No matter how much I prep, the storage, BOBs, GHBs, emergency caches, buying a BOV; I cant wrap my head around the loved ones I cant include or protect!

I got Scott William's book BUG OUT and he suggest for my region to bug out to the NH White Mtns. OK Ive never been there but it sounds like a really remote area aprox 90min away from my house. I could eaisily get us "lost" and set up camp.

How bad does it have to be if I grab my immediate family but have to leave my elderly 80'S parents, sons and my brother behind? What are we (the responsible prepared folks) to do??! I dont have the constitution to bug out and leave so many behind

Just thinking out loud, have any of you had the same thoughts?

Good question...will be interesting to see what others say. You live in NH and haven't been to the Whites?! You don't know what you're missing--there's tons of great hiking up there. As far as bugging out, really there aren't that many situations in this part of the country that would require it, I don't think. More likely are bugging-in type scenarios like a bad winter storm...even with the rare hurricane, the only people who might likely have to evacuate are those right near the beach. The plausible situations I can think of that would require evacuating would be if something really bad happened at Seabrook, or if there was flooding and you happen to live in a flood zone. I'm not sure how realistic the idea of "bugging out into the woods" is for a lot of situations--it would be easier to go to family or friends outside the affected area, if possible. Although if the situation is localized and the conditions are good elsewhere, there's nothing wrong with heading out on a nice camping trip until things are cleared up at home .

Before locking yourself into a bug-out plan, make sure that the bug-in option isn't better. Bugging out is a last resort thing for folks with family -- extended family. My bet is that when the time comes, there will be a lot of hungry inexperienced peeps in the White Mtns.

Bugging in keeps the roof you have over your head. Food is in the pantry. For which scenarios do you intend to bug-out? How about dead of winter? Make that hungry and cold.
Bugging in may be a better option for all but the most dire scenarios.

my opinion, YMMV

I have few thoughts to share:

Your question is why my primary plan is to always "Bug In". Home is where my supplies are and where my plans are made for converting areas of my home to hold the other family members that either show up or that I am able to gather in.

I have faced the inevitable fact that some critical medical supplies may come up in short supply and that casualties will occur as more time passes without the infrastructure being restored.

I do have agreements with friends and relatives to shelter each other if I had to leave my home since habitability was no longer possible.

IMO, BoB's are primarily meant for cases such as a house fire, flooding, HazMat Incident upwind of my home, etc.

Just in case I had to relocate to the woods, I regularly go camping in those areas that have possibilities. I also usually take the back roads to get there, driving slow and looking the area over as I go.

There really isn't a perfect answer to your question as everybody's situation is different and every possible threat will be different in several ways from the planning that has been made.

jolt, you raised a good point that I overlooked. The Yankee spirit! I imagine folks here still give a care about their neighbors and neighborhoods. We are an old society, us origional 13 colony Yankees, and seem to put aside th Bs and help each other out in hard times.

Its just ingrained in the New England mentality to take care of the others. perhaps a caryover from Colonial times. Us yankees are a bonded bunch. When I was in the military and stationed overseas, Americians bonded big time. Thats how it is here, Im sure its the same still. Just dont see the magority of NH folk looting and being lawless.

I don't have any family for a thousand miles but have considered whether I could leave friends and neighbors. Can't really know unless it happens. The bugging-out logistics of the metro area I live in are so daunting that I've pretty much dismissed the possibility in any kind of urgent situation. The roads would be absolutely gridlocked, which they already are much of any normal weekday.

Perhaps a hurricane with days of notice....

I'd be working my 80-year old parents into my plans -- for the likelier shelter-in scenarios as well as the bugging out scenarios. With 80-year olds, one of the considerations likely will be medications and ensuring that they have enough of the meds they need to survive.

I've become less oriented toward bugging out from home and am focusing more on having some preps in my vehicle at all times just in case I'm already away from home when something happens. I'd be okay living out of my car for a weekend - including food and water. Then I'd have to hoof it with the backpack I keep in there.

Bugging In = Home Field Advantage.

What I will do depend upon the disaster. Wildfire threatening my home - Bug Out. Relatives are 120 miles away - a long day on a bicycle, and good friends are even closer. Extensive trips would not be necessary to evade the hazard.

Earthquake - Bug In, at least for a start. Depending upon the location of the epicenter, I might have no other option. Although all my gear will be shaken, if not stirred as well, it will all be in one place. I will pluck gear from the rubble and camp in my backyard as I plan my next action.

Anyone who advocates moving to a location about which he has no knowledge is a complete charlatan, in my opinion. Escaping to the wilderness, and slipping the bonds and restraints of civilization, is a romantic fantasy fostered by mall ninja survivalists and other fantasy types who are rare on this forum.

I don't know how physically close your family is, but I think you have to think about the various "Bug Out" scenarios very closely.

To my mind, most of the scenarios are highly local, starting with the individual house (e.g. a fire, then the neighborhood (e.g. gas leak) and so on. These sort of events (there can be many variations), while they might affect you or some family members, are very unlikely to affect everyone, so not everyone would need to bug out. They may be safe, sound and secure where they are.

In a large scale event, e.g. a Katrina or earthquake, then maybe everyone would want to bug out, but realistically, the chance of doing that will be limited by time and the capacity of the local roads to handle the traffic. This is the problem that Dagney faces in DC. Bugging In then becomes the most logical and effective alternative.

So IMO, bugging out really only applies in a very limited set of local circumstances. I agree with the comments along the line that bugging out and living in the woods are unrealistic.

From some of your other posts, I think you are already trying to get the family members thinking of prepping for the unexpected; this is probably the most effective and useful thing you (and they) can do.

I wouldn't worry too much about a family wide "Bug Out" scenario.

Like Dagny, I do carry an E&E Kit in case TSHTF while I'm on the boat, away from home. That would be some kind of EMP incident ONLY, in my mind.

Man this forum is great! Although Ive been prepping for under a year, Im finding out the "horn is still green". I've been narrow minded by worst case scenario parinoia and to focused on the survivorman or dual survival way of living off of nothing in the wild.

I was trying to force prep myself (get-er done NOW) and should of been just taking a deep breath and overviewing my plans Ive achieved so far. Would it be correct to say that prepping is something comprised of layers? Home supplies, BOB, Bug in plans,security, etc that have to be all worked at a little at a time?

Maybe its because I keep up with world news and see this pot to about boil over. Not to mention the wrong and scary path this country is going down. Makes me a bit jittery and I sometimes feel like there's so little time left

I am quite familiar with the White Mountains and many other less populated areas of the US. Gloria and I left Maine some 15 years ago and have been living "on the road" since. Most of our time is spent in such places. We live most of the year in a 4x4 pick up camper. From that vantage point I would not recommend banking on the White Mountains as any sort of retreat except in the most dire circumstances.

Look carefully and you will see that most entry points have been restricted and are easily controlled. The "Whites" are very rugged and roads are narrow and lack any way to pull a vehicle clear of the road except in designated places. Actual useable camping spots outside of the managed campgrounds are few unless you are ready for some serious hiking.

Go there on a nice fall 4 day weekend. It becomes an urban forest. unfortunately many of the folks are inexperienced and in my opinion, do not make good neighbors.

It is sad to say that this condition prevails across much of the US. Bureau of Land Management, Forest Service, National Parks and other land owners are constraining movement in an attempt to manage and protect the lands. You would not believe (whoops your are ex LEO..you would believe..) the stupid and destructive things we have seen in the woods. That and funding cuts have resulted in heavy restrictions in travel. Both regulatory and topographic.

In most National Forests it is now illegal to camp more than 30 feet from a numbered road. That is the regulatory aspect. With that ruling they are creating formidable physical barriers to topographically impede movement on all but numbered roads.

Here again, the effect has created "choke points" throughout the system. We have been Camp Hosts in a dispersed camping area in a large Arizona N.F. On any given weekend, traffic on the arterial roads becomes unmanageable and movement difficult. We had an AVERAGE of 7 helicopter medical evacuations per weekend, several fatalities and untold fender benders.

In contrast, as a responder with the Red Cross, I have spent a month in New Orleans during Katrina, Miami during Hurricane Wilma and others. These are not the best examples of prepared people helping each other. Yet, without a doubt, I believe I would be better off in in either community than heading into the woods.

Suffice it to say that the very last place I want to be in a disaster are the public lands. Instead, we have created many friends at locations all over the country where we will be welcomed into a caring and known community. We bring skills to contribute and a history of friendship. In my considered opinion, it is far better to be in a known community where you can plan, coordinate and provide mutual support than alone with a small group on the public lands.

Nomad

I like the "layers" approach, starting with what you have in your pockets and working out from there- - -at home, in the car, etc etc. And I worry about and prepare for the high probability "smaller" problems first. Things like a flat tire in bad weather. (When did you check the tire pressure in the spare? Gloves and Poncho in the car? etc. etc.)Deal with the small things, and you will find you are in a better position than 99% of the population.

I also am concerned about the "big" things you mention, but IMO the chances of them causing me to have to bug out are very very very small. I have limited $$ and think that the money is better spent on these smaller things that can and do happen.

"Layers" -- literally, yes. I would say layers is a great umbrella term for an effective strategy for survival in extraordinary circumstances as well as a hike in the woods and everyday living.

Perspective and faith are essential, too, I think. An age-old truism of the news media is that "if it bleeds, it leads." That's just the nature of the beast. We tend to gawk at car accidents on the highway and TV news show ratings increase when there is a disaster occurring somewhere.

But most of the cars on the road won't ever crash. Most people in the Middle East are not attacking U.S. embassies. Most of us likely will die the old-fashioned way... by getting old.

I became cognizant of the need to prepare for unexpected and potentially uncomfortable or even dangerous inconveniences about twenty years ago when DC was hit with ice storms and bitter cold that stressed the power grid so much that my zip code was subjected to rolling blackouts. To make it even more unpleasant, I caught the flu from a friend who was visiting. My reaction to that was to forever more have at least two weeks of canned soup in my kitchen and to accelerate acquisition of camping gear - something I was already doing because I'd just become an avid camper the year before. Though unfamiliar with the phrase "shelter-in, that's precisely what I was preparing for. And what I continue to prepare for.

A couple years later, a city-wide alert over cryptosporidium in the water system caused me to start storing a few days worth for me and my dog. Lesson: don't take the tap water for granted - quantity or quality.

September 11, 2001 and the anthrax attacks a few weeks later (both affected me personally) caused me to look at "prepping" in a whole new light. Until then I had not been concerned about the ability to "bug out." Then the more I looked at bugging out, the more desirable sheltering-in became.

Then I read Cormac McCarthy's book, "The Road," and William Forstchen's "One Second After." Both TEOTWAWKI scenarios. My takeaway from each of them was that survival can be overrated in certain circumstances. And that's where faith enters the picture, for me.

If I had Warren Buffett's resources, maybe I'd seriously prepare for a TEOTWAWKI scenario. But it'd probably be a waste of money because I'd be enjoying my money so much traveling around the world, I'd hardly ever be in residence at my post-armageddon survival fortress.

First, really think through and prepare for the likeliest survival scenarios that are common to many disasters (natural, man-made and Hollywood fantasy): 1) power outage; 2) water outage; 3) loss of shelter; 4) stranded vehicle; 5) flooding; 6) downed trees. Etcetera.

If you are prepared to cope with those contingencies and survive a couple weeks without power (ATMs...), supermarkets and restaurants, then I think you are in pretty good shape.

As to whether the world is really in a uniquely dark and perilous time...

Eh. I think we're safer now than when the H-bomb was new and Fidel Castro was beseeching Nikita Krushchev to first-strike us with the USSR arsenal. In that instance, the fate of millions of Americans depended on Krushchev being the voice of reason.

Now that's a scary scenario (i.e. Cuban Missile Crisis 1962). Considering today's Iran situation, perhaps that analogy has diminished my earlier points.

In a few minutes, I'll be headed back out onto a river to paddle a canoe for a couple hours. If something Hollywood horrific happens in those two hours, I could be stuck with just me, my dog, a whistle, a life jacket, a Diet Coke, 32 oz of water (for my dog) and a carbon fiber paddle.

Maybe I'll tuck a firesteel in a pocket.... Nah, going to risk it.

When you get right down to it, prepping is basically Extreme Camping. With an interest in outdoor pursuits, organize your gear, get a few additional items (which you always wanted - now they are justified!) and lay in a bit more food and water thannormal. Voila!

Enjoy your paddle, Dagny.....

Agreed.

As for bug out,only Fire or Fema am I leaving,ie,a catastrophic event where staying is a death plan for sure.Otherwise,Im staying right here.

Plan for everything,never happen unless you are Bill Gates,or even Glen Beck type money.

My thought is every little thing you do puts you that much ahead of the do nothing crowd,and they will be the huge majority,so do what you can is a good plan IMO.

I will try to help the elderly neighbors and feed who I can,but something tells me the unprepared will willingly head off to FEMA,but I want to avoid that if possible.

Bingo, kits within kits, plans within plans. Layered is a good way to describe it. Some of my kits are virtual in that they will be put together from larger kits as the need arises. Factors which decide what is in the kit will be weather, distance to travel & time to get there.

Always have a Plan B.