It's been said that a "4-season tent" is really a "1-season tent", as it's much too heavy to carry and too hot to use in warmer weather.

What are the major advantages of a 4-season tent over a 3-season one? The obvious disadvantages are that it's more expensive and a lot heavier. But in a survival situation, would a 3-season tent reasonably suffice, if you constructed a snow wall as a windbreak? At what sort of temperatures would you say you absolutely need to have the 4-season tent? Or is it an issue of temperature alone?

I did a search for "4 season tent" on the forum and found a number of postings, but none seemed to answer my question. Chris K. did point out in one post that the 4-season tent is built to withstand a heavier snow load, which I must confess I hadn't considered. Are there other things that I missed? If I decide to go winter camping with a 3-season tent, am I dicing with death? Or am I just running the risk of being a little less comfortable?

I once went on a desert field trip. My Botony prof and I laughed at the first time campers zippered inside tents as we shook out our sleeping bags. Sometime near midnight it SNOWED. We had to hop into his VW bug and sleep sitting up in our bags. In the morning two 6'+ men had to unzip and body slam the doors open. The various tents were all intact ( it was only a very cold, but 2' snowfall) but the occupants equally miserable. What is a true 4 season, or winter tent? Yes,They are usually more robust, which often merely camoflages design failures. The older tents of Rustrum, Kephart and Nessmuck were 'Balloon Cloth', a very lightwieght but tightly woven cotton. Better winter tents have an inner liner ( essentially 2 tents) which forms a warm air pocket, helps vent interior moisture and increase windproofing. You may also get a snow tunnel entrance ( think of a short tube) to trap heat and decrease dragging in wet snow somewhat. This is a true expedition,dead of winter, Robert W.Service winter snow tent. If wieght and overheating is a factor, there are some tricks. A tent fly is often offered to extend seasonal use in a 3 season version. A set of snow stakes, heavier or doubled up lines and a simple wisk broom will help. If your in real weather by all means build protective walls. That wisk broom is to brush yourself down before entering the tent.

Quality of construction is more important. There are many self-claimed 4 season tents out there, but few of them are what I think of as a bomb-proof expedition tent. We have used 3 and so-called 4 season tents for two decades in Canada and interior Alaska at many elevations and all seasons. A backpackable unheated tent beats being in the open at very low temps but it doesn't hold a candle to a heated tent.

Just because BSA says no flames in tents... most of my "real" camping is not with BSA and there have been many times when it would have been just plain stupid to not run a stove inside the tent - some of my tents have/have had zip-outs in the floor specifically for that purpose.

Unless you're thinking about a VE-24 or -25 or something designed for those kinds of conditions, I think a good and robust 3-season tent is just fine up north. I "lose" tents over time to UV degradation, not weather damage. Example: My Dad and I spent one early blizzard at elevation in interior Alaska in a cheap little dome that it was charitable to call a 3-season tent - huge, heavy wet snow and high winds. It did FINE - we would push out on the bowed poles every so often to shove back the snow load. Were stuck there for almost 48 hours, perched on a razor-back ridge in the lee of a small boulder and we were snug. Snow covered the tent and we did have to clear vents once in a while - type of tent had no impact on that.

There were a few important things about that tent: 1) It was with us when the storm hit - no way could we have made it back to base camp 3,000 ft below us - the storm was that sudden. 2) I had modified it by adding a skirt to the rainfly so it came nearly to the ground and added stake-out loops to the bottom edge - that kept the wind from having its way with the rainfly and kept a layer of water-proof nylon between us and the rapid accumulation of wet snow. 3) We had inspected the tent carefully, re-inforced a few areas that seemed iffy with some bar-tacking on the old Singer, and we seam-sealed everything twice. 4) It was a beast to put up - the poles were ever-so-slightly long, so we trimmed them - that helped us get the tent together much more rapidly when the chips were down.

We had two of those department-store tents with us - one for base camp at 3,500ft and one that walked about with us. Equivalent tents today may or may not be as good, but better ones are readily available for about 3 times the price, which is cheap 20+ years later... I used that tent for years afterwards, including many nights well below -35F; as cold as -52F. I have much better tents now, but they are just as chilly at -35F as that one was... and they still beat the heck out of no tent.

IMHO, if the tent will stand up to high winds in a summer thunderstorm and keep you dry, it will be useable in the winter up north. Getting a decent tent and/or improving what you get is probably more important than a manufacture's advertisment as "3-season" or "4-season".

YMMV, but that's been my experience.

HTH. Tom

Unless you are planning to run an expedition in the extreme cold, huge snow fall and lots and lots of rain I would just go with basic 3 season. I made a mistake of going for one of the North Face 4 season tents. It was heavy, expensive and pain to set. I went back exchanged it for rugged 3 season (north face nebula) put some work into it and it works fine since 1998.

I think that what you do with the tent and how you prepare it plays more important role than what season rating it has. Sealing seams (even if manufacturer tells you that they were sealed), proper set up and general maintenance will make your tent withstand more than you think.

4 season tent will have a tougher floor, stronger poles, better reinforcement on stitching, will hold temp little better sometimes at the cost of ventilation, will be sturdier and most likely free standing without pegs for quick setup (pegs will be used to get full benefits of the four season).

3 season tents can be "converted" into the above. You can replace your poles with stronger ones or you can just clear the snow when it accumulates. In order to make it sturdier you can just pay more attention when anchoring. Use ground cloth or an in-tent liner for extra ground insulation. As far as temp and wind "chillage" goes I guess you can just get an extra fleece liner for your bag or some extra clothing and better sleeping pad. Obviously if you are in -10 with wind chill to -30 4 season will show its benefits. I stayed out with mine down to 0 and it was nice warm and cozy inside. It was snowing and very windy but inside was toasty.

4 season tent in the summer is little pointless. It gets too hot so you have to remove the rain fly but that means that you are going to get soaked when storm passes by. I had the same experience when I bough a 0 degree bag and thought I was set for life. I very quickly changed my mind during one of the 80 degree summer nights when I woke up shivering all wet from the sweat. I guess it got little too warm.

Matt

>>>Just because BSA says no flames in tents... most of my "real" camping is not with BSA and there have been many times when it would have been just plain stupid to not run a stove inside the tent - some of my tents have/have had zip-outs in the floor specifically for that purpose.<<<


Two years ago, my wife gave me a Colmann catalitic propane heater for camping. I have yet to use it. I really haven't been camping in weather that would have required it, either out of necessity or as a creature comfort. But mostly out of fear of ridicule from my fellow Scouters! <img src="images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

And don't forget the advantages to carrying a tarp and just building a snow cave shelter!