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#249355 - 08/01/12 08:26 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1419
Loc: Nothern Ontario
If I lived in India, this picture of a typical street's electrical system would probably convince me that being without power just might be safer....

Some other good pictures of the blackout here.

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Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

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#249360 - 08/01/12 08:48 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
spuds Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/24/12
Posts: 822
Loc: SoCal Mtns
Man thats scarey!

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#249368 - 08/01/12 11:47 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
SurvivalDays Offline
Stranger

Registered: 07/17/12
Posts: 9
Loc: Oceanside, California
I've never wanted to travel to India, this confirms it!

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#249377 - 08/02/12 12:59 AM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
ireckon Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/01/10
Posts: 1629
Loc: Northern California
This really is hard to imagine. Electricity in civilization is something I take for granted. There are some things that simply can't be off, such as life support machines, operating room lights during a heart surgery, 911 emergency systems, etc. There are also things like this: you show up at a hospital and they won't treat you because they can't verify insurance coverage in their computer systems. The list goes on and on.

It's easy to think about this type of thing from a healthy person's perspective, but for the sick and people in trouble, electricity suddenly going out can easily be fatal. So, we have electric generators, but eventually the fuel will run out. Also, I highly doubt all of the critical backup generators worked where needed for the 600 million people. I have to wonder, how many people didn't survive as a direct result of this massive power failure?

Let's see. For survival, a human at least needs air, water, food, and shelter. For a modern society of 600 million people, electricity can't be too far down on the list.
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If you're reading this, it's too late.

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#249382 - 08/02/12 04:10 AM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
LED Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 1474
Been listening to some interviews from India. Apparently power interruption is so common that many business, and some homes, have generators and battery backups.

Surprisingly, the outage seems not to have caused too much disruption. I can't imagine what things would be like if we had a simliar outage here in north america. eek

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#249389 - 08/02/12 07:57 AM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
Ian Offline
Member

Registered: 05/15/07
Posts: 198
Loc: Scotland
This is from the UK perspective.

You might like this webpage for details and explanation: Renew-reuse-recycle

Quote:
Note: The normal system frequency is 50Hz. As electricity cannot be stored, the instantaneous generation must match the demand being taken from the system. If the instantaneous demand is higher than the generation, the system frequency will fall. Conversely, if the instantaneous generation is higher than the demand, the frequency will rise. System frequency will therefore vary around the 50 Hz target and National Grid has statutory obligations to maintain the frequency within +/- 0.5Hz around this level. However, National Grid normally operates within more stringent 'operational limits' which are set at +/- 0.2Hz.

Europe is now standardised on 230Vac at 50Hz

The standard for 50Hz demands that the AVERAGE frequency is 50Hz exactly over a period of time, I think 12 hours so frequency controlled clocks are self correcting but at any instant may be a little fast or slow, un-noticable.

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#249391 - 08/02/12 12:40 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: LED]
nursemike Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 870
Loc: wellington, fl
Originally Posted By: LED
Been listening to some interviews from India. Apparently power interruption is so common that many business, and some homes, have generators and battery backups.

Surprisingly, the outage seems not to have caused too much disruption. I can't imagine what things would be like if we had a simliar outage here in north america. eek


Makes one wonder what the India version of the ETS forum would be like.
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Dance like you have never been hurt, work like no one is watching,love like you don't need the money.

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#249399 - 08/02/12 03:43 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: nursemike]
dougwalkabout Offline
Crazy Canuck
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 3240
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: nursemike
Makes one wonder what the India version of the ETS forum would be like.


India is a very diverse country, spanning the range between great wealth and cutting-edge technology to deep, grinding poverty.

I think the folks on the low end of that scale could teach us a great deal about practical survival.

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#249401 - 08/02/12 06:19 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: haertig]
cfraser Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/07
Posts: 110
Loc: Toronto area, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: haertig

I'm scratching my head on that statement. True that my electrical engineering degree is maybe a couple decades out of date, but I think they probably meant the voltage would have dropped, not the frequency. But then, I specialized in the low voltage side of EE, not the power distribution side. We called those power folks "hummers", because everything they touched hummed.


The frequency does drop too when the grid becomes unstable. This is long past the point of simple voltage drop. Who the heck remembers all the stuff they learned about system stability 30 years ago, unless they use it regularly? It hasn't changed though...lots easier to properly model now.

One of the results of the big 1965 NE power outage here was that "we" (speaking as if I was still a utility employee) and the U.S. agreed on a frequency detection system. What it does is also detect the rate of change of frequency, much better than just detecting absolute frequency, faster detection of probs. Various parts of the power system within the range of each detector are dumped, depending on how fast the freq is dropping (usually). Every transformer station or larger would have at least one of these, so there are a lot of them and almost everywhere populated would have many.

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#249409 - 08/02/12 10:15 PM Re: Power outage in India - 600 million dark [Re: TeacherRO]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
On the topic of a widespread long-term power outage: The Electronic Armageddon Live: Friday Aug 03 2012
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Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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