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#178041 - 07/29/09 05:04 PM Water Debate. Can it go bad?
Horus Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 07/29/09
Posts: 53
Loc: MA
Okay, here's another one. I was at a disaster prep meeting that my local town hosted this afternoon. Not particularly helpful, but the person from the health department started talking about water going bad, and when I pressed her on it, she basically punted.

So, let's say I've got clean water I store in a 50-gallon barrel. I've got 2, actually. They're in my basement. Can this water "go bad"? The basement can get a bit damp in the summer, but I run a dehumidfier. If it still looks clean and smells clean, how long can I store it before changing it out? 1 year? 5 years?

What about water in the 1-gallon jugs you buy at the store?

Thoughts?

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#178050 - 07/29/09 05:38 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: ]
NobodySpecial Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 197
Tap water does contains some bacteria, the water treatment plant puts in just enough anti-bacterial agent that the water is going to be within their specification only for the time it takes to get to your tap. They aim to put the minimum amount of treatment agent in because it costs money and people don't like it.

Bottled water is generally just tap water filtered to remove some minerals, it's not generally treated to remove any more bacteria and the extra handling steps could introduce more.
On the other hand it is sealed in a reasonably clean factory - unlike you filling a 50 gallon drum with a hose pipe and your dirty hands. Gallon jug bottles of water are also easier to handle and are consumed faster when opened than a 50Gal drum.

The advice used to be to add 1/2 teaspoon/5 gallon of chlorine bleach to stored water. Probably can't do any harm.

After a few years the stored tap water might have some bugs in it, but it isn't likely to suddenly contain cholera, polio, typhoid or a bunch of parasites so it's still better than the water supply for most of the world.


Edited by NobodySpecial (07/30/09 02:06 PM)

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#178060 - 07/29/09 06:16 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: NobodySpecial]
GoatMan Offline
Member

Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 119
I have one of those blue 50 gallon drums with water in it. In my last place I kept it in my garage up on blocks, to keep it away from the concrete floor. I had it stored there for 8-9 years without changing it. When we filled it up initially with a garden hose, we included 1 cup of bleach. That was the amount we had heard at the time and it seems like a bit much. But when it came time to move, I had to siphon it out. It didn't taste the best but I didn't get sick either. I suspect if it was oxigenated by pooring it back and fourth, it would help quite a bit. I also have drink mix for this purpose.

I don't know if I would leave it forever, but I personally don't think 5-10 years is a big deal if your source is reasonably clean, your storage container is sanitized, and you add some bleach.

My .02.

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#178064 - 07/29/09 06:34 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: GoatMan]
Horus Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 07/29/09
Posts: 53
Loc: MA
Nobody Special had the right amounts for chlorine to water. 1 tsp per 10 gallons. Just found this link.

http://www.doh.wa.gov/phepr/handbook/purify.htm
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#178068 - 07/29/09 07:28 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: NightHiker]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
If city water is used and properly stored in an air tight container it will not "go bad". It will however over time go "flat". Before drinking if you want it to taste more normal shake it up in a bottle and then poor and enjoy.

Well water on the other hand may taste weird or different but it still won't go bad... this is all dependent upon the type of water coming from your well, if it's filtered, hardened, softened, etc, etc.

Also, keep in mind you can just boil the water if you think it may have gone "bad"...
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#178071 - 07/29/09 07:54 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: Todd W]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
The only way I know of to sterilize/decontaminate water and store it thus indefinitely is to use a reflux distillation process and drain the condensed water directly into sterilized/decontaminated glass containers. Done right, the distilled water can be stored indefinitely (or at least till the glass bottle wears out, let's say a practical limit of 500 years). The whole distillation/bottling process would need to be hermetically sealed.

Another way to store water indefinitely would be to freeze it. It won't eliminate pre-existing contaminants, but if you freeze it and put it in a sealed container, it should stay viable for a very long time.
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The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#178080 - 07/29/09 08:39 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: benjammin]
GoatRider Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 835
Loc: Maple Grove, MN
I store rain water in the basement for my house plants and Bonsai. In the winter I use that water for house plants, but in the summer it's a backup to the outdoor one under a down-spout. It gets stinky after awhile so I'd change it out periodically. But recently I got the idea to try putting an aquarium filter in it. It works like a champ, the water stays fresh all winter. It has an aerating capability too, if I set it at just the right height it will suck air from the surface and blow bubbles. I wouldn't feel bad about using that as drinking water in a pinch.
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#178091 - 07/29/09 09:57 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: GoatRider]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
When people speak of storing water and having it 'go bad', all we're talking about is bacterial growth, right? I am assuming that if the water was good to drink when it was put into storage, other contaminants were eliminated before storage.

It seems that if you are using municipal water, you should be able to ask for a copy of the test results. I belong to a local water association which mails out the test results twice a year. This is a pretty complete test, not just bacteria.

If you are using well water, it would probably be a good idea to get a full test done occasionally. It isn't cheap, but it would be good to know. It might also be useful to find out what kind of water source you're tapped into. I guess sometimes it's a true aquifer, and sometimes it's just groundwater. Contamination with manure nitrates and farm and industrial chemicals are more likely with some than others. And don't forget all the lawn and yard chemicals that are transported into your water supply. Not to mention dumped petroleum products, flushed medications, and a host of other contaminants.

It would be interesting to store your water for ten years or so, and open a bottle every year and have it tested for bacteria (it's usually about $10 around here). Of course, if you ran into problems early on, you would know not to try to store it past that point.

Exposure to elevated temperatures might also affect bacterial counts.


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#178097 - 07/29/09 10:31 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: Susan]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
We are going to have our well water re-tested.
We are doing one outside @ the well and one inside the house.

I want to see if the pipes corroding are doing anything to my water too. Keep that in mind depending where you fill up on any system... old systems may put lead in the water.
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#178109 - 07/29/09 11:47 PM Re: Water Debate. Can it go bad? [Re: Susan]
NobodySpecial Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 197
Originally Posted By: Susan
I am assuming that if the water was good to drink when it was put into storage, other contaminants were eliminated before storage.

They aren't eliminated they are just reduced to an acceptable level. The treatment plant looks at how much bacteria there are in the water and reduces them to a percentage where it would take say 30days for the survivors to increase to a level that exceeds their specifications (which still isn't necessarily dangerous) if they think that it takes less than 30 days for the water in their pipes to reach the consumer and be used - it is safe.

The bacteria load in stored water will depend on the number of bacteria left after the treatment process, the temperature (which affects their reproduction rate) the level of nutrients in the water (for them to feed on) and any toxins (either from the original treatment or that you have added).

The most likely source of bacteria in stored water is contamination from you handling and filling it.





Edited by NobodySpecial (07/29/09 11:48 PM)

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