Pilot friend flew over Joplin soon after it hit, video shot by passenger (unfortunately didn't know what he was doing w/ his iPhone, but still shocking).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv3COQ6gv-8&feature=youtu.be

i saw this early today and found it more shocking than some of the shots from the ground.entire Cul-de-sac developments nothing but piles of lumber with a twisting road thru it.this go's beyond survival...

The deaths keep going up and probably will for the next few days. You can tell from the footage that if your best plan didn't call for you to take cover underground, then your odds of surviving are next to nil. This is why I have a hard time believing that above ground shelters will hold up in a tornado.

The damage to life and property is astounding.

It's more than possible to build above ground that is tornado proof, but to do so would probably be more expensive than going underground in most locations. Think "pillbox" or ammo bunkers/blastproof rivetments/Blockhouses. In other words, things meant to take direct artillery fire - basically making an above ground underground if you know what I mean

On a new construction home, I can do one for ~$4,000.00 my cost.

Retrofit is ~$10K in the existing slab, or ~$6K looking like a shed.

Two of these survived the May 1999 EF5 (the tornado the caused the "F" to become the "EF" scale).

Any other questions?

when this is all sorted out i hope we see something about just how many people had a shelter of any kind and were able to use it in time.thinking about it for a second a search over the entire tornado belt for shelters that were used,with photos,would go a long way in encouraging people to have one.

Do tornadoes lift a foot or more of soil off the ground?

I can't understand why a small, sturdy shelter can't be built either on top of the ground or half underground, and covered with 12-24" of soil, and planted with some kind of plant that has a dense root system.

If there is nothing for the wind to grab, what's going to happen? A tornado will slide right over it? Is this a bad thing?

I recently posted a description of the shelters designed by Cal-Earth founder Nader Khalili. They are cheap and can be built by a couple of guys in a few days. They can be built aboveground or partly below ground. They're extremely stable, even in earthquake country. But they're not expensive enough for many people, I guess. Not showy enough, like the new $40,000 red pickup, or the $150,000 new travel trailer or motorhome.

And I have the feeling that 'I won't happen to us' fits into the equation somewhere, too.

Sue

Agreed, and for the great majority of people, they're right

What ever happened to the fallout shelters from the 60s? They were perfect, prefabbed, and fairly reasonable to install. A version designed only for tornadoes could be smaller, since occupancy times would be much shorter.

Desperado - Any photos of your handiwork post tornado? Or even pre? I have every confidence that structures can be built to withstand most if not all tornadoes, above ground, I just think it'd be neat to see if afterwards.

I would think that poured reinforced concrete buildings would tolerate direct hits from at least some smaller tornadoes reasonably well, though certainly a roof and glass not designed for such things wouldn't make it which would make survivability of the event a lot tougher.

Monolithic Domes come in many shapes and sizes. If I lived in hurricane or tornado prone area, I'd build one of these. Not traditional, but they're suitable to the weather.

minimal-tornado-damage-at-faith-chapel

Any idea how these domes fare in earthquake country?

Some of the Concrete dome homes are guaranteed against earthquakes.

I understand that many of the wood types leaked badly, but the dome is generally quite a stable shape, esp if embedded into a hill or partially buried.

Sue

Is it really such a bad thing to consider they should start building houses underground in tornado towns?

I'm thinking that maybe a "community shelter" might be a good way to go. Just a simple place for people to gather until the danger clears.

This place looks like a good place to start.

Certainly puts the Hurricane force two winds we had here in Scotland yesterday into perspective. The destruction at Joplin is just incredible.

Community shelters would mainly work in town, in shopping areas, or wherever there are high numbers of people, which is fine. But it wouldn't be realistic to think people should try to get to them from outside the fairly immediate area. Tornadoes aren't that predictable, and can wipe you out on the road, esp in the dark, lightning or not.

Six sqft per person, almost 30x30"... I feel my claustrophobia flaring up...

Sue

Your right about tornadoes being unpredictable. I was thinking more along the lines of people going to the shelters long before the tornadoes dropped from the sky. It would be claustrophobic. What I hear from alot of people is cost and no place to bury one. With field lines and septic tanks in the backyard, if you don't have much land what do you do? I don't have any real answers I'm just throwing things out there because I'm in the same boat they are. Thanks for your input.

How long is "long before the tornadoes dropped from the sky" ? The National weather service has gotten much better at warnings but some times the warning time is as little as 5 minutes (or less). Even with 20 minutes of warning getting people to go to a community shelter would be difficult.

Tornadoes are often found in severe thunderstorms (Hail, lightning, and high winds). Going any significant distance outdoors in these conditions can be very hazardous. Also the inconvenience factor (loss of time, number of "false alarms, not wanting to show up in your bathrobe) would limit how effective a community shelter would be.

Improved building codes would help a lot with smaller tornadoes. Basements and "storm cellers" are traditional in parts of the midwest. Personally I wouldn't own a house in a tornado prone area that did not have a basement. It isn't a guarantee (there are few in life) but it improves your odds tremendously.

Like much else in life - you make your choices and accept the consequences. Choose to live in a flood plain, expect floods. Choose to live near a fault line, expect earth quakes. Choose to live in a house without a basement or storm celler in tornado alley, expect the worst.

-Eric

Quick Dorothy, into the root cellar with Toto.
I was going to say, "How quickly we forget," but I think it's more a matter of being in denial...

hikermor -- Domes and earthquakes

What scares me the most is the huge number of people who live in mobile homes in Tornado Alley that don't have any safe place to run. I live in one of these rat traps, and know it would turn into one of those piles of splinters that I see on the news.

Make one of those sandbag shelters and call it a root cellar the rest of the time.

Sue

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...souri-town.html

With 8000 buildings damaged and 2500 buildings completely destroyed and 1500 missing with 125 dead, the Joplin tornado seems to be turning into a very serious disaster. Could it possibly be that 1500-2000+ people have actually been killed in this disaster? During the recent news media conference I watched on CNN, the news media weren't exactly getting their questions answered.


Edit;

And with now a Tornado touching down near Durham, California, it seems to be getting a little like this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUAtoGaqnIo

I sincerely hope the loss of life is not in that range.

The news reports I've seen suggest that the number of "missing" is in part because the lists of people hospitalized, bugged-out, and deceased have not been cross-referenced yet. It seems entirely likely, given the destruction, that some of the missing will be fatalities though.

The last Number i had heard was the final death toll was 134 people with all missing people accounted for.

Bang.

-Sheriff Blast

Fixed.

-Sheriff Blast

Bang.

-Sheriff Blast

Fixed.
-Sheriff Blast

It's creeping up on tornado season here, yet again. It seems like the idea for a community shelter was a good thought after all, at least to some.

This shelter will hold 96 people and can withstand an F5, it also has a generator.(Not pictured) The cost is $90k.
This one is in the Hebron community.















I'm not sure if this is an actual shelter site or just a storage site for shelters before installation.




















Here's an inside shot.































Here is a clever solution for those living in a mobile home.

I don't know how safe I'd feel in those shelters.

I thought we weren't in too much of a tornado area until an F4 roared through just a few miles southwest of our neighborhood. Utter devastation.

Now whenever I hear a warning on the weather radio, it's directly into the basement we go.

If you have the option to get in a basement then your odds of NOT getting hurt went up significantly. The very first picture I posted was not a completed shelter. When it's finished there will be dirt and grass or gravel mounded up on both sides of the shelter.