As of late it seems like some of my pocket-sized tools have developed the unnatural ability to grow legs & walk away so, unless something turns up, I'll likely be looking at getting a new multi-tool for the outdoors. This would be something I would carry in my pack when hiking & backpacking; my fixed blade would be on my person. This tool would primarily be a back-up tool but would also provide some functionality nothing else I'd be carrying does (like screwdriver bits).

Traditionally the tools I've deemed most important for the role this tool would fill are; blade, wood saw, flat & Phillips screwdriver. However, I've been wondering about how pliers could, or should, fit into the equation.

My initial thinking is that the pliers don't provide too much benefit (in fact, searching ETS about this topic I found a few threads with me saying so), but am wondering if I'm overlooking something. That said, it seems that if I bypass the Leathermans of the world and look more at SAKs that I could either get a smaller, lighter tool with all other things being similar (like the Hiker) OR I could get a bigger blade & larger, more effective saw in a package of similar bulk, but still somewhat lighter (like the OHT or maybe even the Outrider).

I'm also hesitent to spend too much on this replacement tool so, for a pliers based tool, I'd likely be considering something like the Sidekick (which falls into the same price range as the SAKs linked above).

So, given I'd be looking at an increase in bulk and/or weight over a SAK (depending on the route taken), what benefits do you see that would make the pliers a worthwhile addition?

As an aside, I do have a Skeletool CX and carry it everyday (and love it) but I usually do not bring it into the woods; it's primarily an urban tool in my eyes.

That's really good know, thanks for the heads up.


More great information, thanks.

I have had good success with Wengers; I had (or maybe have if I can figure out what my son did with it) an older version of the current Wenger 78 that definitely fits my original bill. Back then the main blade was a clip point and not a one-hand opener and had the slide lock mechanism instead of their new logo button.

It seems to be easier to find the Victorinox models locally though.

Actually, I do have a question about the difference between these companies' lock blades though. From what I've seen, it looks like the Wenger lock blades are a bit bigger, a bit heavier and a bit more expensive than the Victorinox models. Have you compared the 2 side by side & is there a functional difference between the 2 (assuming we're talking about comparable feature sets - like the 78 vs. the OHT for example)?

Thanks.

Most of my serious mountain backpacking has been done without pliers. I either carried a light folder or a SAK with scissors and saw.

Pliers are primarily helpful in fixing the modern gear we take into the wilderness. The gripping power helps when fixing stoves, sewing failed zippers, repairing ski/snowshoe bindings, and fixing D-rings/hooks on boots for example. This is especially true when travelling with a group of young people who are using old/donated gear.

Other useful camp tasks for pliers: handling hot pots (esp. on fires), pulling stubborn tent pegs, and loosening knots. But there are ways to accomplish all these tasks without pliers too.

I can certainly see the value of pliers and a good wire cutter if you're hiking with a dog. Some areas have abandoned fence wire (or snares left by unthinking boneheads). I have also removed porcupine quills that weren't in deep (highly unpleasant for all concerned). And pliers are great for breaking up ice balls that build up between the toes in certain snow conditions.

With all that said, if I were to get back into long-distance backpacking, where every ounce counts, I would probably go back to the lightweight folder and SAK. Odds are I could add a tiny pair of hobby needlenose pliers and still carry less weight than a Wave-II.

I've wondered about that. When the cost comes down, something has to give; and yet they might be useful on a worksite where things get stolen and lost easily. Can you suggest a source for the gory details?

OTOH, I've been carrying a Rebar for light urban use. I quite like its discreet compactness and weight, though I don't expect the tools are quite as robust. If you know of gory details on this model, I'd like to hear about them.

Wilderness, or out camping with items that can break?

Pure wilderness camping, pliers not useful much.

But...

Used my pliers all the time when Uncle sent me to the field. Cutting wire, stripping wire, tightening items that had come loose, crimping det cord into a cap, pulling staples from boxes, splinter removal, and a bunch of other minor chores. I fixed a broken battery cable with a basic first generation Leatherman.

Better to have them and not need them ...

I'm specifically thinking about a tool for when I'm actually out hiking or backpacking.

If I'm car camping, or just out in a more remote setting with my vehicle, I'd have access to some basic full-sized tools in my vehicle so what I carry wouldn't be the be all & end all.


Yes and no. I have a limited amount of room & weight carrying capacity when I'm out & about so I want to choose my tools wisely.

I have used pliers with a needle and thin repair wire to sew boot soles, loosed
by fire, back on.

Vise grips are good for aid climbing to help remove small driven-in protection.

If you have pliers along, like Doug says, they can be used every day as pot
grips.

Maybe some use like a hemostat. Maybe a hemostat could find some use as
pliers?

Fisher people make use of pliers a lot.

Pulling teeth?

Skinning a pig?

I have had many occasions to use pliers while in the woods, many times for working on my gear, but also for dealing with metal items encountered, such as barbed wire. I have not tried the Victronox, but I have never had any issues with my Leatherman or gerber ones. They are useful out there.

i haven't found many uses for a large multi-tool plier (ie: Leatherman Supertool 300) in the wilderness.

but have often used the tiny pliers on my SAK SwissChamp or Leatherman Squirt tools for pulling quills from the dogs, or grabbing a needle, or pulling a leather lanyard thru a hole, or holding something hot...

these days i carry a SAK and a locking blade folder into the woods.

What he said.

I use my LM Wave pilars in the wilds mostly for handling pots on the fire, pulling tent pegs, fixing gear and cutting old wire we come across in the bush. I use most of the other tools regularly as well so I continue to carry it.

That said, i probably use the SAK I carry just as much. They're a great duo.

I cannot even count how many times I've used the pliers on a Leatherman tool in the boonies. Here are a few:

• fixing a stuck zipper (several occasions)
• fixing a bicycle that was inoperable
• undoing knots with cold fingers that weren't working right
• fixing a stove
• cutting wire that someone was stuck on (it's never been a dog for me, always a person)
• fishing a drawstring back through a hood so it could be cinched again
• removing fishhooks from people (probably over a dozen times)
• removing fishhooks from fish (significantly less frequently)
• most memorably, getting a seat back on its track in a light airplane after a very rough landing 100 miles from the backside of nowhere -- since the airplane was full, someone would likely have had to sit around for a few hours until it could come back if we hadn't been able to fix it
• EDITED TO ADD: I don't know how I could cook anything in the woods without my Leatherman pot holder

I recognize that some of these are unusual and many of them may not apply to your situation.

With regard to the Sidekick, it's certainly not up to the quality of the Wave, but in my hands its proven to be competent and usable. I bought mine, frankly, on a lark, and it's not one that I would carry or recommend for the wilderness, but my experience with it has been that it provides decent value for its price. I did not hesitate to buy one for my daughter as her first multitool.

Fishing and undoing knots. Of course! Go pliars! LOL!

As others have mentioned, pliers have many uses in the wilderness no matter if you are car camping or hiking way off the beaten path not to be carrying them.

As to the weight concerns, really? I am no weight weenie by any means, but these types of statements make me wonder. How much extra does a pliers equipped multi-tool weigh as compared to a similar equipped SAK or other similar too? I would venture to say a few to 5 ounces at best. And if someone is really that concerned about carrying those few ounces then perhaps it would be better to lose a lb or so of body weight before one goes out hiking...

Wenger's button lock is most definitely not the same as Vic's side lock. It is a real liner lock that you can actuate with the logo/button, look inside with a flashlight and you'll see it very clearly.

I have found pliers quite useful when out and about in wilderness, or near wilderness settings. In fact, the atraction of my first Leatherman was the included pliers, which saved me weight by allowing me to delete the medium pliers I had been carrying regularly. For me, they were absolutely necessary for unjamming locking carabiners (mostly SAR applications) and they were also useful in many of the applications others have listed in this thread. That marked the end of my "SAK era" and the beginning of the "L-tool era." I usually carry a Wave, although it is a little heavier than I really like. Depending upon the trip, I might lighten up by toting my PS4, especially if no climbing will be involved. SAKs are good, and they served me well for many years, but multitools, with pliers, are even better - useful in terrestrial wilderness, and even more critical when on the water, where they can be vital.

I agree the weight differences aren't backbreaking by any stretch and I don't mind the extra weight IF I find the feature is really worthwhile. However, if I go back to my thinking that I started the post with, if the pliers are really not needed then why not save the ounces (and the dollars) and go with a tool without them.

It's the cost/benefit ratio I'm questioning; I can't just fill my pack with a bunch of stuff that might come in handy, I need to be a bit more selective than that.


I am a bit over 30 pounds less than what I weighed in at in the beginning of 2012 so I am working on that front too .

Hee hee. My head may agree, but my knees doth protest.

I never go anywhere without a multi-tool. I have been carrying one so long that I would really feel weird without one. And the most used component is the pliers. Especially here in the desert. Removing cactus from people, clothes, dogs etc happens about 5 times a day.

I am a tool using animal and pliers rank right up there, and perhaps a little above a knife. I can make a knife, pliers are a bit more difficult.

Nomad.

Things left behind by people and things yourself bring in can be altered too useful Items with pliers. Les Stroud uses His Multitools pliers multiple times to turn items left behind by others and items he carrys in himself all the time. One instance of using them to make somthing that can alter your ability to survive in the positive is More then enough to convince me to take um along. This goes without saying other tools such as the philips head screwdriver can come in use as well. You may just need to take a few screws out from something man made you have come across to increase the chance to survive.

If you are so tight in space , well, you are right being picky. But as for myself I won't go anywhere without a plier-based multitool. From tightening/loosening wire ( can be painful or can injure sometimes if done by hand) to lifting a hot pot from fire. Plier uses are endless ( in my case at least).

Actually, I have noticed the pliers get used in the outdoors ( or the garden) more than the screwdrivers. They come second after the knife blade.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the leatherman juice s2 for carrying in the woods. Only weighs 4 ounces, has pliers, excellent scissor, an assortmant of drivers, a dual purpose opener and a serviceable knife. It's far and away the most popular juice model. What's not to like?

http://www.leatherman.com/product/Juice_S2

And to be honest, the even lighter (2 oz.)squirt models with pliers would cover most of the plier jobs mentioned here.

http://www.leatherman.com/product/Squirt_PS4

Depends on how I'm traveling and what uses I might have for a multitool. We don't have cactus spines up in these parts, and tweezers are more appropriate for the smaller spines and thorns we do have. Also, one is not likely to find much wire laying around in the areas I travel. On the other hand, a leatherman can be handy for field repair of a stove, a ski binding, or a kayak rudder system.

While Im not really a minimalist, I do like to keep things simple, and I don't like carrying stuff I don't use. Bottom line is that I rarely if ever carry a multi when day hiking. When backpacking I sometimes carry a small Leatherman Juice C2. When sea kayaking, where weight is not such an issue, I always carry a small repair kit with a Leatherman Kick.

On the other hand, I often carry the Kick when doing chores around the house. I also do some boating (in addition to sea kayaking), and usually carry the Kick then too. It just seems like in those situations I find more times to use a multi than when I'm out in the woods.

I notice Leatherman has discontinued the Kick. Too bad, in my opinion. It is nice and simple, and has the tools I actually use, and none of the ones that I would rarely if ever use. For example, I don't see much point in a scissors on a multitool, since I can usually manage those jobs with a sharp knife.

I guess I am just a Keep It Simple kind of guy.

I'm no gram counter but I get it, Dennis. A few ounces here and there add up.

I'd suggest that perhaps pilars are one of those things that if you've haven't used them yet, you can probably do without. I wouldn't say the same about a FAK, for example. There are some things worth carrying just in case but you've been out there enough to know whether pilars will come in handy for you. I'll bet there have been times when I would have grabbed my pilars but you reached for somethkkng else and it turned out just fine.

I took a sidekick to Afghanistan. It worked fine for light duty. I didn't trust the Gerber multitool that was issued, as they seemed to break often.

as tomfaranda commented the Juice S2 is pretty small... I carry it... a Streamlight TacPro 1L... and firesteel,tweezers, petroleum/cotton, hacksaw/needle/safety pins in a reasonably small generic multi tool pouch... it's my "metric wrench" for the bicycle...

the pouch is about the size of the flip phone case

I had a Juice S2 once upon a time and it is a good tool, but a more urban-centric one in my mind (no saw). I ultimately replaced it with a Skeletool CX for urban EDC which fit my needs a bit better (larger locking blade, dropped the tools I didn't need, had a pocket clip). For the outdoors, I think the Juice Cs4 would be better since it has the saw. That said, they are small & the blade doesn't lock; in this way the Juice models are a good comparison to the traditional 91 mm SAKs. And, while I mentioned at the outset I was considering the smaller SAKs, I keep being drawn back to the larger lock blade & especially the larger saw the big SAKs have (I really like these saws ).


That's an interesting observation. One of Leatherman's key-chain sized plier tools combined with a Victorinox 111 mm lock-blade might be the best of both worlds. You'd have the large locking blade & saw I find so attractive in the Victorinox's and still have some form of pliers to fall back on if needed.

Actually, that's pretty much how I've set myself up right now - I keep a tiny, no-name tool in my repair kit:



The idea of including it my repair kit is that it could be used to help with minor gear repairs. However, I'd likely ditch it and rework the repair kit if I decided to go with a Leatherman as my backup, otherwise it would likely stay as-is.

That said, going this route is really relegating the pliers to only being a just-in-case tool that is a part of a kit; like shears or scissors in a first aid kit. What I was originally looking for, and got a lot of great feedback on, was on what other uses people here had found for their Leathermans in their travels to see if I should be considering an expanded role for this type of tool.

too many posts to read them all but i take a small set of pliers because i might have to fix my canoe and something to hold the nut while the SAK screw driver is working is better than using your fingers.part of my repair kit has nuts,bolts,screws,epoxy putty and other canoe repair items.
i have just cheap,small rubber handled ones because the Leathermans have that open metal that cuts into you hand when you bear down on them.

I tried taking a bit more of a detailed look at the other full-sized Leathermans and it looks like the additional tools (knife blade, saw, etc) are really on-par size wise with the standard 91 mm SAK tools. Therefore another option, if I was okay with the size of those tools and wanted the larger pliers, would be to simply pair my existing Skeletool with something like the Victorinox Hiker and bring both along.

+1 on what Canoedogs said.I have had to borrow some one elses multitool to do just this very thing.If one is alone,they are out of luck.It's like them cheap hobo knives with spoon,fork and knife that do not come apart.How can you cut your steak and hold it with the fork simultainiously.I think a small pair of regular slipjoint pliers and a SAK works good.Vice Grips in a six inch size is an other option.An easy mod to them is chainging the adjustment screw with an eye bolt.It lends itself to many more uses(pothanger,game processing,etc.)and can be carried on a carabiner.Dave Canterbury has some interesting ideas on multitools and vice grips on his youtube channel.....

BOATMAN
John

I'm kind of surprised by how many don't see a use for them.

Now, in a "pure wilderness" outting, sure there might not be a need. But... how much pure wilderness is there? Or perhaps another question, why did we invent pliers?

I've never needed to pull quills with them as I don't have a dog, but I know several dog owners who have. I have pulled thorns with them in the past year. And cut barbed wire. And grabbed hot stuff. I've used them for grabbing small things when my hands were cold and wet and either too slippery or too dingy to handle things like a needle or wire- glomming onto pliers is big muscle work without a lot of precision. I've used them to pull needles through heavy fabric and leather. I've not recently used them to cut off a fish hook after pushing it through, but I also don't fish that often, nor do I pluck birds, but I've found them quite helpful.

Add in the fine work wood saw, a file, and screw drivers that fit things like snow shoe and ski bindings, laterns, pot handles, pack frames, knives, firearms, traps, boat and small vehicle motors, bicycles... The multi is the tool of the possible.

Yeah, I carry a multi on and off the blacktop. And a Swiss Army Knife, for the scissors and because I think they have better can and bottle openers, and they make better spare knives- I think a multi without a SAK is a lonely tool and vice versa. Carry them both and a light and a few feet of duct tape and a little wire and a needle or two and a spool of dental floss and a few feet of paracord and maybe a couple paperclips, then you can giggle at most problems.

What I would say is avoid the Sidekick/Wingman. I have no idea what is going on at Leatherman, but those and the new snowboarding tools make me think someone isn't quite there. From the current production, I'd say the Rebar is your best balance in size, weight, cost and performance, and partnered with a Compact or a Climber, it's a good combo. So was the original model SuperTool with a Climber or Compact. My first PST rode with a Huntsman for years, and they still live in my truck. My OHT is partnered with another PST. With a Hiker or Outrider, your Pockettool should be a great duo. About my only SAK I don't partner with a multi is a Ranger- that just goes out with a pair of pliers.

In true wilderness untouched by man or by man made gear and equipment, pliers have few uses. Mainly removing quils, thorns and splinters, and perhaps cracking nuts.

Most of us venturing into the wildnernes will however have a fair bit of modern gear and equipment, and pliers are useful for all sorts of repairs and improvisations.
Bending or straightening hooks and D rings, holding items in or near a fire, unsticking zippers and pulling out nails come to mind.
Very useful for fire lighting IME as the pliers permit of tinder etc being placed exactly where required without burning the fingers.
Also useful for crunching up small sticks or pieces of wood into very small, matchstick sized pieces for fire lighting.
Just yesterday I used the pliers of a Leatherman tool to open a ring pull can of food from which the ring had come off. This was indoors, but could just as well happened in the outdoors. Opening the can with only a knife would not have been easy with some risk of damage to both knbife and user.

Plier based multi tools are of course very useful in the built enviroment, and the best survival tool is the one that you have with you. He who is used to ECDing a Leatherman tool or equivalent will probably have it with him "by default" in the great outdoors.

On a trip some years ago I noticed my whitewater rafting guide had a Gerber Shorty knife, but next to it a small plain pair of pliars in a belt pouch. When he didn't want to cut a soggy knotted line, the pliars really helped pull the knot loose. He was a 100+ trip guide at that time, and said that he would never go out without his pliars handy.

A fair number of people forgo multitools on the theory they are not very good tools.

I used to carry a MT with me on service calls. over time I switched to needle nose pliers, wire cutters, and a multi bit screwdriver. now I leave the tools at home and let the plant electrician cart the tools and do the work for me.

Much cheaper and far more effective than a MT.

The extra weight is an issue in a pack though. But still, a fair number of people carry a small pair of vise grips and leave the MT at home.

The one tool I have used above all else on a MT is the pliers. But, it is not a very good set of pliers, so I can understand why some would go to a vise grip. I have seriously considered doing so.

From time immemorial, I have carried a multitool or its predecessor, the SAK, as EDC. When I knew I was faced with a task that required "real" tools, I carried them. Tool-kits-on-a-knife are great when you inadvertently run into a situation that requires a screw to be tightened, or a widget adjusted. Then it saves time and steps. But if you are going to be wrenching for a long time, get the real McCoy.

Frankly, I don't feel I am fully functional without my MT handy. Of course there are days when I never used it, but there are also plenty of times when it really comes in handy. Like so many things we discuss, it all depends on the specific situation and circumstances

The pliers on a MT aren't as good as even a $3 pair of Wal-Mart pliers but they're a lot more compact, and often sufficient for the task. I've been surprised at all the times I've used them in the woods. If nothing else they're a great pot grabber that also carries a screwdriver, knife, file and saw.

I carry my Leatherman as EDC because I may need it BEFORE I get to the woods. Plus, it is good for gear repair, etc. Keep a Wenger SAK in my pocket too.

I've also quit carrying my full-sized Leatherman in favor of the very small, very light PS. It has a small pliers if I need to fix something on my backpack or fishing pole and a scissors to cut fishing line. I can use (and have) my knife in the screw head in a pinch.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007T9DSSQ