After all the excellent feedback from my Primary Survival Knives thread I have a new question.
If you were starting a new Altoids PSK what FOLDING knife would you include in it? Note. It must fit INSIDE the kit.

Probably SAK Classic/Wenger Esquire...the scissors and tweezers would be handy in addition to the blade, and it's small and won't take up too much room. Or the small SAK that has a LED light...can't recall the name but it's the size of the classic.

Hmm. well I don't really subscribe to Altoid tin kits, I feel they are best used to store and make char cloth. To answer your question though, I EDC a Kershaw Chive, that I am quite fond of, that could work in that senerio. but again..Not a fan of the altoilds tin PSK.

I am not a big fan of this size of kit either. If forced into doing so, I think I would put some kind of small SAK in it.

Why does it have to be a folding knife?

Doug's RSK® Mk5 is perfect for this application.

Pete

I'm interested in hearing answers to this, as well, because my Buck folder is a tad too heavy for a pocket kit.

Haven't used a knife like the Mk5; looks a bit tricky, owing to my unfamiliarity with such a blade shape.

Spyderco Dragonfly. For a tiny knife, it feels very nice in the hand.

I'd likely pick an RSK Mk.5 over any folder for this purpose. My preference, however, is for a larger folder.

I routinely EDC a knife, so I would be tempted to make up an Altoids box to supplement my EDC, and so would render it knifeless (well maybe a scalpel blade). If I threw in a knife, I would be strongly tempted by a Ritter Mk5, which is produced precisely for this application. Another contender, which is a folder, is a small Gerber LST, not the "regular" size. I am not sure it is produced at present.

Because folding is the question. I have made a few mini fixed blades to fit the Altoids tin and none have met my personal standards. Also folders pack more blade length.

I am leaning toward a KISS with a wharncliffe blade. Or perhaps another more traditional version, perhaps with the scales removed or buffed down.

Ditto Pete and Chaosmagnet: Doug's MK5

+1 to Izzy's recommendation for a Victorinox Farmer

I would use a Spyderco Cricket or Dragonfly depending on how much room I could allocate IF I were restricted to a folder. The RSK is a MUCH better choice in my mind. Although I don't have any Altoids kits, I have bought a dozen or so RSK's as spares for my kit and the kits of others.

Respectfully,

Jerry

For full disclosure, I have been friends with the owner of Spyderco since before they made their first knife and helped them to spread their market in the early days.

Thanks Jerry. I have examined an MK5 and I simply do not like the feel or design. No offense to Mr. Ritter on his design, it is simply a personal choice. I was not pleased with my own designs for blades to fit an Altoids tin. I do admire some of his other designs however.

Spyderco Ladybug

Benchmade 710 -- I don't do Altoids tins either

You might give the Dajo Ascent a try: it's about 2.75 inches when closed, has a two-inch liner-lock blade, opens and closes easy with one hand, has an integrated clip, and a pair of so-so tweezers in the handle.

I've had one tucked into my belt for a few months now and I really appreciate the portability and utility. I haven't used it in the bush.

From what I hear, it's a lot like Boker's SUBCOM line; you may want to look at those for a similar form factor.

MK5!! It beats the heck out of any folder you might select!

Thanks for the tip> I'll check it out.

Either the Gerber STL 2.0 or STL 2.5

The thinnest I've seen is the Ultimate Pen Knife or the 3.0 Titanium Lockback Folder from A.G. Russell

In my kits, I currently have the Mk5 fixed blade but before that I used a Leatherman Squirt and before that the Micra. Although the 1.5" blade is not as useful as a Spyderco Ladybug, the other mini tools (pliers or scissors) are quite useful. I still keep one in my jacket (fastened to the inside of the pocket with a fabric loop). It comes with me on every camping trip as an alternative to the larger Wave.

I am suprised at how many seem to be depending on a folding knife as their primary knife for survival.

I have lots of knives, a bunch are folders but I don't consider any of them as a primary survial knife. I consider a folding knife as one that is already broken in the middle, it has a built in critical weakness.

I carry a SAK Farmer as a pocket knife, always but I also have a fixed blade, with a full or nearly full tang with me on all wilderness trips.

I think the take away from this thread is that in real life (as opposed to Rambo movies) a folder is perfectly adequate. I have found that fire lighting equipment has been critical on several occasions, that there have been times (mostly in the past, pre-LED) when i wished I had a dependable light, but I can not recall ever muttering, "I wish I had a bigger, heavier, longer fixed blade knife." I do have some in my collection, but they are rarely carried. They do have their uses, but, let's face it, they are very specialized.

I have found a machete useful on trips to Mexico, but that actually was not in a true wilderness setting.

I'm with you. In a survival situation if I need to chop or pry, a folder will fail. I realize that there is only a small chance that would ever happen, but that's the case with 90% of the subjects we discuss here. I carry a small folder or Leatherman and a larger full tang knife when I go into the forest.

I usually carry a fixed blade when I'm hiking, but the rest of the time I carry a folder.

Given the time and the materials, my hope is that I could use a folder to make a good prying tool. A good chopping tool is tougher -- I've never learned flint knapping and it doesn't seem like a good use of my limited training time and budget.

Here is Flint Knapping 101. Take Rock A and smash it into Rock B (or anything else that is hard and unyielding). When the dust settles, pick up the sharp pieces and use until dull. Repeat as necessary.

That is basically how tools were made for thousands of years, and this while this technique is a far cry from the beautifully crafted Clovis points and Solutrean blades which are at the apex of this technology, it will work in a pinch. If you don't have flint or chert handy, don't despair. Glass works better than almost any natural product, even better than obsidian.

I don't mean to imply that one needs to carry a Rambo sized knife in the woods. I carry a blade between 3 1/2 and 4 1/2 inches. My daypack has a Mora 510 in it and I have used that for awhile now.

A blade made from a rock may be useful for some knife work but to use it for long will be mighty uncomfortable on the hand. My Mora 510 and sheath weighs less than 3 ounces, less than a Spydeco Tenacious.

In a tin - SAK (one with a saw for my preference) or a small Spyderco - the Grasshopper slippie is a good one.

Bear in mind weight as well - I love the Boker Subcom, but it is very heavy for a small knife

As ever, these are all points on a spectrum - given the choice, a full sized axe, saw, knife and multitool etc would be with me in a crisis. However, as others have said, it's only useful if you have it when you need it

I think the Victorinox Farmer is poorly named as it connotes an image, that unless you look up the blade configuration, doesn't do it justice

aluminum alox handles with lanyard ring
only 3 layers
main blade
excellent saw
can opener w/small straight blade screwdriver
cap lifter w/large straight blade screwdriver and wire stripper
awl that opens on end that you can actually use

i agree with LesSnyder, for this use the SAK Farmer is extremely useful, inexpensive and well made.


borrowed image

Knapping really isn't all that hard to learn. I was given a lesson at a gun show, bought some books and set out to learn the craft.

I have carried a Farmer for over 30 years. I think the combo is perfect for camping and general outdoor use. I mainly got it originally because of the thicker, more sturdy main blade and the saw. The saw is great for cutting notches for traps and such. I will look into the Harvestor model, my spoon carving could use some help:)

I love my Farmers. I have 2, usually carry one, (my first knife ever and it's on my keychain) and use it at least every day.

Thanks Jac. It's a fine looking knife and seems well liked. Good luck on your fire starting!

For anyone who hasn't handled the Soldier or Pioneer line (the Farmer is one variation), it's worth noting that the blade and tools are considerably thicker and stronger than those found on the familiar, plastic-handled Swiss Army Knife.

BTW: Thanks, Izzy_, for the tip on the Pioneer Harvester. I think I need one. (I am a big fan of having a spare blade on-board.)

Izzy, I see what you mean about the limited editions. There are a few Bushcrafters for sale out there. They're nice and slim for front pocket carry, and the saw is an absolute essential for me. But $60 a pop? Ouch!

BTW, no problem with the Harvester. I grind the keyring holder off Alox SWAKs anyway. They gouge my hand in the wrong spot and give me a blister. If I need a lanyard, I wrap braided fishing line around the screwdriver. Though if I ground the keyring off a Bushcrafter, there'd probably be a mob with pitchforks and torches ...

What's with the corkscrew on the supposedly "combat ready" GAK. Are their rations that much different from ours? I must have been in the wrong army.....

Who needs a cork screw anyway? I have never used one in the field. Does anyone have any opinions on the U.S. Army pocket knife?

Thanks Izzy. Much appreciated.

Izzy, check your PM, ASAP. I have a link that may blow your socks off.

Interesting backstory. Helps inform my buying choices. Thanks for the heads-up.

BTW, I agree with your comments about the Safari/ /GAK trooper line. These were fine tools. I gave a Victorinox-stamped variant to a friend many years ago. And I have a couple of the West German (GAK) versions still. They were selling for $20 many years ago. One I used, hard, and it still rotates amongst various kits. The other is new and untouched; nary a Swiss logo to be seen.

Absolutely, I assume these GAKs were made by a different company, but to the same physical specs. The steel is slightly different (and slightly better IMO). I guess it's common practice for military procurement to be contracted to the home-town crowd whenever possible. That's politics, baby.

The stamp on the tang says TSR Rostfrei (all caps).

A hard core wilderness survival scenario does not typically involve bottles of wine.

But there are other sides to life than strict hard core wilderness survival settings. Life should include things like good friends and bottles of wine. Having a cork screw is more a statement to this attitude than an actual nescessity...

To me, it makes sense to carry a swiss army knife (or multitool) with a cork screw on a regular basis - and in particular taking it with me when camping, picnicking or canoeing.




Field can mean a lot of things, including combat experience, which I don't have, so I'll avoid that term for now.

I've used the cork screw in the bush/wilderness - for it's intended purpose as well as a poking instrument. Surprising how useful a poking instrument is when you have to fix things. And yes, there are tons of things other than a cork screw that can serve as poking instruments.

A corkscrew just seems like a less than optimum choice for a military issue item (GAK). I always prefer the models that have a Phillips screwdriver in that location, but what can I say? - my favorite wine comes in bottles with screw tops......

I prefer to take boxed/bagged wine with me into the wild.

I prefer a standalone corkscrew. There's one in my camping gear.

Before Leathermans, I used SAK corkscrews to open knots that were impossibly tight. The tip would slip neatly in between. Then give it a couple of turns and pull. Works pretty well.

My SAK corkscrews have also ensured the survival of countless dinner parties.

On a trip to Paris many years ago we had an impromptu picnic on the back lawn at Versailles. We had picked up a fine Bordeaux at a supermarket (really good wine in French supermarkets) and my SAK corkscrew saved the day by being there. Just one fond memory of my adventures with that Victorinox Champion (not to be confused with the overly large Swiss Champ).

Great tip, Doug. Thanks! I've used my SAK corkscrew many times on our Fish N Chix trips but never thought of using it on knots. Cool!