Paul and neuronboy,

Hey, I don't disagree that a Muenter hitch is a neat thing to know. But here's where I stand on things like that: I've spent the vast majority of my life so far being responsible and accountable for other folks. I do/have done many things that I will not commend to others, because I cannot be there to be responsible for their safety.

If I personally was in a hurry to bail out, I would never bother with anything - I've done more hasty rappels than everything else put together, and that's still how I choose to walk down a steep or slippery slope (IF there is no drop-off). If I could keep my feet on a surface (vs hanging in free air), I would do a hasty rappel in an emergency. Give me a rope and I'm outa there (gloves would be nice, but hands heal). I've even done hasty rappels with a casualty tied onto me (now THAT will get your attention - can we say "rope burns"?).

But I will not suggest that anyone else do a hasty rappel, and I don't suggest that non-experts use a Muenter hitch. Rappeling is reputed to cause more injuries than any other recreational climbing activity, precisely because lots of folks enjoy it and some do not ever learn how to be safe doing it.

And experts make mistakes, too. We had a fatality two years ago at a favorite local climbing site. A young man got his shirt entangled in his rappel device. It so happened that a couple of professionals were arriving to practice vertical rescues about then, and they were asked by the group leader to assist. God knows why, but when the rescuer rappeled down to the young man, he cut him free. On the uphill side of the rope. Without first clipping the victim to himself. The young man fell and was killed instantly on impact.

I do not advocate the Muenter hitch for novices. If someone can afford a rope, they jolly well can afford a proper friction device. Tubes are cheap and even a Rescue 8 is cheaper than a rope. No need to get more complicated than that - racks are nice, but they are big, expensive, and... easy for a novice to make a mistake with. Simple and inexpensive and safe is best, IMHO. <shrug> Never hurts to know more knots and how to use them, and good for you that you know what the hitch is and how to use it to lower yourself.

But all that comes back to why I have the persepctive that I have. I did a lot of climbing with laid rope, Swiss seat (from a length of the same laid rope), steel oval non-locking 'biners, and nothing else (OK - crampons and pitons if needed).

I like the modern stuff a whole lot better because it's safer. Did I flush all the old ways from my brain? Heck, no! I can improvise all kinds of scary stuff with a rope and a few 'biners. But I'm darned careful who I teach that stuff to nowadays.

I'm not saying y'all are wrong, just trying to inject a note of caution. Having done so, I retire from the field <bow>.

Regards,

Tom