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#197203 - 03/04/10 04:44 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: MostlyHarmless]
scafool Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
I was hoping for a bit more useful detail to appear in the news before commenting.
It does not seem to be coming.

It is a sad story and I hate to criticize dead people but from what I read he was not equipped to deal with this at all.

The winter has been very warm in Toronto and he might have been fooled into expecting it to be the same where he decided to do his camping trip.
Unfortunately it turned colder with blowing snow over the few days he was out. Friday was cold, wet and windy, with mixed rain and snow. It was light snow/rain and winds most of the week.
On Thursday there was a snow storm which went through here too.

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/CYQA/2010/2/26/DailyHistory.html

As Iron Raven, Dougwalkabout and Mostly Harmless say, not nice weather to be out in.
I didn't like it a bit myself.

When it is near melting you face wet clothing, and hypothermia is a sneaky killer.

If he was slogging around in the snow he was likely tired, cold and wet.
The snow came as a big early dump this year and only moderate storms after, but there still would have been about 3 feet of it in the bush, maybe more.
The top layers have been crusty with the lower layers quite soft crystal almost like fine sugar. You go through the crust and then founder in the loose stuff every step.
Travel on this snow really does require snow shoes or skis.
(Or a skidoo) because you are not going to get far walking in it with just your hiking boots
It also tends to soak your boots and pants if it is warm enough to be near freezing.

Winter camp to me means a lot of gear. Most of it is bulk insulation and tarp/tent. If you are going on foot those little toboggans are nice.

I will repeat something I say often.
The biggest part of survival is to not place yourself in survival situations.
Going camping to test out survival techniques is fine but do it in a safe way. Make sure you have a Plan B available if your experiment goes wrong.

Now I can say something positive about this too.
At least he had the good sense to let somebody know where he was headed and when to expect him back.
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May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.

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#197224 - 03/04/10 08:08 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: MostlyHarmless]
clarktx Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/01/08
Posts: 250
Loc: Houston, Texas
Originally Posted By: MostlyHarmless
On the plus side, he died doing something he really loved. He did not expose others to foolish risks. His death is sad and most likely totally unnecessary, but he died taking a risk doing something he loved. I can sympathize with that.


Amen to that.
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You can't teach experience.

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#197235 - 03/04/10 10:14 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: MostlyHarmless]
Byrd_Huntr Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 1174
Loc: MN, Land O' Lakes & Rivers ...
I read the article, and I feel we shouldn't rush to judgement. He had gone into the woods on several other occasions with little gear, he looked to be in decent shape from the picture, and the cop said he was no rookie in the woods. He may have had a heart attack or hit his head. Maybe he took his own life, we don't know yet. They didn't say much and they are doing an autopsy. With cold crisp weather, he might have made it out. Oddly enough, he may have been a victim of the warmer weather, because it is the hardest to stay warm when it is right above the freezing mark and there is heavy wet snow. If that was the case, he definately failed to act properly, make a fire, a shelter, some snowshoes, and sit tight for a day or two until it got colder, or he was rescued. They are still digging well equipped stone age hunters out of glaciers, and surely no one would challenge their experience in the outdoors.

http://www.nytimes.com/1992/02/22/world/man-in-glacier-is-dated-to-stone-age.html?pagewanted=1

I feel bad when a kindred spirit passes, even if it turns out to his own fault.
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The man got the powr but the byrd got the wyng

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#197238 - 03/04/10 10:44 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: Byrd_Huntr]
Hookpunch Offline
Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 128
I understand cold weather camping where you are fully equipped with gear, communication devices and so on...but putting yourself into a survival situation purposely if that is what he did is just insane.

As Stroud says in his book, there is nothing romantic about being in a survival situation, all you want to do is go home.

Even on Survivorman he takes a beacon and has a rescue team on stand by.

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#197239 - 03/04/10 10:53 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: Eugene]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078
Hmm, not really the sharpest tool in the box, he even left his get out of dodge ticket with his 86 year old landlady. eek



Edited by Am_Fear_Liath_Mor (03/04/10 10:53 PM)

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#197243 - 03/04/10 11:09 PM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: dougwalkabout]
NobodySpecial Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 197
Originally Posted By: dougwalkabout
I hope the weak-minded in the media won't beat up Stroud just to get cheap headlines.

That was my thoughts, compared to the silly jumping out of aircraft guy, Mr Stroud always seems to be a walking advert for never leaving Tim Hortons!


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#197259 - 03/05/10 12:57 AM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: MostlyHarmless]
Mac Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 02/24/10
Posts: 77
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: MostlyHarmless

On the plus side, he died doing something he really loved. He did not expose others to foolish risks.


No?

Only all the people that had to risk there own lives to go find him. I wouldn't kick a bear in the junk unless I expected to get mauled, and I wouldn't venture into the Canadian wilderness in winter unprepared unless I expected to freeze to death.

Only an idiot does what he did.
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I'm here to enquire about your spoons - Salad fingers

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#197262 - 03/05/10 02:09 AM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: Mac]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
Originally Posted By: Mac


Only an idiot does what he did.


Pretty harsh. It's always easy to make the right call after the fact.

It might be worthwhile to get the autopsy results, as others here have pointed out, before rendering judgment.
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#197263 - 03/05/10 02:13 AM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor]
widget Offline
Addict

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 550
An old survival instructor once told a group of us, "Never put yourself willingly into a survival situation". That truly makes sense and I have always remembered that statement. Learn the skills, practice the science and do so in a controlled situation.

While it is wise to learn primitive fire making, living off the land skills, shelter building and so on, you should practice those skills in a controlled environment. Take camping gear and practice survival skills safely. Never count completely on surviving with minimums, some of the best would fail in certain conditions. In Desert Storm an entire small SAS team died of hypothermia in Iraq. Strong, fit and well trained soldiers. No one is immune to weather and/or circumstances.

I really hate to see Les Stroud getting negative press over this persons lack of respect for the wilderness. I believe Les has always stressed safety, training and experience as a critical element of his survival portrayal on the Survivorman series.

On the other hand Bear Grylls makes taking risks seem "normal" for surviving the wilderness and it amazes me more people have not been hurt or killed trying to emulate his antics. Maybe they spend night in a local resort just like Bear does!

Sorry to hear about Mr. Code. He was doing something he loved, perhaps not the right way but he was trying and probably gave it his best shot. Keep in mind, not everyone can afford a bunch of the somewhat expensive survival training, which may drive him or her into risks while trying their self-learned skills. Just practice in a safer area, with more backup equipment and preferably not alone!
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No, I am not Bear Grylls, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night and Bear was there too!

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#197266 - 03/05/10 02:45 AM Re: Attempted "Survivorman" found dead [Re: hikermor]
Mac Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 02/24/10
Posts: 77
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: hikermor

Pretty harsh. It's always easy to make the right call after the fact.

It might be worthwhile to get the autopsy results, as others here have pointed out, before rendering judgment.


It's a harsh world.

And truth be told, it's real easy to make the right call before the fact as well. It's call being prepared. Would you travel into the desert without water and wonder why someone called you an idiot after they found you dead from dehydration? I spend as much time out of doors as the next guy. I alway carry a healthy respect for mother nature with me however.

If you go looking for trouble don't be surprised when it finds you.


Edited by Mac (03/05/10 02:58 AM)
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