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#210448 - 10/28/10 01:09 AM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: Susan]
sotto Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 450
Originally Posted By: Susan
Sotto, your description reminds me of reading some old-time, first-person accounts of life and death in the Midwest, when the body was held through winter and buried in spring.

Sue


Looking back, it sure would've been nice to dig that grave in shirt sleeves smelling good warm moist earth and fresh green grass.

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#210454 - 10/28/10 01:47 AM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: sotto]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
This reminds me of an incident a while back when I was excavating a large cliff dwelling in Canyon de Chelly. Like most of the sites of this type, I knew there were more recent Navajo burials and I was concerned about how we would deal with them. My Navajo foreman, a really wonderful and unique individual, also had the same concerns.

When we met for the first time, he straightaway asked me not to excavate a particular room because a young baby, dying during a hard winter freeze, had been buried there "not very long ago." It was the only unfrozen ground available, being bone dry.

I had worked out this marvelous (in my mind, at least) random sampling scheme for excavating the site,and, naturally, this room was on the list. Needless to say, plans were changed.

About all I can add further to this rollicking discussion is to praise the body bag. Being around remains can be very disconcerting, particularly if the end was violent. Placing the body in the bag allows one to get on with the business of transportation and life gets back to normal.
_________________________
Geezer in Chief

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#210507 - 10/28/10 11:20 PM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: hikermor]
MIKEG Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 25
Loc: VA
In relatively isolated incidents that have high numbers of dead you can use cold storage to secure bodies, something like a temp controlled trailer is what I have recommended to some agencies during consult work. This will allow for ease of movement, eventual identification, autopsy if required, and the container can be destroyed or cleaned.

For long term, make a reasonable effort to track them and bury them or burn them. In the case of potential crime and eventual investigation burying them would obviously help should they ever need to be recovered but without preservation the time line is going to be rather short.

As for the vicks, I have heard this for years and it seems to be widely believed. However, consider for a second the intended effect of vicks. It is intended to open your sinuses and I find that it actually makes the funk stick with you longer. Throw a mask on and get the work done.
_________________________
For the purposes of full disclosure, I am the owner of Austere Provisions Company www.austereprovisions.com .

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#210515 - 10/29/10 01:37 AM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: dweste]
dougwalkabout Offline
Crazy Canuck
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 3240
Loc: Alberta, Canada
I vaguely remember an incident where the authorities used an artificial ice surface (skating rink or curling rink, I can't remember) as a temporary morgue. It was some sort of natural disaster in high summer. The artificial ice gave the coroner and law enforcement time to identify the victims and release them to families for proper burial.

I seem to recall that various teams in Haiti after the earthquake used Tiger Balm instead of Vicks to mask the smell of death. I can't say I've tried it. I hope I don't ever have to.

EDIT:
This is OT but it may be of interest. The link is to the cards listing the descriptions, effects, and possible identifying information for the recovered remains of people drowned in the sinking of the Titanic. I wonder if the cold, cold Atlantic water slowed decomposition enough to help the officials trying to identify the bodies? At any rate, it is a fascinating read.
http://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/victims.php?angle=1-110


Edited by dougwalkabout (10/29/10 01:47 AM)

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#210542 - 10/29/10 03:11 PM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: dweste]
CANOEDOGS Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 1853
Loc: MINNESOTA
the RN's at the Vets Hospital ER in Minneapolis would put a tiny drop of clove oil on a paper mask,i would go out in the hall------

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#210575 - 10/29/10 08:11 PM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: dweste]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
You can get oil of cloves from Asian grocery stores.

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#210593 - 10/30/10 01:14 AM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: Susan]
LED Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 1474
Most drug stores also carry it in the dental dept. for toothaches.

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#210599 - 10/30/10 02:15 AM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: NightHiker]
dougwalkabout Offline
Crazy Canuck
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 3240
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: NightHiker
... a few drops of eugenol (clove oil).



Very interesting, thanks! I'll have to test that on some unspeakably vile task.

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#210667 - 10/31/10 05:00 PM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: dweste]
Desperado Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/01/08
Posts: 1530
Loc: DFW, Texas
Keep lots of the cheapest, most disgusting cigars you can find handy also. Smoke them after leaving the area of decomposition smell. It will kill the smell until you can shower / change clothes.

After working a decomp scene:

Pre-soak your clothing in Coke (not Pepsi, doesn't work except with coke), and add 2 ltrs. to each load of wash.

It isn't perfect, but it seems to help.

Just don't get the black juice from decomp on you if you can. If it does get on your clothes / shoes you might as well trash them. Either the smell never goes away, or I cannot mentally get the smell to go away.

If a fire was involved, all bets are off.........
_________________________
I do the things that I must, and really regret, are unfortunately necessary.

RIP OBG

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#210670 - 10/31/10 05:56 PM Re: Concern for the dead [Re: dweste]
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2997
I think the smell of cigars is worse than decomposition, not to mention the crap thats in cigar smoke, those things are worse than cigarettes.

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