Is anyone doing this? Does it actually work for you?

http://lifehacker.com/5890207/give-your-folding-knife-assisted-opening-capabilities-with-zip-ties

I'm not,and after viewing the video, I don't think I will. Mall ninja material.

while the Emerson Wave concept does work, i've just never found a need for it.

in fact, i just returned from feeding the ponies and used my spyderco military to cut the baling twine, all while wearing gloves. and i can open it while bringing it from the pocket to the twine, without any additional time being needed.

his idea is a solution in need of a question.

Yeah it works, people has been doing it since probably the 80's. I've never found a need for it, plus it makes your knife uglier.

The zipties can easily snag on your pocket. The small Spydercos are very easy to open, but just like any small folder, you just have to grip them properly.

If you need a blade that fast carry a small fixed blade in a pocket sheath.....


BOATMAN
John

The "wave" feature pioneered by Emerson is very effective - if you want a quick-opening knife. This is specifically for defensive applicatons only ... it does not apply to survival methods. Having tried various options, I have found that the small wave feature designed by Emerson is pretty much optimal - for its intended purpose. It may look simple, but Emerson got it right. Other knife manufacturers have tried their own copies of this form of quick-opening, but generally they don't work as well as the Emerson knives.

I couldn't tell you if the idea you highlighted in the photo would work well. You can only find out by actually trying it. I don't ever buy knide blades with holes in them ... because it weakens the blades. But it might be a quick "semi-fix" to a Spyderco blade.

If you want a quick-opening knife, why not just just buy an Emerson knife? They are not cheap ... but the blade alloy is very good and the wave design works!

Incidentally - as far as i know, the "wave" feature on Emerson knives is not subject to laws related to "assisted opening" knives. Those laws apply to switchblades and balisong (butterfly) knives. The Emerson knives have no springs, and the quick-opening action comes entirely from the motion of your hand and the way the knife catches on your trousers. I could be wrong about this - but I think the Emerson knives are legal anywhere (subject to other constraints on folding knives and blade lengths).

Pete2

I don't know if I would want to trust my life to a zip tie stuffed thru a hole in my knife.

If I need a knife that deploys uber quick I will invest the money in a good one designed for that purpose.

Military combat aside, has anyone on this forum actually ever needed to use a knife as a form of self defense? If so, I'd like to hear the situation.

I've never EVER thought of the knife I carry as a weapon, and tend to think those that do tend toward the TEOTWAWKI side of things.

Yes.

S&W HRT folder. It's sharp, hand filling, flips open by it's hilt and is $13 on sale at Big 5. A well made knife for the money and comes in plain steel or black.

KenK...on the other side though, it cost me 130 pesos and a Seiko watch for a brief examination of a balisong the second week downtown Angeles City, outside Clark AFB, Philippines 1972

My EDC knife is a Kershaw Ken Onion folder with tanto point and assisted open, so there would be no point on mine. It's already quick enough I've almost got my thumb a few times by barely getting it out of the way, and the thumb stud is easy to hit without needing to be any bigger.

Usually the shorter the weapon is, the harder it is to use it. (Naturally I am speaking of impact/cutting weapons.) First, the modality of fighting is rather wide for the knife. To be competent, you cannot skip out on learning striking and arms' length grappling. Second, the inherent nature of fighting with a knife is not pleasant. You are also in very close, and the knife is a very fluid, fast weapon. That means if your opponent is armed with the same, you're likely to end up with a lot of gashes even if you win. If you have trained enough, you'll know that dropping your knife is a real possibility. Third, it takes a lot longer to get good with the knife than with a longer, more powerful weapon. The disparity is so big that at times you might wonder why you even train in it when you can just take a better weapon and be a lot more lethal. If you have to choose between a knife and a machete, grab the machete. If you have to choose between a machete and a sword, grab the sword.

I wouldn't recommend relying on the knife for defense unless you've gotten quite a bit of training; i.e., much more than a weekend seminar, like a few years at the least, preferably several years or more. Filipino and Indonesian arts are typically where you'd want to go. You also have to keep up your skills by constant training. Then you hope to God that if you end up having to defend yourself, you don't find yourself having brought a knife to a gun fight. The machismo factor is often what makes people talk about the knife.

There is a lot of misinformation out there, even if only indirectly. Recently there was someone advertising steel plates for flak jackets (or something like that). The manufacturer's website says their product will also defend against the knife. I guess they were thinking of the dreaded "stab" that you hear so much in the news, such as: "There was a stabbing last night!" (by an idiot who doesn't know how to fight with the knife). If you take a look at that jacket, it conveniently exposes the areas with major blood vessels. These are some of the prime targets for the knife, and in fact the jacket make these areas more visible. Thank you for wearing the vest. Now there are guiding lines for me, and you're bulky and slow.

I don't think it's a good idea to discuss actual self defense situations on a public forum.

As for the original poster's question on the mall ninja stuff:

It's hard for me to imagine what advantage you get from speeding up the opening of your knife like that by a fraction of a second. Defensively, if you really need that extra time, that means the opponent is already within fighting distance, and has probably launched his attack already. The fact that you're choosing to draw your knife says you're so skilled that you can spend time to get a weapon ready rather than responding with whatever you may already have in your hands (may be nothing). In that case you don't need to my opinion. I bow to the mall ninja.

The main application I see is impressing your friends. And also sneaking up on someone to attack him.

My teenage kids have been in marshal arts for a long time (10 years now - Jr. BBs) and their instructor told them that the best defense for a knife attack is to run like hell - that the results of a real knife attack are so bad - so nasty - that running has better odds in the end.

It doesn't matter which end of the knife you are on, if you get into a knife fight, you will get cut. If you read a lot of military history, even in combat, when it comes down to choosing a weapon for close in fighting, most will choose something to bludgeon their opponent with instead of a knife. A knife is a tool. If things are so bad you only have a knife, run if you can.

Saw pic of Fairbairn and didn't see any scars. And if they were that cut up they weren't very good at thier craft. Just my opinion.

when you fight, you get hit, whether you win or not. Unless you are the one doing the ambushing, and you do it with overwhelming and rapid application of force, you are likely to take some damage. That is whether it is with fists, knives, baseball bats or guns.

The winner of a knife fight is the guy who is cut-up the least... to paraphrase someone who has more experience with knife fights: if you managed to get yourself into a knife fight you have failed everything since breakfast.

I hope to never participate in a knife fight. I no more regard my knife as a weapon against another human than I do my hatchet, even though either could be used as such.

One of the uses I envision for a one handed opening knife is a fall from a deerstand. Deerhuntig is a somewhat solitary activity, and an elevated stand is used in snowy conditions when wearing baggy cloths for protection from the very cold Nov-Dec weather. Deerstands have cables, bolts, various metal supports, ladders, and platforms on them. There are also nylon safety harnesses that many use to prevent a fall to the ground. I could see a person slipping and falling to end up dangling by a strap, a bootlace, or pant leg etc.

It would be a great advantage to have a good one-handed knife within reach to cut oneself down. I would not risk my safety on a modification.

Unless you carry a blade as your primary weapon as I do. My gun is my last resort weapon. Knives are quiet .45s are loud and leave nras if you don't have time or light to police them up. Again, just my humble opinion.

With no disrespect intended, I'm guessing that most ETSers do not use a blade as a primary weapon.

My training with knife fighting is extremely limited, I'd consider it a very last resort. As little as I've been trained in empty-hand fighting I still know more about it than knife fighting.

I think it was Bruce Lee who said that if a fight has gone on more than 10 seconds it's gone on too long.

Hey Chaos. May I ask what style you studied?

I studied Shotokan as a young'un. I sucked at it, but a few of the strikes have stayed with me. My father was a Marine and spent some time teaching me some of the things he learned in boot camp. In college I studied Aikido until I tore up my shoulder for the first time. I remember quite a bit of the Aikido and I do try to practice periodically, but I'm good at it only in comparison to people who haven't studied any martial arts.

“Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face.”
-Mike Tyson

=====

My carry folders must be one-handed opening. When I open envelopes, the proper technique is to hold the envelope firmly in one hand. What am I supposed to do, put the envelope down or shift my fingers to open a knife with both hands? There's a fat chance of that happening. While I'm not motivated to get the Emerson wave feature (or equivalents), it's tempting. Sometimes I can't wait the extra second to get into my mail.

Seriously though, I do like my folder to be one-handed. However, my gear and dogmas are constantly evolving. In a few months, I might want my carry folder to be a two-handed opener or a slower opener. Unlikely, but it could happen.

Plan on taking out a sentry on the way to work SD ? Rough place where you live

Every time I go into town I pack an extra quiet knife just in case I have to silently off someone along the way.

A real man opens his mail with a fixed blade.

LOL @ the manly ETSers! You fellas really know how to make a girl ETSer smile!

DUDE!!!
Welcome back to the fire!! I just noticed you returned. I've been wondering how you've been doing for years. If you are serious about moving to Texas some day, drop me a line. I have contacts all over the place and will happily try and find you a job, house, dog, and edible plants.

As for me being a moderator, as far as I can tell it was more of everyone else stepping back instead of me stepping forward. After a while I was close to pulling my own CK-act when Hikin_Jim, Nighthiker, Tyber, and Chaosmagnet pulled me back from the edge. They do all the heavy lifting now, I just get to bust heads. It's very therapeutic.
-Blast

Retreating from the discussion of silently dispatching enemy sentries at the mall, I did try this modification to my Sypderco Tenacious, and found it does work but is not very safe or useful.

I personally have no problem opening the Spydie with my thumb, and in fact, I can open in quicker and easier than my assisted Kershaw Leak (the latter has a nub on the spine you have to locate and press to activate the assist). Meanwhile, the zip ties caught on the pocket lining and sometimes made it slower to get the knife out of my pocket, occasionally opening the blade enough to expose the edge before coming free.

The last straw was it just looked ugly. And as every good mall ninja knows, style points are awarded for appearance.

I won't say that I wouldn't use my pocket knife as a weapon of last resort if it came to that, but that's not even close to why I carry it. I carry a handgun for use as a weapon, I view the knife generally as just a tool.

I can't carry a fixed blade at work. I carry an Emerson with the wave feature, because I can open it with one hand: I always seem to have something in my off hand. One of the first things I did was break the tip off, so it's also my screwdriver. If I have to get into a knife fight, my situational awareness was off, or I didn't hump enough ammo.

reply to earlier comment ...

"It's hard for me to imagine what advantage you get from speeding up the opening of your knife like that by a fraction of a second"

It depends on your situation, training and skill. Against unskilled opponents, esp. where you've got some reasonable maneuvering room, the drawing of your knife is less critical. But against a determined opponent (esp. at close range), or someone who knows what they are doing, those fractions of a second are vital. With the right training and practice, that wave feature on the Emerson knife could be a lifesaver.

I would be the first to agree, though, that your best strategy is to walk away from a knife fight.
And I also agree with Montanero - that if you stay in the fight and your opponent does the same thing, then your chances of getting cut are pretty good.

Pete2

If you have time to draw, you should have time for pre-emptive action (without drawing). At least in what I'm picturing anyway. Seizing the initiative may especially be crucial against trained assailants (i.e., better to take pre-emptive action than to draw and have to resort to reactive action). Maybe I'm missing something.

It still seems to me the time saved seems minimal. After some practice, you should be able to draw with the regular knob or hole almost as fast. It may take more effort than the wave feature, but you'll get there. The small time difference does not make me particularly want to run out and get a new knife. (And I always want to run out and buy a shiny new knife.)

I don't necessarily agree it's always the best to run away. Some people run faster than you do.

This sort of stuff is hard to discuss on the internet, and we should really stay away from becoming like one of those martial arts website where they practice time-honored art of word-do. Let me just reiterate the point I wanted to make (but probably obscured by all my talking): Get training, preferably a lot of training, if you want to use a knife for defensive purposes. Someone said owning a gun makes you armed no more than a piano makes you a musician. It's the same with a knife.

Thanks. Both are very good styles.

There is also the noise factor. I stumbled across some $60 dollar tanto folder Bodyguards for $3.00 at flea market and snatched them all up. One night in a dark alley three ruffians decided to try and rob me. The locking mechanism was so loud I was sure they had heard it. Fortunately deepening my voice and agressive movement towards them was all that was neccesary to defuse the situation. I alerted a passing officer and they were apprehended a few blocks away. Armed. Attitude can be a deciding factor in preventing trouble.

Lol. Old habits die hard Taurus. And we have a lot of gang activity here. It's the condom principle: I'd rather have it and not need it, than not have it and need it.

Aw shucks jac. We're just bein' boys with toys.

Ha! Yeah I guess so. Don't pay any attn to me my friend, I am only teasing. I Personally have never needed a combat blade outside of work but my situation is not anyone else's for sure. I am fortunate in that I live in a quiet area. It wasn't always so, and I have the tell tale scars to prove it, but those are from a younger and less experienced me.

Glad you made it out in one piece!

Well said.

Keep in mind that learning to use a knife defensively takes significantly more time and effort than learning how to use a pistol. I generally recommend pepper spray to people who want to carry a defensive weapon but won't invest time and effort in ongoing competency.