Well, as much as I'd like to relate a gripping tale of adventure regarding the failure of my little Benchmade, this is going to be more of a cautionary tale preached to the choir.

To make a short story long:

I bought a regular (non-Ritter) Mini-Grip about ten months ago, give or take. It's been used mostly for small day to day cutting chores. It hasn't done anything that would stress even a cheap paring knife.

The day before yesterday, I was sitting at my desk, and tried to close the knife after using it to cut a loose thread on my shirt. When I pulled back on the release lever, I heard my spring go "sproing!" and watched the blade kind of flop down in defeat. Closer examination revealed . . . nothing. As far as I can see, the spring is enclosed between the handle scale and the liner on one side. (I could be wrong, but that's the best I could estimate based on diagrams online and eyeballing my knife.)So, I don't know whether the spring broke or (more likely) just jumped off of where it was supposed to be set in on the side away from the lever. (It's still contacting the lever.)

Anyway, Benchmade said send it on in for a new spring, no problemo. They answered the phone quickly and were very nice. I'm dropping it off in the mail Monday and expect the whole transaction to go smoothly with the repair.

Now, the reason I bring this up isn't an indictment of the knife. I LOVE this knife. I like the Axis lock system. However, after less than a year of very light use, the one weakness of the system that I'd been a little worried about when buying it cropped up: Namely, the spring. The fact is, the more parts something has, the more possible points of failure it has. In this case, it was the spring.

Of course, we all know a fixed blade is best for field use for this very reason. However, we don't all always carry a fixed blade with us. For example, a short day hike in an area where knife laws or social constraints (i.e., not freaking out non-knife aware people) indicate a more discrete option.

My take away from this:

1. Even high quality folding knives can fail for no apparent reason. (And having had some higher end folders worth more than four times the mini-grip's going price, I'm calling the mini-grip high quality.)

2. If you're going to stick with folders, carry two. Or more.

As I said, this is all preaching to the choir, but...I'd have NEVER thought that little Benchmade would fail like that. Sure, I carry several folders (SAK, multitool, the one locking blade) anyway, but that was a pretty good wake up call that feces does, indeed, occur.

There seems to be a rule in tool engineering that the probability of failure increases as the square of the number of moving parts a tool has.
(and that is just how it is.)
__________
I have had some gear fail but to carry a spare of everything that might possibly fail would be too much.
The result is that I carry spares of what is likely to fail and that varies depending on how critical having the item is, and how easy replacements are to get.
If I am heading into the bush for a month I will likely have at least two belt knives with me plus a folder.(Plus saw and axe)

If I am going for a walk downtown one small pocket knife like the Swiss Army soldier is enough knife for me to carry.

The good news is that if the spring breaks and you REALLY need to use the knife, I think you could cut down a small spike of wood (with the floppy blade) just large enough to jam into the lock release hole. Jaming it behind the knob should hold the lock fairly well. Getting the spike back out could be a different story.

Hm, that is pretty unfortunate. Defects do happen now and then but a quality folder should not fail just like that, not once having been put to any heavy-duty task. Mechanically, the Axis lock (and many other more "high-tech" locks) is fairly complex and thus prone to failure. It might be a one-in-a-million chance but the bottom line is, had it happened out in the bush you might be in serious trouble unless you carried a backup.

This just confirms my own experience - do not rely on anything mechanically too complicated. As far as folders go, I prefer lockbacks for that very reason. I've had a liner lock fail before and I don't trust any of the fancier locks either. The simpler, the better.

BTW, I virtually never hike anywhere without a fixed blade. If a belt knife is not socially acceptable I carry it in my backpack and use my folder for daily tasks. But I know I'll always have at least a Mora in my pack. Not only is it compact, light and ergonomically far better than any folding knife, I know it will reliably handle any task I can possibly imagine in the woods if I ever find myself in an emergency.

Curious. One of the reasons that the Griptilian (and RSK Mk1) have TWO springs is so that if one fails, there is a back-up. With only one spring, the lock will still function. Your description suggests a prior failure of the other spring.

FWIW, the failure rate of the Axis lock spring is incredibly low, based on Benchmade warranty returns, but not zero. I have not personally witnessed a failure, nor have any of my close associates and we have certainly abused the knives. <g> To test out the redundancy, I had to remove the spring(s).

BTW, in an emergency, the lock will still function even without the spring by jambing the Axis locking bar forward in the slot with the blade open and either holding it there or sticking something in the slot to prevent it from unlocking. A small twig or piece of wood will suffice. This contrasts with many common folder locking mechanisms which cannot be jury-rigged to lock if they fail.

Any mechanical system with moving parts will fail. How it fails and what you can do about it is one of the issues one has to consider.

Having a second knife is always a good idea, even if it's a fixed blade. Any knife can be broken. BTDT!

I'm planning to get me a mini-griptillian this week for EDC. I've had the full-sized one in my hiking-bag and used it for years without any problems.

Sorry to hear your troubles, Benchmade will fix it right up, they have great customer service!

@Doug: I didn't know it had two springs. I can only see one on a side. You and Ken both make a good point about being able to jam something behind the bar to keep the lock engaged!

@Izzy: I open it with the thumb stud. Haven't been much on stressing knives with flicking them open since I was a kid.

@Tom_L: Good point about packing the fixed. I don't usually take a pack on dayhikes, though. So, when walking in the state park near my home, I wouldn't be carrying a fixed blade, for example. (Carrying a fixed blade in a pack is generally OK. Carrying a fixed blade concealed on your person can be a no-no, depending on local laws.)

Anyway, I'm sure this was just an aberration, and I know Benchmade will fix it up. I just thought it'd be a good reminder that a little redundancy is helpful. =)

Izzy, if you're not using it, I'll take it

Brian, I've never seen it fail either. I've had mine since '03, and it's been back to BM at least twice to be tuned-up ($5 and a note is all it takes, see their website). Maybe that's why mine hasn't failed? Anyway, even if it isn't, that IS pretty weird that yours did, being so young. I didn't see you mention it, but did the knife still "work?" Could it still open/close, being off-center?

i bought mine Mini-Grip 6 months ago and thing happened.
just sent it back 2 days ago still unsure of cost i will be to repair.

I have a mini grip where both springs blew on mine after about 4-5 months of use... It was a pocket carry and really was a daily user for misc things. Emailed BM, and got two springs sent to me via USPS since I'm out of country (easier then trying to send the knife to the status for repair then send it back where i'd probably get charged duty again).

I was thinking of contacting them and getting a few more springs and keep them in my EDC bag for when they blow again (its not 'if' but rather 'when'). I wonder what the cost would be since it wouldn't be a 'warranty repair'?

btw: its a very easy repair and can even be done in the wilderness if you have the right torx bit.

It's not really off center. It opens and closes fine, just lacks the spring action. I'm sure that I could do the insert a twig trick easily with it.

@Izzy: What blade steel is yours? I've got the 154CM, and I'm pretty impressed with the ability to hold an edge. That said it's not the best edge, and I think the Ritter grips probably have a lot better blade profile, but for general purpose use, it's good enough.

True, early Grips were 440C.

I've got around 50 Benchmade knives in my collection, but a Grip isn't one of them. Something about them always put me off. I don't want to say that they feel cheap, because that isn't really it. It's more along the lines of, they just don't feel solid/dependable, even if they are. I think it has to do with the hollow FRN handle scales and short axis module (instead of full liners).

Instead of the mini-grip, I much prefer the 705/707 series, as well as the 525 mini-Presidio. Sure, they're significantly more expensive, but they've got a much more substantial feel to them that inspires confidence. For a blade of that size they're pretty overbuilt, but not to the point that would make it a useless sharpened pry-bar.

As someone that has carried a 705 since they came out in a 154cm blade, I have to say I'm very happy with it. Many years of daily pocket carry without ever an issue. I know the Grip series is popular, but they just aren't for me.

Hi Kris -- Speak for yerself! ;-)

I've taken apart my Grips, and found why Benchmade doesn't want you doing it. In general, I found it a PITA to get it back together, but not impossible either.

I've seen reports on knifeforums everywhere from "I don't know what you were smoking, it is a breeze to put back together." to "I gave up. I couldn't get it back together.".

Oh, and the bit is kind of hard to find. I ended up just ordering the kit from Benchmade.

From what I hear, spring failure is rare, but not unheard of. As Doug points out, you can improvise in a pinch.

-john

All you need to fully disassemble and reassemble a Grip is a T6 and T10 torx drivers available at any WalMart or Hardware store.

Takes about 15 minutes.

At one time I liked the way the mini-Grips looked. I handled one in a store and just didn't care for the axis lock very much. Personal preference I guess. I didn't even think about the mechanism inside (little springs) at the time, but hearing about that now makes me feel better about not buying that mini-Grip. I got a Spyderco lockback instead. I've always wondered if the mini-Grip might have been a good choice too, since so many people seem to like them. But that "little springs" thing gives me pause...

I'm not mechanically inclined by any means and I had it completed in about 10-15 mins... trying to remember what the tedious part of it (i think it was keeping the springs in the right spot while getting the scales on with the blade in place)... heck, I'll take it apart tonight when i have some time and try to remember the process (i'm sure there's a youtube video about it!).

I do remember it wasn't difficult and was surprised.

See what I mean? :-)

-john

I didn't check Walmart, but no other hardware store around here (Seattle burbs) carried something as small as a T6.

-john

Everything is a trade off. While there are springs, they aren't a direct load bearing part of the mechanism, and as Doug points out, there are redundant springs, and if it really came down to it, you can lodge something in the mechanism.

The upside is a very ambi, and more importantly, one-handed ambi friendly knife with a very strong mechanism.

My previous EDC was a Sebbie, and the ultra simplistic, titanium framelock certainly is a rugged mechanism (albeit hollow ground blade).

But... One day someone on the forums was talking about being injured and needing to use his knife off-handed and one handed.

I decided to try it out. While I can use the Sebbie effectively one handed... off-handed and one handed... um, notsomuch. In fact, it is downright difficult to use in this mode.

I figured in an emergency, this is a significant handicap.

My current EDC is a full sized DR M2 Grip, and I'm very happy with it. Not as cool as the Sebbie, but very well rounded.

Of course, a backup is a good idea anyway, and I suppose you could carry a lefty and a righty.

In the end, we are lucky we have the choices we do and one choice certainly isn't for everyone. But I've started to think about all survival my tools and how effectively I could use them one handed, and off handed. Interesting the things that crop up.

-john

None of mine wobble. IIRC, they use either blue or red loctite to make sure it stays tight from the factory, but even on the ones I've taken apart and put back together without it, I've never had any problems with it moving around. In fact, all the benchmade thumbstuds I've taken apart are specifically milled to slot into the hole in the blade so they don't move around.

I've found Spyderco's and Byrd's (a less expensive subsidiary of Spyderco) to be equally as easy to use right or left handed. They have holes rather than studs for opening, thus ambidextrous. They are lockbacks, so inherently ambidextrous to close as well, although I'd never try to close a lockback one-handed myself. I don't like closing any folder one-handed for that matter.

I'm sure the mini-Grips are fine knives too. But just in this short thread I see there are a couple of people who have had trouble with them. So the problems can't be that rare if they've been seen more than once in such a small sample of people.

How do you find the M2 for EDC re corrosion issues? I have M2 RSK, but EDC an S30V RSK.

If you have a Sears nearby, check there, I got mine (Craftsman) there. About $3.00 bucks.

So far, no problems. But I do managed to get dunked, I'll dry 'er off when I get home.

The M2 RSK does have a coating (although mine is plenty scuffed up) which offers some protection, but it doesn't seem overly inclined to rust anyway.

YMMV.

-john


then now

I should have thought of that. Thanks.

-john

Yes, there are plenty of fine choices out there.



After hanging out on knifeforums for a while, it was my impression that it is fairly rare, but YMMV.

-john

Interesting the weak hand problems with the sebbie. Of course, you could get a double thumb lug, but I don't worry too much, as it's clipped on my right front pocket, which I can't even reach with my left hand

I carried thumbhole knives (a chimera) and a few ambi disk knives, and like them. I don't really worry about ambi closing of the knife

Like Haertig I EDC a Spyderco lockback. It is an "Waved" Endura 4 that I carry on my left (off) side. If in a hurry I open it using the Wave feature, if not I use the thumb-hole or 2-hands. It is possible to close it one-handed but you have to be careful.

Mike

Stoneway Hardware (around 43rd) has just about every fastener tool imaginable. The Torex bit should be easy to find there.

It is sort of out of the way for me but maybe it will help someone else.

Thanks,

-john

Just got the knife back today, fully repaired, nice and tight, and shaving sharp. Solid service from Benchmade. BTW, I forgot if I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but I looked for the receipt for a couple of days and couldn't find it. I called the repair center and they told me to just send it along anyway. Nice folks.

Try the Husky 8 in 1 tool, it is quite nice, they make a Torx version, and another version that is slotted and phillips....

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stor...1&langId=-1

Axis cannot be beat, I love Spyderco, but I really love my Rukus....

Luckily I have had no spring failures.

Marion

Sad day... my beloved Min-grip has sprung its springs again.

Just under six months of daily carry since sending it in, opening it with the thumb stud, no flicking, and only using it to open mail, cut cardboard (did a LOT of that last month when we moved), and other light duty chores.

I'm becoming convinced of two things:

1. The springs being used -- in this model at least -- are of not good enough for job.

2. As with all things mechanical, the less moving parts the better.

On the other hand, I tested Doug's advice about putting something behind the crossbolt to hold it forward. I took the bit of rawhide off my hiking stick and threaded it through, then wrapped it a bit, and it provides a pretty solid lockup, as well as a bit more grip.

It sounds like there is something wrong with your grip if it's going through springs like that.

I've got multiple Benchmades axis knives, a few I've been using very hard for years, and never once have I had an omega spring problem.

In fact, my EDC is a 707 that I've had since that model came out (2005). I open and close it pretty much daily, multiple times, as a nervous habit and I still haven't killed a spring in it yet. I've even gone swimming in the ocean with it a few times without issue.

The knife seems to be well-fitted as far as I can tell. I haven't taken it apart, but from what I can see there aren't any signs of unusual wear. It could be there's a rough spot or something that's not visible causing spring wear on the inside. I'd have thought they'd catch anything like that the first time through, though. I'll ask them to investigate that angle. If the springs fail again, I'm going to request a replacement knife instead of a repair.

Honestly, I'd suggest asking them for a replacement, explain your situation, and offer to let them keep it/inspect it for QA purposes.

I too have had a MiniGrip since '03 without problems. For a long time it was my main EDC; the only reason it isn't now is that I have a kershaw leek spring-assist that I love. But the MiniGrip is still my go-to for any outdoor activity. It's a solid instrument.

Good luck getting it sorted; keep us posted on progress please!

I talked to them a few minutes ago. The guy I spoke to said he's seen a lot of axis lock knives come in in all kinds of messed up condition, but hasn't seen one need new omega springs that fast before. He said lock problems are pretty rare overall, and recurring problems haven't been an issue before, and I believe him. I know that some folks who are much rougher on their knives have had no problems. Definitely an unusual case.

So, they're aware of the situation and I'll leave it up to them to decide if they want to replace it or not. They are picking up shipping both ways this time, which was very nice of them.

edit: I forgot to add, the guy said most of the components in the locks are the same between the less expensive and the more expensive knives. So, my Mini Griptilian should have the same springs as his Kulgera.

I am with Tom, I always keep a Mora in the daypack and carry a Victorinox Farmer for most little knife chores. I like the Farmer because the blade is much heavier than a standard SAK.

I have a Benchmade Griptilian and I like the knife just fine but to me it is not a bush knife, just an EDC piece for light cutting. If I carry a larger folder in the bush it is a Spyderco Paramilitary, I prefer that type lock mechanism, much less likely to break. Cheers!

Yeah, this is my EDC knife. The blade shape is not really suited for wood carving stuff anyway. I usually take a SAK and/or Leatherman, a locking folder and a fixed blade in the field.