Here's a link to a local story about a 79-year-old hunter, found dead of hypothermia.

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Missing-Hunter-Found-Dead--108443584.html

Missing on Saturday, found dead on Tuesday, apparently well dressed, but got wet from standing water in a swampy area. Temperature at night went into the thirties.

The man had become confused, been unable to think. But still, who goes into the woods without the means to make a fire?

Basic survival should be a part of hunter education. Sadly, it isn't.

Tim W.

Thought about this overnight some more -- 79 years, lost, going in the wrong direction, didn't stay put -- those are some bad decisions -- but once you're in that spot -- night is coming, you're stumbling through tough woods, you've fallen and gotten soaked, and the temperature is plummeting -- that is one frightening scenario.

My question is -- assuming that you could not build a fire, what can you carry that is light enough (most hunters would not carry a heavy pack) that you could wrap yourself to make it to morning? Would a heavy mylar blanket (not a space blanket but the heavier kind with one red side and one silver reflective side) be enough?

Myself, I think I'd carry an extra pair of socks in a waterproof bag, one or two plastic trash type bags and a sportsman's blanket. A couple of hand warmers, and a small alcohol stove and a cup wouldn't hurt either.

TW

The basic essentials of going on a hunt:

- Shelter for one night, in any conditions. At least a bivvy sack or tube tent.

- Warmth for one night, in any conditions. If you're not carrying something that will burn in the pouring rain, well that's just dumb. I carry a wallet full of starter fuels - solid hydrocarbons with the words "Visa" "American Express" and "Discover Card" on them. They burn REALLY WELL as a fire starter - slice them up and get them lit with some wetfire tinder and you can dry out lots of organics.

- Signal whistle.

- Basic (stop the bleeding) first aid kit (you don't need a tongue depressor with a hunting FAK)

We had a similar situation out here a couple weeks back. From the news reports this poor soul wasn't prepared either.

http://forums.equipped.org/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=211138#Post211138

I'm not sure that burning plastic is necessarily the best bet, unless you have left yourself with no other choice (so, DON'T Do THAT!). Most plastics give off a host of pretty toxic stuff when burnt, so I would be a bit concerned, unless you have some information that proves it safe. In any case, I think I'd certainly want to ensure I was well upwind before doing so.

Assuming that you cannot build a fire then a sportsman type heavy duty mylar blanket probably wouldn't do. A dry bag containing a Bivi Jacket (British Army), Bivi Trousers (British Army), Wool socks (Marks and Spenser X-static wool), Goretex Socks (Gore Bike Wear), Primaloft insulated gloves (Trek) and a Fleece lined Gortex hat (British Army) would help though, especially if getting soaked to the skin has occurred. It does mean lugging around about 3 1/2lbs in weight though.



A Dry bag containing thermally insulated clothing)



Even in temperatures just above freezing a Goretex Bivi bag and insulating mat i.e. Thermarest would be welcome as chopping down tree boughs is hard tiring work and the calories expended are better left to keeping you warm during the night. A hot meal and drink is always welcome especially if recovering from a dunking in freezing water.

As others have suggested, it's not so much the stuff you carry that makes the difference, though a few essentials will help a lot.

Essentially, you want a bit of extra clothing and a few helpful items to make a bit of a hootch for shelter. Fire is helpful, especially to dry out or get warm, hydrating drinks inside you. But it takes a heckuva lot of wood to keep you warm all night.

The goal is to choose a place to hole up that's as dry as possible and out of the wind and precipitation. The base of a big old spruce is pretty well perfect. Build up as much insulation from local materials as you possibly can -- grass, evergreen boughs, cattail stalks, leaf litter -- to keep yourself well off the ground, and pack around yourself. A space blanket or heatsheet staked loosely over the debris pile will help a lot to break the wind, and it helps make you visible. Everybody should do this once or twice; once you realize it works, even in pretty nasty conditions, you never feel quite so helpless out in the bush.

I just burn as starter...and yeah, hydrogen cyanide is no fun...

Lots of good thoughts/suggestions. However, I think in both the story I noted and the other link provided that, as Nighthiker suggested, early symptoms weren't recognized and thinking capacity quickly deteriorated.

Tim

"...early symptoms weren't recognized and thinking capacity quickly deteriorated."

By then, you're really in trouble, and no matter what you do, it will probably be the wrong thing. You've passed the point of adjusting the situation more to your benefit.

I'm not a hunter, and one thing I JUST DO NOT UNDERSTAND is why a group of guys go hunting together and practically the first thing they do is split up. I see two problems here: 1)you give your eager buddies something to aim at when you move through the brush, and 2) there's no one near to help you if you start becoming hypothermic, sprain your ankle or break your leg, start having heart pain, etc.

"We probably shouldn't have ...(fill in the blank)" doesn't raise any dead.

And, when everything is fine, you don't want to carry excess weight. But when the SHTF, how much will you pay for a couple of extra pounds of crucial gear?

Sue

It's entirely practical. A group of hunters moving together make a substantial racket, and all they can hear is each other. But if they split up, they may surprise an animal, or drive it toward the next of their group. All pack carnivores use similar tactics. "The hounds to the hunters," or "pushing bush" as it's called up here. (No doubt we need a more PC expression.)

That makes sense about splitting up.

Regarding a fire, even if you don't have fire for complete warmth through the night, you can still make a slow burning fire. Even a tiny flame the size of a candle would be a lot better than cold darkness for 9+ hours. I wake up every couple hours even in the nicest conditions. Out there, I would probably wake up every half hour or so. I could keep a slow burning fire going throughout the night.

First, credit cards don't actually catch very readily or burn very well. I decommission my CCs by cutting them up and melting them. Mostly they melt but if I hold the lighter under one for a time it will, eventually, catch.

The ones I've tried burn with a weak guttering flame that is easily blown out. I suspect that the plastic has some sort of fire retardant that makes it hard to catch and easy to blow out. While burning it produces a lot of stringy black soot that makes a mess of everything it touches, and various noxious fumes. I the fumes are a serious health hazard if you are not burning a credit card in a very confined space but the fumes are clearly not pleasant or healthy.

For tinder I've turned to a solid tinder that is essentially yellow wax and chemical impregnated card stock. It rides well in the wallet, takes up little room, doesn't seem to deteriorate, and works quite well. I can't find, or remember the name, but I'm looking. Best Glide used to carry it as I remember it. Problem is that unlike gel and liquid tinder it doesn't deteriorate much so I bought my supply better than five years ago and haven't found it necessary to buy more. Alas ... good things that last a long time tend to disappear from the market.

Cool deal -- found it, same package and everything:
http://www.gearwild.com/servlet/the-103/BCB-Fire-Starting-Tinder/Detail

IMHO this stuff is much better than trying to light your credit cards.

Second, there are conditions where you are better off finding shelter, to limit heat loss, than staying exposed and struggling to light a fire. Even the settlers, people who lit fires regularly and had their ducks in a row for lighting a fire in tough conditions, were sometimes stymied when it came to lighting a fire. Strong wind and driving rain might see them hunkering down instead of wasting energy, and remaining exposed, trying to light a fire.

Yes, I know ... folklore is that Daniel Boone could get a fire lit underwater in a snowstorm using toenail clippings and fiery looks. Over whiskey in a bar he would have probably seconded the claim.

Fire is not the be and end all of survival. It would be silly to overlook its benefits where possible but to focus on it at the expense of common sense self-protection is no virtue. Wiser often to hunker down, concentrate on reducing heat loss, let your metabolism warm you up, and wait for more favorable conditions.

Fire and shelter go together like ham and eggs. In a serious cold situation, you need to get out of the weather,even in a very small microenvironment, just to have a reasonable chance at lighting a fire. And you need some sort of shelter to contain, even partially, the heat generated by your fire.

I would say I have spent about ten or so unexpected nights out in fairly serious cold, stormy conditions. In all but one of these, the ability to create fire was important in getting through the night. In one instance, I am not sure I would have survived without the fire and the accompanying rudimentary shelter (snow hole underneath a pine tree with a small tarp over all) or at least I would not have retained all my digits.

We don't talk about it very much, but I firmly believe there is a very important psychological component to a fire as well. And nothing helps like a nice cup of tea.

Hey Martin,That Tongue Depressor would be better than the Plastic money!Theres alway's the Rubber in the elastic hem of your skivvys,Should one need to get the tinder,Moving along!Dollar Bills burn pretty good,I've seen them put to worse use!Etc.,Etc.

"Fire and shelter go together like ham and eggs."

+1 on that!

If you're really cold, it's going to be hard to get much heat from a fire alone in the open. But a fire in front of a rock alcove or tiny shelter can make all the difference in the world.

Sue

Part of my EDC is a fifty dollar bill, kept primarily for fiscal emergencies. But it has another use- potential fire starter. Does anyone know if a fifty burns fifty times longer than a one dollar note? Seems logical.

And yes, I have seen occasions where I would burn a fifty, if that was the best way to start a fire...

I believe that's known as the "Dave Ramsey Fire Starting Method"...

Update on story: The hunter was found about a mile from his last known location. He had traveled through very swampy area, and was soaking wet when found dead. Coroner ruled cause of death was hypothermia. Tim

Link

http://www.watertowndailytimes.com/article/20101117/NEWS04/311179970

Carrying 50 one-dollar bills would start more fires, you could use them as toilet paper, AND you'd be able to make change!

Sue

But think of the excessive weight of all those bills! (groan.....)

Oh, Hiker, that's less than 2 oz! Get all new ones and they'll pack down tight. Just remember to crumple and soften up the new bills if you're going to use them as TP... wouldn't want to get any nasty paper cuts.

Sue

If any of you guys find yourself overly weighed down with cash, I will gladly take some off your hands!

I carry a standard military issue nylon poncho with me when I hunt. Besides rain protection, it makes a little tent, a ground cloth, burrito wrap, or a personal windbreak/shelter worn over the coat. Folds almost flat, and slips right into the game pouch of my hunting vest/coat. If my DW is with me, she carries one too. Snap them together for a pup tent and a romantic evening by the fire.