How much white gas should one bring on a trip? I don't know that I can give you a one-size-fits all answer since so much depends on the individual and conditions, but I've got some ideas that may help you get a handle on the issue.



Please join me as I briefly examine How Much White Gas Do I Need?

HJ

Hey Jim, I say if you're using the MSR EGK, take a LOT of white gas:) They burn like a Saturn 5 booster. J/k, another great article, thank you!

Good article but it's only one man's style.

Experience and practice with one's gear, food habits and partners is the only way to be sure.

You might consider mentioning that stove fuel is necessary if one is going to boil water for safe drinking. I consider my stove and a some extra fuel as the backup for my water pump.
I don't carry enough fuel to cover the whole trip as primary water supply but it would help stretch the safe water supply.

Yep.

Yep.

My numbers should be treated perhaps as a starting point, a point from which you fine tune to get your own numbers.

Good point. Your stove + some extra fuel makes a really good back up water treatment. Boiling is the most effective water treatment for bacteria, viruses, and other microbes.

HJ

The problem becomes even more interesting when you throw in air travel, which means you will purchase your fuel where you begin your excursion. For one thing, you may carry a stove that burns the fuel available at your destination, not necessarily your first preference. Secondly, you may buy a fuel module that has far more fuel than you need for basic cooking. This often means you can boil water with great abandon and leave the filter, etc. behind. This can actually result in a net savings in weight.

Just cross your fingers and hope the shelves aren't bare when you trot up to buy fuel.

Yeah, that happened to me recently. I walked in expecting to find the Coleman fuel cans all lined up, but there was not a one on the shelves. I guess some of these places are carrying "just in time" inventory management just a bit too far. Fortunately for me, there was another store that had them near by.

HJ

That is one reason to carry a liquid fuel stove. White gas seems to be available most places (at least in N America). If you buy one of the multi-fuel stoves that will also burn kerosene you are in even better shape. Propane/butane canisters can be hard to find in some places.

I don't want to take the thread off track, but... I agree, even here in the U.S. not more than 30 miles from the nations Capital there are a lot of gas stations that carry both propane and k-1 kerosene (and of course, normal gasoline). Canisters for backpacking stoves? Never heard of them.

If your planning includes, shall I say, scarcity of resources, I like propane and multi-liquid stoves. Most flexibility and availability of resources. Also, at least around here, the very reasonably priced (competition keeps the price down).

My customers are saying NONE! I don't argue with them because my experience is with propane. I know your discussion addresses how much to carry on the trail. My interest is in the customers shifting from Coleman Fuel to unleaded gas when heading out on the trip.

I used to sell hundreds of cans of Coleman Fuel. Now I sell < five cans per year. When asked about using unleaded in their stoves, I can get none to admit that they have had any problems with their stoves. I have read all of Colemans warnings (Marketing ?) and the other fuel manufacturers.

What is your take?

I am thinking of cacheing fuel on my Creature-of-Habit trails.

Unleaded stinks a little, but the most damaging aspect is at least here pretty much everybody add 10% ethanol to gasoline, and it'll eat your rubber/plastic component alive.

How timely. I've often wondered about that.

Blake

www.outdoorquest.blogspot.com

Jim,Thanx Alot for the info,That should be made a Sticky,Very valuable info,Indeed!

Interestingly, there aren't that many easily used figures out there on white gas consumption.

These numbers are my numbers based on my style and my equipment. They're going to vary by individual, with the conditions, and with the stove employed.

HJ

Just another data point-

I've used Coleman Peak 1 stoves for backpacking and jeep camping.

One year I was curious about how long the stoves (I had 2 at the time) would run. So one winter day I filled them up and ran them full blast.

Both lasted 45 minutes on full output.

Note that there is inefficiency in the startup/warmup phase so for actual use with several start/stop cycles on that tank of fuel one wouldn't get 45 minutes output.

I use pre-heating paste to soften the startup flares an minimize warmup time.

There are a lot of stoves out there that can burn unleaded. Most people see "can burn unleaded" on a stove and assume that the stove will burn unleaded equally well as white gasoline, which is typically not the case.

Unleaded contains additives which help a high compression, high heat engine such as the one in an automobile run well. A backpacking stove doesn't operate with that kind of heat and compression. The additives in the gasoline will be left as deposits in the generator and jet. Your stove will generally clog more often, and you may also need to replace the generator.

Also, as someone mentioned, the ethanol added to gasoline may degrade over time the seals of a backpacking stove.

In the short run, unleaded will work; you'll just have to be prepared for more frequent clogging. In the long run, you can create problems for your stove.

Generally, I recommend white gasoline or kerosene (K-1 grade) for stove use. If you have to, then sure, use AV gas, unleaded, jet fuel, etc, but if white gas or kero are available, always pick those first.

HJ

Once I left some unleaded gas (with ethanol according to pump) inside a brunton bottle, in two days time the plastic cap (including threads) became soft enough I can easily make impressions with my fingernail, freaked me out and I've been extremely wary of gasoline since.

With kerosene it has been over two months without problem. Although kerosene isn't good for simmering from my experience, turn it down too much and there isn't enough heat feedback to vaporize (the type of generator that pass though flame may fare better).

"I've noticed that I use something on the order of 1.5 fl oz (44ml) of white gas on a solo trip per day. For two people, I find my usage is something on the order of 2.25 fl oz (67ml) per day."

I have limited experience with Coleman fuel stoves. But on one summer 2-week trip with 12 people in our group, we used 3 Whisperlite stoves at meal times (breakfast and supper, dinner was a simple snack). We packed roughly 2 oz per person per day but since the bottles need airspace it worked out to about 1.2x that amount. Each of us was assigned a 33oz bottle. (Some of the gals "lost" their fuel bottles in the guys packs with our consent.) I fugured we carried about 330 oz for the group or roughly $40-45 of fuel. We ended up with 3.5 bottles of fuel at the end. So we probably only used about 1.4 oz/day/person including stove priming. And with so many rookies with white gas stoves, I figure that usage is on the high side as we probably wasted fuel in the priming stage.

That's quite a bit more efficient than if we had packed alcohol stoves but less efficient & less expensive than if we had used canister stoves.

Presumably, we gained efficiency with such a large group vs. your average with 2 people.

Yipes!!


I've stored white gas and kero in stove fuel bottles for multiple years at a time. No problems. I would not try that with unleaded. The unleaded may a) eat your seals and b) is not stable and may do some separating.

HJ

Generally, the more people sharing a white gas stove, the more efficient it's going to be on a per-person basis. A certain amount of fuel gets wasted on priming and start up. A certain amount of fuel gets wasted on shut down. That amount is about the same whether 3 people use the stove or 1. If you spread that waste out over three different people, the per person amount is reduced.

It's also generally more efficient to heat three cups of water at one time than it is to heat 1 cup three times.

All those things add up to greater efficiency with a shared white gas stove. This is why I don't say something like "bring 2 fl oz per day per person." A group is typically more efficient. If you bring per person the amount you'd bring when you just go alone, you'll likely end up with a lot of leftover fuel.

HJ

As we did... 3.5 bottles left over! If we had been better organized and skilled with the stoves it would have been at least 4 and possibly 5 bottles left over. I had a few complaints about the way our trip was organized. I won't mention the organization but in terms of equipement -- we had heavy 4 season tents, superfluous group gear, extra training gear that got little use, 3 partial bags of food left over including some CANNED food that I didn't know about, gorp that nobody could stomach, kayaks that needed repairs, 60-lb 72 litre backpacks that nobody knew how to adjust except me and a couple of people that were all-out jerks.

But enough of that... we were discussing quantities of white gas.
Rules of thumb can be used. I still think a XX oz./person/day rule is as good as any. If one uses 2 oz/day for one person to 1.75 oz/person/day for a group of 4-5 and 1.5 oz/person/day for larger groups is a good a starting point as any. Then factor in personal habits of whether people have a late coffee/tea, whether they have a hot or cold breakfast, the season (cold weather camping may require snow melting), use of boiling to sterilize water, what type of dish washing is done and whether the group chooses to abstain on cooking on the last day.

You could calculate a similar number when using other types of fuel like alcohol or cannister stoves.

Good points all.

In terms of personal habits, I should mention I usually do the dishes with cold water. Not always (ever try to clean up chili with cold water?), but if I can I'll save the fuel and use cold water.

My 1.5 fl oz/day for one and 2.25 fl oz/day for two is again more of a starting point, a starting point that needs to be adjusted for conditions, style, stove, etc. To me, my numbers are conservative, but YMMV. Still, I figure it's better to have some idea of what you'll need. There's not much out there as I search the web in terms of easily used fuel planning numbers.

HJ

For bug in/vehicle bug out, Coleman Dual Fuel with trangia alcohol back-up. The link is to the current model.

I think a Coleman 533 like the one you linked to makes a lot of sense for a vehicle (or bugging in). A bit much to carry though.

I'd run it on white gas wherever possible and save unleaded for emergencies only. Yes, I know it says "dual fuel," but unleaded will degrade a stove no matter what it says on the box.

HJ

+1. For carry it'll be either the Trangia, similar home built, or a wood burning can stove.

Got photos?

HJ

Stock Mini Trangia kit w/ .8L pot, teflon skillet/lid, windshield, & simmer ring. I haven't tried building one yet. The wood burner would be a field expedient McGyver.

The Mini Trangia is my go to solo cook kit these days. It also works well with a Pocket Rocket. Ditch the windshield and rig heavy duty aluminum foil for a windscreen and you can cook up a storm. A very good value for the money. I have two Mini's- the earlier non stick pan version lives in my vehicle as part of the emergency kit there.

I was thinking it added a lot of weight & could be replaced w/ a couple pieces of coat hanger for a pot support and foil.