As I said, my experience, your mileage may vary. Better than nothing, almost anything is better, but nothing's as small and well packaged that I have found.<br><br>Doug Ritter<br>Editor<br>Equipped To Survive

Jeffery,<br><br>Well, perhaps I have a vivid imagination? :-)<br><br>I cannot argue that what comes in the standard U.S. pilot's survival kit is deficient in many respects, or at least not as good as it might be. I've answered a lot of emails relating to this subject the last few weeks, mostly with nothing more than pointers to information on this site. It's not hard, nor particularly expensive to improve upon the standard survival vest. But that's a lot more equipment than I choose to carry on my person as last chance gear. Then again, I'm not going into combat in Afghanistan .<br><br>Mini-kits come under the heading of much better than nothing. A nice to have luxury that can buy you some piece of mind, comfort and convenience and save some energy. Nobody, least of all me, has suggested they are "THE ANSWER." They are one solution; one I just happen to like for lots of reasons including they are fun to develop. <br><br>Condoms are one answer to water storage. Just because I include one doesn't mean you or anyone else has to, or that you or anyone else has to carry a mini-kit. It serves a purpose for me, but it's hardly perfect.<br><br>While I have never personally done the deed with only my kit, each of the components of my kit has been tested and does more or less what it's supposed to do. I'll survive quite nicely in most circumstances, thank you, with what is in it along with my other don't-leave-home'without-it gear.<br><br>I do know USAF survival instructors who have done very nicely with a far worse mil-spec "parachute" kit." But then they would have done OK with nothing but their knife. <br><br>You pay's your money and takes your chances. This is a place to exchange ideas and experiences, each of us has to decide what works for us. My kit works for me.<br><br>Doug Ritter<br>Editor<br>Equipped To Survive

Beachdoc, Ebay has seen a few on auction. White sealed reflective plastic in a OD sack? Contains; water flask, mag bar, S/S/ pocket utility knife, suunnto compass,TRA-CON fishing kit, wire saw, brass snare wire, water tablets, signal mirror, space blanket and a few other items. They're selling @ approx. $75 which is way below individual cost Not the best assembly, but the price value is a good jump start to better things.<br><br>

your right. I just make like Gunga Din when I go anywhere ( He was regimental waterboy in a Kipling poem and became a hero. I assume, being properly hydrated among "mad dogs and Englishmen who go out in the mid day sun", he kept his head )<br><br>

I know the poem well... "you're a better man than I am...". I confess I have trouble divorcing the memory from Cary Grant's (Archibald Leach's) voice...<br><br>This discussion has gotten a little more heated than I intended, and more than I think is warranted by the subject. Not that any one individual has crossed a line, just that the sum total of what's been said seems to have people choosing sides, and that certainly wasn't the intent of any of my posts.<br><br>I'll be the first to admit that I haven't tried to use a condom at all for water storage, much less in a wilderness environment. Perhaps it distends more easily than I had envisioned, perhaps it unties more easily as well. Doug seems to have experimented with it to at least some degree; I have not, at all.<br><br>On the other hand, there have been some new alternatives proposed here, especially in billvann's post. I respectfully suggest that we all try to stay open to new alternatives. We're all interested in the best options available, not just in proving pet theories, are we not?<br><br><br>

I had a " pet theory" once. It got run over by a car named reality. I figure just about every philosophy, gear preference and acumulated experience represented by our forum members would " soldier through" a real situation. <br><br>

>>We're all interested in the best options available, not just in proving pet theories, are we not?<<<br><br>And that, my friends, is the bottom line. Two points made. One is that "best options" is plural. There is often more than one way to skin a cat. The other is that the great thing about this place is that we get a diverse sample of views and experiences and we can all learn from that. None of has all the answers and anyone can come up with a great idea. In my experience some of the best ideas come from out in left field based on experience having not a thing to do with survival, per se, such as some of the novel and new ideas presented in this thread. The exchange of ideas is what this is all about. It's what makes this community so valuable...and fun!<br><br>I'm off to northern Arizona for a couple days of R&R...and perhaps a wee bit of equipment testing. :-) Have a great weekend, everyone!<br><br>Doug Ritter<br>Editor<br>Equipped To Survive

My son and I pack two multi-purpose cooking bags (10"x16") they come with very compact plastic tie clips. We experimented with sandwich and freezer bags but they both tended to leak at the perforations - these cooking bags do not come on a roll so that is not an issue. The bags are tough and seal well with the provided clips.<br><br>We carefully fold them into a very compact package, held small by winding nylon cord around them.<br><br>Although if I ever have to use my mini kit I hope to have my pocket carry and my canteen with me.<br><br>Clive<br><br><br>

Hey PRESUMEDLOST...<br><br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>I just recently ordered some “3-pint pilot’s survival water bags”, apparently Desert Storm vintage (unissued) they look to be the most compact containers I’ve seen other than balloons and condoms, the material looks like something like IV bag stuff, with a neck having a zip lock closure. I think these will be flatter/smaller than the Platypus bags, but I’m not optimistic that even they’ll store small enough for the smallest kits.<p><hr></blockquote><p>...would you please tell me where you found them and how I might find some? I have looked locally and on the web, and have never found any mention of them even, except here on Doug's site.<br><br>Thanks.<br><br>Stay safe,<br>J.T.

Jet,<br><br>Wish I could point you to a stable source, but I just happened upon them on eBay. The search I was using was probably something like “water surviv* -kni*” (without the quotes). As Chris says, you have to filter out the hundreds of ads for $15 “Rambo” knives, and take pity on the souls who think their survival is worth $15.<br><br>It was a Dutch auction for 6 of the bags, I bid on 6 and someone else outbid me on 1, the seller obligingly coughed up an extra to meet the demand, so I suppose it’s possible that they have one or two more. I haven’t received mine yet.<br><br>The seller’s eBay ID is “hardcorps”, no web site listed, but the contact I was given to arrange payment was emshazmat1@aol.com. Discouragingly, though, part of their eBay listing reads “We do our sales ONLY through EBAY auctions and at Local Militaria/Gunshows in the Texas Area. DIRECT mail order sales have been DISCONTINUED”. I should have downloaded the picture, but it disappeared FAST after the auction. <br><br>Chris seems to indicate in his post that they show up from time to time, but I hadn’t seen them before.<br><br>Hope this is some help…<br><br><br>