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#257531 - 03/12/13 05:06 PM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: TeacherRO]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
Originally Posted By: TeacherRO
I agree - at a minimum each hiker should have
a pack
a water bottle
a jacket

And the leaders should have
faK
lights
map/compass



I was thinking that either the leaders should carry enough large "trash" bags so there would be one for each person, or distribute one to each person. The bags could be used, with head and arm holes cut, as a poncho, or with just a hole cut for the head as a hasty shelter. Or it could be used for the trash.

We then need to also add a knife or scissors to the list.
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#257552 - 03/13/13 07:54 AM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: ILBob]
Phaedrus Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 3162
Loc: Big Sky Country
Originally Posted By: ILBob
Originally Posted By: hikermor
Somewhere in there should be the means to build a fire.


that assumes they could figure out how to gather firewood.

things that are second nature to some of us, even if rarely practiced are not obvious to many. I can't tell you how many times when I was car camping I would see people give up trying to start a fire and use an accelerant. I have even done it when I am in a hurry.

Personally, I am in favor of carrying something that can make emergency fires a lot easier. When one is cold and wet and in trouble is not a good time to be practicing one's bush craft skills.




I'm baffled by the people I see that get a fire going with a whole bottle lighter fluid! They seem to think it's magic, that it obviates the need for any fire prep at all. But the fluid flashes over and burns out leaving them with a mess and a dumb look on their faces! grin
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#257556 - 03/13/13 11:36 AM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: ILBob]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
Fire making is probably a prime example of the need for skills as well as the shiny gadgets. The paradox of fire is that it is dreadfully easy to make when you need it least (hot and dry) and yet fearfully demanding when you need it most(cold and wet). I have had to make fire when it was really urgent and I decided long ago that a small backpack stove was the most dependable source of flame and heat. Not that heavy - 3 oz to one pound - and absolutely vital in severe conditions.
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#257559 - 03/13/13 12:45 PM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: hikermor]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3601
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: hikermor
Fire making is probably a prime example of the need for skills as well as the shiny gadgets. The paradox of fire is that it is dreadfully easy to make when you need it least (hot and dry) and yet fearfully demanding when you need it most(cold and wet). I have had to make fire when it was really urgent and I decided long ago that a small backpack stove was the most dependable source of flame and heat. Not that heavy - 3 oz to one pound - and absolutely vital in severe conditions.



Quoting for truth! Firecraft can be so so easy but isn't usually that way when you absolutely need it. Practicing in adverse conditions and with a variety of materials is something that I place high on my personal practice and 'pass it on' list.
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#257576 - 03/13/13 08:18 PM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: bws48]
Pete Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/20/09
Posts: 1372
they went with 40.
they came back with 40.
they survived - and so they learned.
there is no greater teacher than Mother Nature.

I have 2 daughters. One is a teenager.
If i had a dollar for every time i have told those girls to take a warm coat when they go out on a cold day, or go out at night, I'd be a rich man. do they ever listen? No. :-)
but a near-freezing experience will bring the lesson home.

maybe we should take all college students out in groups of 40.
and put them thru the same thing as the group in the story.
it's not a bad idea!

Pete2

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#257584 - 03/14/13 12:10 AM Re: 40 Hikers lost on Kentucky Mountain are Rescued [Re: Pete]
Eastree Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 06/15/11
Posts: 62
Originally Posted By: Pete
they went with 40.
they came back with 40.
they survived - and so they learned.
there is no greater teacher than Mother Nature.


I think ... we can but *hope* they learned. In a group that size, at least a few of them must have started thinking about what went wrong and how. But doubtless there are some who stop with, "At least the phone still had signal!" Or worse, "The woods are harrrd! It's a miracle anyone EVER survives!"

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