A shooting at a state park near Seattle left 2 dead and 4 wounded last night. Early media reports seem (reading between the lines) to indicate that this was probably gang/alcohol related. Undoubtedly it will bring further restrictions on guns for law abiding citizens.

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/98688659.html

Another account with more detail:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100718/ap_on_re_us/us_state_park_shooting_12

I severely doubt this, or any other event, will bring about restrictions.

But the historic record is pretty clear that cliques and drinking get violent as men buck for rank and position. If guns are present they get used and things go from busted noses and spitting teeth to bodies hauled off in bags.

Where's the Sasquatch when you need em'!

Staying out of the line of fire, of course!

No more true for handguns than any other potential weapon in the hands of criminals; bowling pins, hayforks, knitting needles, softball bats, box cutters.....

Related comments from John Lott, of the American Enterprise Institute:

"Lott: During state legislative hearings on concealed-handgun laws, possibly the most commonly raised concern involved fears that armed citizens would attack each other in the heat of the moment following car accidents. The evidence shows that such fears are unfounded. Despite millions of people licensed to carry concealed handguns and many states having these laws for decades, there has only been one case where a person with a permit used a gun after a traffic accident and even in that one case it was in self-defense.

Question: Violence is often directed at women. Won't more guns put more women at risk?

Lott: Murder rates decline when either more women or more men carry concealed handguns, but a gun represents a much larger change in a woman's ability to defend herself than it does for a man. An additional woman carrying a concealed handgun reduces the murder rate for women by about 3 to 4 times more than an additional man carrying a concealed handgun reduces the murder rate for men."

Umm ... sure. [B]owling pins, hayforks, knitting needles, softball bats, box cutters are clearly major threats. Except for one small point. They don't get used very often and they are much less likely to be casually used, or if used, kill. Handguns are easy to hide, easy to use and lethal.

The simple fact is that the favored weapon for homicide, suicide and criminal activity is the handgun. When was the last time a depressed and alienated kid killed himself with a softball bat. Gangs don't do drive-by hayforkings. I also seem to have missed the wave of bowling pin crimes.

Seeing as that, according to the report the two groups were 50 to 75 yards away from each other, I suspect it was 50 to 75 feet at most because most handgun users won't hit anything at 50 to 75 yards, but by any means it would seem that had they been armed with "bowling pins, hayforks, knitting needles, softball bats, box cutters" there would have been fewer casualties. Even if it was 5 to 7 feet only the hayfork would seem to be a significant threat.

The traffic accident and woman arguments are simple straw men. Entirely meaningless.

The incident occurred about ~10 miles from home, and my brother was in the park when it happened: according to his account, one of the assailants fired his handgun, to which assailants in the other family / 'gang' responded by firing their handguns. Assailant #1 was wounded and killed. Then another was killed, and several wounded. Cops are still sorting this out. Brother describes as near to chaos and danger to his two young kids as anything he has faced in his life. Hardly what you expect on a calm summer evening down by the lake.

Folks in Washington state have the right to carry concealed weapons into state parks with a concealed carry permit. That's a fact of law. Like it or not, you gotta remember it was punks who shot up the park, its not a matter of laws. I have no idea if the various assailants had CCW permits or not. I doubt that there would have been quite the fracas and the body count if the assailants were wielding knives, or pitchforks. Certainly my brother would not have been put on the defensive protecting the lives of his young kids from assailants with pitchforks.

Gangs are a substitute for society - they happen when society fails, creating cretins and punks. Gangs hanging out in the park down by the lake alongside decent folks is a failure IMO.

The real 'simple fact' is that criminals commit crimes, not potential weapons. Even when guns are restricted, criminals continue committing violent crimes that are no less heinous. It is an unassailable and proven fact that when licensed citizens carry, violent crime goes down.

Heres a clip from an article in the anti-gun Gotham News:

Bloomberg's Crusade
Hilly says that the most consistent leadership on gun issues comes from Bloomberg and Mayors Against Illegal Guns, the organization he formed with Boston Mayor Thomas Menino. The group boasts 340 mayors from across the country who want to stop the flow of illegal guns.

Bloomberg's push to rid New York City of illegal guns has seen results. The number of guns recovered from crime scenes in the city dropped by 13 percent from last year. The number of people shot to death dropped from 347 in 2007 to 292 in 2008. Overall, murders increased from 2007 to 2008, but only due to an increase in crimes committed with knives.

Whoah; back off boys!
Haven't you heard? Blast, our moderator is unavoidably away from his post. So we are having to police ourselves and NOT discusing anything even remotely controversial till he returns.
We can go back to baiting each other when he does :-)
The Sock

I think as more info comes out we'll see some other factors involved. In MN you can carry MS 624.714(doesn't need to be concealed) in the state parks.

This incident could have happened anywhere. Folks are no safer in a state park, downtown in a big city, or in the parking lot at their local Wal-Mart.

That being said, parks seem to attract two groups of people: families enjoying the outdoors and criminals looking to escape the eyes of the law.

And, apparently, folks that get lost easily in parks

The radio was saying that it started with one guy butting another with his chest and it was starting to escalate. Another person, thinking it was getting out of hand, fired his handgun into the air to stop it (so the story goes). Once the first shot was fired, the other armed proponents started firing, too. The cops reported finding at least 25 shell casings, and they're fairly certain that there are more in the vegetation. When the entrance/exit was blocked (by nearby law enforcement, it sounds), many weapons were tossed into the bushes; others were found in cars.

Sue

Was anyone hurt other than the stupid gang-bangers who were shooting at each other? If not, I say "Goodbye, good riddance". Nobody needs these nincompoops around, so if they're willing to exterminate each other before the police step in and put the straggler living ones in jail, so much the better. They should comb the bushes for their discarded weapons and give them to the needy.