread. Contrary to what many people believe, the Kabar is not really a "sharpened prybar" by modern standards. It's a traditional utility knife, and very well thought out (and executed) at that. The blade is actually fairly thin for its length and width. It has a relatively acute primary grind, can be sharpened to a very fine edge and keeps it well, which makes it a highly efficient cutting tool when sharpened correctly. It will outcut pretty much any heavy duty modern tactical bowie of comparable blade length due to its blade geometry.

Many modern "sharpened prybars" can take a lot more punishment than a Kabar. They have much thicker blades and full-width tangs heat-treated to a spring temper. The Kabar is a more traditional pattern. It has a relatively slimmer tang left soft deliberately. Functionally speaking, that helps establish a better balance (less steel in the grip) and better harmonic balance (a soft tang, e.g. not spring tempered, transmits less shock the hand when chopping, hence making it more comfortable in use). As an obvious trade-off though the Kabar cannot be expected to stand up to as much abuse as an overbuilt "sharpened prybar".

I have it, here´s my setup with a scandi puukko attached.

Thanks Montanero. Something I never understood and never got a clear reply to on this site.

Don't people recommend sharpening a stick and digging with that?

The Cold Steel knife that Doug recommends on the home page gear guide is the SRK. It's now available in different grades of quality.

qjs

It is better to use a stick, but it only loosens the dirt. When you have to do something, you use what you have.

Digging sticks are a common implement in prehistoric North American cultures -typically a tough, resilient wood rod, with an attached stone weight. It is typically pushed into the ground beside the desired plant (which usually has a buried succulent tuber underground)and then the tuber is levered up and out. On fairly shallow stuff, it works quite well.

Just so nobody misunderstands my intention, I do not recommend doing these things with your knife, just that I have done them before and had serious consequences. It is not something that I chose, nor would I choose it now if given another option. It is just my rationalization for why I prefer a knife that costs a bit more.

Montanero gives a perfect description of a situation where a "sharpened, indestructible pry bar" knife makes perfect sense, primarily because one can only carry so much. But as I follow this thread, I feel more and more that having an assortment of pry bars and levers conveniently at hand makes good sense.

You can get anything from a key ring type "widget" to a hefty iron rod six feet long at your local big box hardware store. They can be destroyed, if that is possible, with no regrets and they can easily be improvised. I find I am carrying my light pry bar more and more, although for a fairly specialized task, but I can see it being useful in many situations, including SD if it came to that.

A pry bar makes a good supplement to a generalized, reasonably good quality (Mora) knife for a lot of situations.

The more I read on sharpened pry-bars (I have a few) the more content I am with a quality locking folder and a Cold Steel shovel. Toss in a cheap Stanley pry-bar and there's no reason the break your tools.

True enough. When you think about it, a typical overbuilt "survival" knife these days costs at least $100. For that money you get a blade that doesn't cut very well and really isn't as strong or practical for prying as a proper prybar.

On the other hand, you could get a Mora and a compact prybar for $20-30. This combo would weigh no more than a heavy duty survival knife and provide you with two excellent tools, one for cutting/bushcrafting tasks and one for prying/heavy duty stuff. Heck, a Mora weighs less than an M9 magazine w/ 15 rds of 9mm.

Three new Mora knives -- all full-tang:

Eldris 2.2" blade .08 spine 2.8 oz (comes with neck knife kit)

Garberg 4.3" blade .13 spine 9.6 oz (new sheath/mounting)

Kansbol 4.3" blade .10 spine 4.7 oz (new sheath/mounting)


http://outdoornews.morakniv.se

Thanks Dagny. The stock and grind of the Kansbol is very interesting.

Its kind of ironic reading this for me since I bought my very first Mora knife specifically for digging out plants.

When in college - in the summer of '85 - I took a field botany class and needed something to help me cut stems at the ground and dig out plant roots. Not wanting to trash my Buck folder, so I went to the local Pamida store (do the still exist?) to look for a cheap knife. I found a cheap odd looking fixed blade knife with a black plastic handle and sheath. Perfect.

I beat the heck out of that knife and it never bent nor did the blade chip. After the class was over I sharpened it and was surprised by how sharp it got, so I've carried it in my truck ever since. It wasn't until many MANY years later when I learned about Mora knives through equipped.org that I realized that my truck knife was a Mora knife.

I got my first Mora roughly the same way - I was looking for a beater to use in my wood shop. It is now my go to knife in the kitchen - my sweetie doesn't like sharp knives, so I keep the sharpened Mora off in a quiet corner. It's still cutting like a champ after thirty years....

Dagny wrote:
> Three new Mora knives -- all full-tang:

But the only one I can see them saying is full tang is the
Garberg.

Am I missing some part of the web page? (http://outdoornews.morakniv.se)

qjs

Has anyone tried the countycomm.com EOD Breacher Bar?

It looks like a prybar someone ground an edge on. also about 20.00

Montanero-I have never broken the blade on the Cold Steel Special Forces Shovel, but I have broken a handle. -- It was stupid 25 year old playing- using it as a throwing axe at camp- it hit wrong and snapped. Brought a new handle to 8.00, good as new.

I also have a bit of an issue with rust-- I keep one in the back seat (floor) of my car. I have it in the sheath/case. It gets damp back there from the kids boots, and the edge (the not painted part) gets red all the time.
I have a second one that I keep in my wife's car. The kids use it at the beach enough that most of the paint came off. even though thoroughly cleaned, I had issues with surface rust with it sitting under the seat in her van. I sanded, then repainted with Rustoleum to prevent more.

I h

No problems with the shovel, but never used it as a throwing weapon either. Yes you do get some rust, but it is easily removed.

I do have a Breacher Bar, but have not really given it a workout. Size is good, light enough and the edge can get into smaller cracks. Just have not had the opportunity to test it out.

I have one and like it. I used my bench grinder to put a fairly sharp edge on it and I've used it for things that were too abusive to consider a knife. The worst thing I did with it was turning it into a chisel with a chunk of concrete as a hammer, to bust off a large bolt that was preventing us from repairing some target stands. This led to a big chip in the tip, which was fixed with about ten additional seconds on the bench grinder.

The only person I know who carries one as on-body EDC is a police officer in a really gritty part of a big city. He uses it (unsharpened) primarily in vehicle searches to pry open concealed compartments.



I haven't looked at mine for at least a year -- thank you for the reminder. My trunk stays pretty dry for the most part and I did treat it with a Tuff Cloth before tossing it in there. I'm pleased to say that I couldn't find a single spot on mine.

Moraknif Garberg is now available:

https://www.ragweedforge.com/SwedishKnifeCatalog.html

qjs

I will soon (five weeks or so) be putting some sharpened prybars - various Stanley models and the County Comm Breacher Bar- as well as a knife or too - specifically the CRKT Stiff Kiss w/tanto tip - in excavation of a fairly large fossil in rocky soil where a fair amount of prying will be done. Expect a report.

Thanks, Joey -- I just place my order!



.

And photos, I hope -- good luck with the big dig!



.

Dagny wrote: I just place my order!


Don't forget to give us a review!
qjs

Received the Morakniv Garberg last week -- another happy transaction with Ragnar of Ragweed Forge. I got the $85 version ("multi-mount sheath"). The leather sheath is $10 more.

http://www.ragweedforge.com/SwedishKnifeCatalog.html

The Garberg is a nice knife -- certainly feels more substantial to have a full-tang. It's got the sharp spine to use with fire steels. Is it worth $85 -- I suppose. It's pictured below with, among others, the Morakniv "Bushcraft Survival Orange" which includes a nice fire steel and I think that knife is a great value. Depends on if a full tang is that important.

The Bark River Bravo 1 (also pictured below) costs twice as much but is also heavier and probably far more knife than I'll ever need. Doug Ritter's MK3 is also pictured below and it also costs twice as much as the Garberg and I still think that is a good value because it strikes the sweetest spot for me in terms of weight, feel and functionality.

One thing is for sure, I'm unlikely ever to be without a knife! :-)

Some comparitive specs of the knives in the photos:

Morakniv Garberg - blade = 4.3" .125" thick
Morakniv Bushcraft Survival Orange - blade = 4.3" .126" thick
Bark River Bravo 1 - blade = 4.25" .217" thick
Doug Ritter MK3 - blade = 4.5" .14" thick

Couple more photos. The top is the Ritter MK3 and the Garberg. The bottom is the Bark River Bravo 1 and the Garberg.

Good pics. Thanks!