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#167004 - 02/12/09 10:22 PM McMurdo Announces New PLBs
Doug_Ritter Offline

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Registered: 01/28/01
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It’s leapfrog time in the PLB business and McMurdo revealed today at Miami International Boat Show their big leap forward, a new FAST FIND range of Personal Locator Beacons. These new PLBs are significantly smaller, lighter and less expensive then the competition with all the bells and whistles we've come to expect. Check out the new FAST FIND PLBs and find out why they may be a game changer:

www.equipped.org/blog/?p=105
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#167008 - 02/12/09 11:24 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
falcon5000 Offline
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Doug I know you've had issues with McMurdo in the past with reliability, what is your opinion of the stuff they are doing now, do you think the quality of there equipment matches ACR or is it still not as reliable in difficult terrain? The ACR equipment is pretty good and reliable stuff, I'm just wondering if McMurdo ever got their act together?
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#167009 - 02/12/09 11:27 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: falcon5000]
Doug_Ritter Offline

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Originally Posted By: falcon5000
Doug I know you've had issues with them in the past with reliability, what is your opinion of the stuff they are doing now, do you think the quality of there equipment matches ACR or is it still not as reliable in difficult terrain? ACR is pretty good stuff..

if you are talking their existing Fastfind Max PLB, it's probably fine, but lacks some of the features I prefer that the ACR has. I currently carry an ACR MincrOFix.

As for the new FAST FINDs, we'll have to see.
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#167010 - 02/12/09 11:39 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
falcon5000 Offline
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Ok thanks Doug, I think sometimes it's worth paying a little more like ACR to get a solid performing device, I know company's work hard to get bugs worked out of earlier failures and sometimes end up with products more superior than others, but I don't think this will be the case with this manufacture, I think Spot has the best chance of getting into this market with a new model that has a user replaceable over the shelf battery, works dual mode with the COSPAS-SARSAT satellite system and 121.5 MHz frequency for free and then have the option to pay if you want for the other services. Plus it would be nice if they incorporate a external power plug in to use solar cells or a vehicle battery if a battery failure or a long rescue attempt is needed due to weather restraints or what have you. I know most of the gear I carry can run 100% off of a 40 watt foldable solar cell with no batteries needed and it's a nice feeling for a back up with solar cells when traveling.
_________________________
Failure is not an option!
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#167011 - 02/12/09 11:44 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: falcon5000]
Doug_Ritter Offline

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I wouldn't hold my breath for a 406 MHz COSPAS-SARSAT compatible SPOT.
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#167013 - 02/12/09 11:52 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
falcon5000 Offline
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I know it will never happen, just some wishful thinking smile
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#167025 - 02/13/09 03:34 AM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: falcon5000]
Jakam
Unregistered


The price of PLB's always made me shy away, this may make it possible for more people to equip with less impact on their wallets. I anxiously await this next generation device.

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#167034 - 02/13/09 11:40 AM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
celler Offline
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Registered: 12/25/03
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Loc: Jupiter, FL
Originally Posted By: Doug_Ritter
I wouldn't hold my breath for a 406 MHz COSPAS-SARSAT compatible SPOT.


I agree with Doug. That does not appear to be SPOT's direction. I had a long conversation with them at the 2009 SHOT Show and it does not seem that they are even moving in the direction of configurable text messages anytime quickly.

I'm sticking with the ACR MicroFix as well.

Craig.

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#167036 - 02/13/09 12:39 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: celler]
Russ Offline
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Registered: 06/02/06
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Perhaps the competition will move ACR Microfix prices lower. Then it's a matter of performance. SPOT would not work for me.
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#167047 - 02/13/09 03:59 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Russ]
7point82 Offline
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Registered: 11/24/05
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Loc: Orange Beach, AL
Game changer is right. I never have carried one when solo backpacking but 5.5 ounces might be light enough for me to make room for one!

Thank you for the information! I haven't been watching PLBs and who knows when I would have seen it elsewhere.
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#167065 - 02/13/09 10:42 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: 7point82]
KenK Offline
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Registered: 06/26/04
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Does anyone know what it costs to replace a battery on an ACR Terrafix?

I have to replace the battery in my PLB by 2012. Somehow I got the impression that the cost of getting a new battery may be high enough to make me at least consider just buying a "next generation" unit.

Ken

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#167067 - 02/13/09 11:01 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: KenK]
Doug_Ritter Offline

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Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 2207
Originally Posted By: KenK
Does anyone know what it costs to replace a battery on an ACR Terrafix?

I have to replace the battery in my PLB by 2012. Somehow I got the impression that the cost of getting a new battery may be high enough to make me at least consider just buying a "next generation" unit.

Ken


Don't have that number, but seriously, I think your supposition is correct. A few more years down the road and they will be even cheaper, as well as lighter and smaller. We are reaching the point where these devices almost become disposable. Plus, bear in mind that the 5 year battery replacement interval is the conservative half life of the battery, per the standards. It's probably perfectly safe to use it after 10 years, certainly after 7-8 years. The batteries in the MicrOFix are essentially composed of modularized CR-123 cells, which we know to have a 10-year life.
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#167133 - 02/15/09 04:24 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
Russ Offline
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Registered: 06/02/06
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Loc: SOCAL
Thanks Doug, if things keep going at work as they seem to be I'll be buying either the new FastFind or the ACR MicrOFix in the next few months. Track record is important so the ACR MicrOFix has an advantage there, but size is definitely on the side of the new FastFind.

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Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
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#167156 - 02/16/09 01:14 AM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
KenK Offline
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Registered: 06/26/04
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Loc: NE Wisconsin
Originally Posted By: Doug_Ritter
It's probably perfectly safe to use it after 10 years, certainly after 7-8 years.


Ahhh that makes sense. The extra few years could make a big difference on exactly what that "next generation" will be when it comes time for me to buy again. Thanks!!

Ken

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#167201 - 02/17/09 05:50 AM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
James_Van_Artsdalen Offline
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Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 449
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Doug_Ritter
The batteries in the MicrOFix are essentially composed of modularized CR-123 cells, which we know to have a 10-year life.

That 10-year rating on most CR-123 cells is to 90% or perhaps 80% charged. As long as the unit isn't stored hot (over 140F) or tested too often 20 years is a reasonable expectation for at least 50% capacity (I'm assuming no parasitic load on the battery).

20 years is probably beyond the design life of the electronics anyway, especially in the RoHS era. And by then there's likely to be a replacement for the existing SARSAT signal protocol: the existing scheme doesn't really support GPS - GPS locating is a hack that only works in some parts of the world - and I expect that eventually someone will upgrade the protocol at some point, perhaps adding some situational information etc in addition to the unit serial number.

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#167206 - 02/17/09 01:59 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: James_Van_Artsdalen]
Doug_Ritter Offline

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Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 2207
Originally Posted By: James_Van_Artsdalen
And by then there's likely to be a replacement for the existing SARSAT signal protocol: the existing scheme doesn't really support GPS - GPS locating is a hack that only works in some parts of the world - and I expect that eventually someone will upgrade the protocol at some point, perhaps adding some situational information etc in addition to the unit serial number.


The existing location protocol does include location information from a GPS, if included in or hooked up to the beacon, it is not limited to the beacon information unless is is not a location protocol beacon, IOW one without any GPS or navigation information capability. While there are likely to be updated protocols in the future offering greater precision in the provided location, it is a subject of intense discussion and research in the SARSAT community right now, I am also not sure I understand your comments about the GPS only working in some parts of the world. It is true that the current protocol cannot transmit the precision that the GPS receiver is capable of due to encoding limitations, but there is no geographic limitation associated with it. Since it is based on a worst case of +/- 4 seconds of a degree, it is variable with the largest possible offset, the 100 meters precision typically quoted, found at the equator, but I know of no other limitations related to geographical location that you imply may exist.
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#167907 - 02/25/09 09:52 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Doug_Ritter]
Russ Offline
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Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
Doug,
Strictly for use in a maritime environment -- eg., an aircraft ditch at sea -- which of the small PLB's would you recommend, the ACR MicroFix™ or the new McMurdo Fast Find (assuming the Fast Find gets FCC approval)? From what you know will one or the other have advantages or disadvantages in terms of performance? Fast Find's size and cost advantage is a given.
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#167909 - 02/25/09 10:38 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Russ]
Doug_Ritter Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 2207
Originally Posted By: Russ
Doug,
Strictly for use in a maritime environment -- eg., an aircraft ditch at sea -- which of the small PLB's would you recommend, the ACR MicroFix™ or the new McMurdo Fast Find (assuming the Fast Find gets FCC approval)? From what you know will one or the other have advantages or disadvantages in terms of performance? Fast Find's size and cost advantage is a given.


As I have not even yet handled the new McMurdo PLB, I can't at this time possibly offer an opinion in this regard.


Edited by Doug_Ritter (02/25/09 10:40 PM)
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#168001 - 02/26/09 05:56 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Russ]
Herbie Offline
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Registered: 03/27/07
Posts: 17
Loc: SoCal

Remember too that if you're anticipating use over/in water, that you'll want one of the floating models. Either the current ResQFix (which I think is just a MicrOFix with the float pouch) or the newly announced ResQFix12 or AquaFix.

My MicrOFix is clearly labeled on the back that it will NOT float by itself. Which is fine for my usage, but not appropriate for marine use.

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#168008 - 02/26/09 06:29 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Herbie]
Russ Offline
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Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
Herbie,
Plan is to have the PLB tethered to the flotation gear I'll be wearing. Will the ResQFix float with the antenna oriented up?
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#168009 - 02/26/09 06:30 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Herbie]
KenK Offline
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Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 2211
Loc: NE Wisconsin
I assume you mean BIG water. In inland waters - maybe excluding very large lakes such as the Great Lakes - I don't need my PLB to float, so long as it is somehow secured.

Still, even in BIG water I'd rather have a non-floating PLB than no PLB at all.

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#168011 - 02/26/09 06:34 PM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: KenK]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
You need it tethered regardless.
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#168069 - 02/27/09 02:06 AM Re: McMurdo Announces New PLBs [Re: Herbie]
Doug_Ritter Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 2207
Originally Posted By: Herbie

Remember too that if you're anticipating use over/in water, that you'll want one of the floating models. Either the current ResQFix (which I think is just a MicrOFix with the float pouch) or the newly announced ResQFix12 or AquaFix.

My MicrOFix is clearly labeled on the back that it will NOT float by itself. Which is fine for my usage, but not appropriate for marine use.


FWIW, I DO NOT consider a buoyant PLB a requirement for overwater or marine use. Even if it floats, it still needs to be tethered to you to prevent loss, so buoyancy gains you little, really. Moreover, in the case of the ResQFix, it means you can no longer operate the beacon one-handed. You have to partially remove the "float coat" in order to deploy the antenna. It's really a bit of half-baked design.
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