Just got back from Costco. I noticed that they seem to be carrying more survival type stuff (at least at the Arundle Mills (Maryland) location). They have the new Dorcy Spyder lights; a 15+2 pack of glow sticks for like 12 bucks; roadside emergency kit; and what looked to be a fairly well stocked first aid kit. I'm going to go back with some more money next time and look at them more carefully, and maybe even buy some stuff, or at least get some specs to get your opinion on.

-Chris

Our local Costco (Fredericksburg VA) has had Xantrex 1000W inverters for sale for about $65. Xantrex bought Trace, which was the top of the line company in inverters.

Grab a 120 amp-hour deep cycle marine battery from Wally-World and some #2 or #4 battery cables, and you're all set for some alternate energy.

I fired mine up tonight when bad thunderstorms rolled through. I hooked up the kids' PS2 and 13-inch color TV, and my laptop so I could continue surfing uninterrupted and without fear of frying my computer.

Hi
One small point. I have heard you computer is just as likley to get fried in a thunderstorm through your phone line. At least that is what I've been told from a salesman at a local electrical store.
Your best bet is probably not to go on line at all.
Joblot

Hi
Further to my last post, my surge protector even has a special plug for my phone line...point proved?
joblot

>>>>Your best bet is probably not to go on line at all.

What? Heresy! <img src="images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

>>>>Further to my last post, my surge protector even has a special plug for my phone line...point proved?

Uhhh…not really. I’ve never seen a surge protector that *didn’t* have a phone line port. Unfortunately, in the US, almost every one of those cheaper protectors is just a souped-up extension cord. Your mileage may vary in Scotland.

Lightning can do nasty things to anything that’s plugged into the wall, or even individual parts of an appliance that is plugged in.

I do have a great surge protector – it’s a Newpoint (http://www.newpoint.com) that actually grounds all three wires and not just one. IIRC, in the US, most of the cheaper ones only ground one wire, but there are three going into your computer. The protector needs to have grounding to ALL THREE wires. These units are more expensive but well worth the money to ensure that your computer and house don’t burn down.

And BTW, I have a cable modem, so there are no phone lines involved. Point proved? <img src="images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

hi there
I concede to the higher authority, when it comes to surge protectors.
However, rather than test the equipment, I will still be unpluging during a storm, if only for peace of mind. I too have a broadband connection.
joblot

Thanks for the heads up on the Dorcy Spyder lights at Costco, I have been waiting several months for the Frederick store to have them in stock. I guess I will check tonight to see if they have received their supply. Pete

Mamabear2,

How long are you able to run the PS2, tv, and computer off the battery? I was thinking of setting up a system like that coupled with a battery tender to make sure it's always ready. I figured it'd be a good addition to the generator. A battery system could power stuff upstairs a lot easier than the generator can.

I'm thinking I'd want to run a 25 watt tv, a 20 watt fluorecent light, and a fan (don't remember watts). It'd be great if I could get three or so hours out of battery with this load.

-Blast

>>>>>>> I'm thinking I'd want to run a 25 watt tv, a 20 watt fluorecent light, and a fan (don't remember watts). It'd be great if I could get three or so hours out of battery with this load.
***************************************************************************
Good questions…first, some disclaimers. Hopefully all my math is correct and coherently organized. If not, feel free to point it out. I’m no electrical expert or math whiz by any stretch of the imagination. To me it's still PFM how the light comes on when you throw a switch. <img src="images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

The short answer is approximately 4 hours and 15 minutes.

Here's how to figure it out for any configuration:

Assume you’re using a 12-volt, 115-amp-hour, deep-cycle marine trolling battery (about $65 from Wally World) to supply DC power to the inverter, which converts it to AC power for your TV, fan, PS2, and light.

A device that uses 1 amp per hour will in theory deplete your battery in 115 hours. An inverter/battery powering a 5-amp device would last in theory 23 hours (115 ÷ 5 = 23); 25 amps would be 4.6 hours. Notice all the in theory disclaimers? Using an inverter causes a power loss of some amount. Most experts quote a 10-20% reduction in the run time. Just be aware that you aren’t going to get that 115 hours of battery use if you’re running an inverter.

If you have all DC appliances and can run them directly off your marine battery, then that power loss won’t be quite so bad. But if you’re like me, you don’t happen to have a 12V DC fan lying around (I should, they’re pretty cheap - under $10)

So, you wanna hook up your PS2, a 25W (watt) TV, a 20W light, and a fan. As long as you have a good-sized inverter, you could throw caution to the wind, plug everything in, and see if it all works or if your inverter just vaporized itself….not recommended unless you have a 2000 watt inverter (or higher)!

So get a piece of paper & a pen, and check out the specs label on each electrical device you want to run. Write it down 'cause you'll forget it. Some will have the watts listed…others will have only the amps. It doesn’t matter ‘cause we have the (easy) math to figure it out.

Convert everything into one unit, preferably watts.

My little floor fan only lists .9 Amps, but I want to know the wattage it uses.

The basic formula is Volts x Amps = Watts.

So 120V x .9A = 108W for the fan using AC power (we’ll figure in the DC part in a sec).

108W (fan) + 79W (PS2) + 25W (TV) + 20W (light) = 232W total.

At the very least you’ll need a 500W inverter (about $45 or so). Double the needed watts for the start surge, and you’ll know how big an inverter to use – at a minimum.

(BTW, it’s more efficient to run a 500W inverter for a 232W draw than a 1000W inverter, but I wouldn’t sweat bullets over it.)

Now, to figure out how long your 115 amp-hour marine battery will power your goodies before needing a recharge:

remember V x A = W?? We’ve got volts (12 -- remember, it’s a 12 Volt DC battery), we’ve got watts (232), so just jiggle the formula around to solve for amps: W ÷ V = A.

232 watts ÷ 12 volts = 19.3333 amps. Be conservative and round up to 20.

The battery is in theory a 115 amp-hour battery, so:

115 amp-hours ÷ 20 amps = 5.75 hours of battery life.

BUT, don’t forget the inefficiency penalty for using an inverter. I’d knock off about 1.5 hours, just to be safe. So you can figure about 4 hours and 15 minutes (4.25 hours) of battery time.

After I got hooked on battery power, I walked around the house & garage and made a list of all the devices I might possibly want to use. The first thing to go was my hair dryer --1500 watts, a real hog!! <img src="images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <sigh> What price beauty……

If you need more battery time and your inverter can handle it, get another marine battery and hook them up in parallel. Then instead of only having 115 amp-hours, you’d have 230 amp-hours (in theory, again, don’t forget the slight energy loss) to use up.

Just to beat a dead horse even more, I’m a big fan of inverters & batteries. Do you already have a generator? I decided against getting one because it’s a gas hog (4-5 gallons/day IIRC) and extremely noisy. The noise aspect bothers me the most. First-hand accounts (I think on ETS as well as other sites) of long-term power outages quoted many survivors as saying they had to sit up day & night with a shotgun to ward off burglars. People drove around neighborhoods in Homestead, FL, after Hurricane Andrew looking for gennys to steal. Pretty ugly. However, if someone gave me a Honda genny, I sure wouldn’t turn it down <img src="images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Battery power is quiet, clean, cheap, and reliable. My next goal is to get some solar panels for trickle-charging the batteries.

Sorry this is so long – hope it starts to answer your questions.

(PS) On reading this before posting, I see that you weren't asking about using a PS2 or Nintendo in the equation, but I'm too lazy to rework all the math. <img src="images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Mamabear2,

I think I'm in love. <img src="images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
That was exactly the sort of answer I needed because it taught me how to calculate this rather than just telling me the answer. I really appreciate that.

I've already gone through the house calculating wattages for stuff, so I know hom many watts I'll be drawing, but I couldn't figure out how the amp-hours rating on the battery played into this.

As for the generator, I've worked out a deal with several neighbors where we'll shift it from house to house to power the fridge/freezers/etc. One is a cop, one is an avid hunter, and the third is ex-military. And me, well, I'm the chemist everyone calls "Blast" . My 4th of July parties are legendary. Between the four of us the generator is well guarded. We live in an area prone to hurricanes with power outages ranging from hours to days. I actually plan on using the generator mainly to recharge the deep cycle battery(s) so that I'll have useful power inside the house at night. I'll have a small tv and a fan all night long, but it looks like the margarita machine will sit idle. <img src="images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

-Blast

p.s. Freaky timing! A co-worker just showed me a gas-powered blender in today's Wall Street Journal! God bless America!